3. Advanced Stop Lines & Cycle Boxes.
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Advanced Stop Lines & Cycle Boxes.
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This came up in discussion (I lead an exciting life)

If even the towball of your car proceeds across the stop line when the light is red then it is an offence. (I know the same applies for amber, but with amber you have the unsafe/impossible to stop defence)

does this apply to both lines?

The Highway Code rule 178 states


If your vehicle has proceeded over the first white line at the time that the signal goes red, you should stop as soon as possible and MUST stop at the second white line.


Rule 178 references RTA 1988 Sect 36 & TSRGD Schedule 14 pt1, but I can't find the answer there.

I insisted that if your towball is proceeding over the second line when the light goes red that the offence is complete. (Obviously, if it does clear the first line it might not clear the second)




Out of pedantry, which one is the advanced stop line? (Or are the two together "advanced stop lines")

The first one (for cars) has been advanced against the direction of travel, but the second (usually the original pre-cycle box line) is further forwards, so cyclists stop in an advanced position.  The HC calls them first & second to eliminate confusion.
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Re: Advanced Stop Lines & Cycle Boxes.
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De minimis non curat lex
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Re: Advanced Stop Lines & Cycle Boxes.
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Quote from: facade on October 23, 2024, 09:31:15 am

Out of pedantry, which one is the advanced stop line? (Or are the two together "advanced stop lines")

The first one (for cars) has been advanced against the direction of travel, but the second (usually the original pre-cycle box line) is further forwards, so cyclists stop in an advanced position.  The HC calls them first & second to eliminate confusion.

I can seldom resist a pedantry challenge.

It's called an "advanced stop line". The "advanced" applies to the "line", not the cyclist.

Anyway, since the HC has kindly eliminated confusion, what purpose is served by introducing it?
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Re: Advanced Stop Lines & Cycle Boxes.
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Quote from: andy_foster on October 23, 2024, 03:24:51 pm
De minimis non curat lex

I know they probably wouldn't prosecute over just the towball, but it is possible to clear the first line on amber, and still be half across the second line when red appears- so you should have stopped.


I just wanted confirmation that the Law applies to both lines equally, and you can't cross either on red.

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Re: Advanced Stop Lines & Cycle Boxes.
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Which presumably is why you asked about towballs.
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Re: Advanced Stop Lines & Cycle Boxes.
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While we're on the subject of pedantry, let's then ask:

1. Does it count when you start to cross the line (like in rugby) or when you've fully crossed the line (like in football)? (I know the answer comes back to de minimis, but what the heck).
2. Why do you have a towball on the front of your car?
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Re: Advanced Stop Lines & Cycle Boxes.
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Quote from: The Slithy Tove on October 25, 2024, 08:15:31 am
While we're on the subject of pedantry, let's then ask:

1. Does it count when you start to cross the line (like in rugby) or when you've fully crossed the line (like in football)? (I know the answer comes back to de minimis, but what the heck).
2. Why do you have a towball on the front of your car?

It's very useful in pushing a caravan into a restricted space.  All seasoned caravanners (should) have one fitted
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Re: Advanced Stop Lines & Cycle Boxes.
« Reply #7 on: »
Quote from: The Slithy Tove on October 25, 2024, 08:15:31 am
While we're on the subject of pedantry, let's then ask:

1. Does it count when you start to cross the line (like in rugby) or when you've fully crossed the line (like in football)? (I know the answer comes back to de minimis, but what the heck).
2. Why do you have a towball on the front of your car?
1. The offence is actually to "proceed beyond the stop line". AIUI that occurs when any part of the vehicle fully crosses the line.
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  3. Advanced Stop Lines & Cycle Boxes.