Author Topic: Parkmaven NtK and unsuccessful appeal  (Read 23305 times)

0 Members and 65 Guests are viewing this topic.

Re: Parkmaven NtK and unsuccessful appeal
« Reply #45 on: »
The point about making a complaint to POPLA about a flawed decision is not to get the decision reversed. POPLA will never reverse a decision, even when they admit that the decision was wrong. It is to get them to admit it and have any internal processes applied to get their assessors to re-educated.

Also, by establishing a paper trail which highlights any errors by POPLA, you then have valuable evidence that can be used in future, not just by yourself but people like us who often have to deal with this company in other cases.

The point about being pedantic about whether PoFA has Ben complied with, is that it is poorly written in certain aspects. However, there is one thing that is required, and that is full compliance with all the requirements of PoFA if the creditor wants to be able to transfer liability from the unknown driver to the known Keeper.

So, the example of implied obligation is flawed:


The invitation for the keeper to pay could be seen in the words 'you[the addressee and registered keeper] may pay or appeal'. The NTK also states 'the driver of the motor vehicle is required to pay this parking charge'.

Paragraph 9(2)(e)(i) of PoFA requires that the notice must invite the keeper to pay the unpaid parking charge. While the Act does not require any particular wording or the use of the word "invite" itself, it does require that the keeper be clearly and directly asked to make payment. Simply stating that “you may pay or appeal” is ambiguous and does not amount to a clear invitation for the keeper to pay. That phrasing offers two generic options without clarifying that the keeper, as opposed to the driver, is being asked to settle the charge.

Likewise, stating that the driver is required to pay does not assist in fulfilling the requirement, as it refers to a different party. An implicit obligation or assumption that the keeper understands they are being asked to pay is not enough. The Act requires a positive act of communication inviting the keeper to do so. If that is missing or unclear, the notice fails to comply with paragraph 9(2)(e)(i).

Just as someone cannot be partially or even mostly pregnant, a Notice cannot be partially or even mostly PoFA compliant. It is a binary matter. It either is, or it isn’t.

Whilst this point specifically has not been argued in court, and even if it were, it would not be binding anyway, I have argued it extensively with a district judge and have it on their authority that had it been argued as I have above, it would convince him that the Notice was not fully compliant with the Act.
Never argue with stupid people. They will drag you down to their level and then beat you with experience” - Mark Twain

Re: Parkmaven NtK and unsuccessful appeal
« Reply #46 on: »
And OP, herein we do differ. I refer to the distinction between mandatory and directory, as here:

https://www.cambridge.org/core/journals/legal-studies/article/abs/mandatory-and-directory-rules/70E6CBF84A2FA2E883829D371D2AF805

b789 appears to be of the view that para. 9 is 'mandatory'. I am not.

As DWMB2 observed, we haven't seen the point tested in court in this context and even if it had, it would depend upon the nature of any breach, the judge on the day and how the issue is presented.

As long as you know that you are not embarking upon tried and tested points of law as you progress, then fine. You can set your expectations accordingly.

As observed, more often than not cases are not prosecuted to a hearing even when a court claim has been issued.

They huff and puff, and to be honest so do we. Just so long as you know.

Re: Parkmaven NtK and unsuccessful appeal
« Reply #47 on: »
Paragraph 9 of Schedule 4 to the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012 is mandatory, not merely directory.

Here’s the legal distinction and how it applies:

Mandatory vs Directory – Definitions

• A mandatory requirement must be strictly complied with. Failure to comply means the legal consequence does not follow.
• A directory requirement should ideally be complied with, but a failure to do so might not invalidate the process or outcome.

Why Paragraph 9 is Mandatory

PoFA Schedule 4 sets out a strict statutory scheme that allows a private parking operator to hold a keeper liable only if all the conditions in Paragraph 9 are met.

Paragraph 9(2) opens with:

The notice must

This is mandatory language. The use of “must” signals that each element is a precondition to keeper liability. Courts have consistently interpreted statutory provisions like these as mandatory when they confer a benefit or impose a liability only if certain conditions are satisfied.

If a Notice to Keeper fails to comply with any part of paragraph 9(2)(a) to (i), then the operator cannot rely on PoFA to transfer liability to the keeper. There is no judicial discretion to overlook or “substantially comply” with these elements — it is a strict test.

Conclusion: Paragraph 9 is a mandatory provision. Each requirement must be satisfied in full for the keeper to be held liable. Any failure — even a technical one — invalidates the operator’s right to pursue the keeper under PoFA.
Never argue with stupid people. They will drag you down to their level and then beat you with experience” - Mark Twain

Re: Parkmaven NtK and unsuccessful appeal
« Reply #48 on: »
Quote
They huff and puff, and to be honest so do we.
Sadly we've not quite managed to blow their house down, just yet  ;D

Re: Parkmaven NtK and unsuccessful appeal
« Reply #49 on: »
I, like b789, tend to read "must" as implying mandatory. But I'm not a judge.
Are there cases where judges have upheld NtKs that did not strictly meet PoFA requirements ?


That being said, 9(2)(e) (i) and (ii) go hand-in-hand because they are logically connected.

The notice (...) must (...) invite the keeper
(i)to pay the unpaid parking charges; or
(ii)if the keeper was not the driver of the vehicle, to notify the creditor of the name of the driver and a current address for service for the driver and to pass the notice on to the driver


So NtK must have a (i) OR (ii) alternative to comply with 9(2)(e), not just (i) somewhere in the text and (ii) somewhere else. NtKs need to follow 9(2)(e)wording. (i) and (ii) cannot be separated because there's a logical OR between them

Further, the Boolean opposite of this proposition is (i) and (ii) (non-(i) AND non-(ii)) and this defines non-compliance with 9(2)(e) precisely as worded in 9(2)(f) which introduces the 28-day deadline:
The Notice (...) must (...) warn the keeper that if, after the period of 28 days beginning with the day after that on which the notice is given—
(i)the amount of the unpaid parking charges specified under paragraph (d) has not been paid in full, and
(ii)the creditor does not know both the name of the driver and a current address for service for the driver


So 9(2)(e) and (f) go hand-in-hand as well because they are also logically connected. That's not buy accident; legislators wanted it that way. So repeating the 9(2)(f) wording but not the 9(2)(e) wording, as Parkmaven did, makes no sense...which reinforces the mandatory must.

I hope I'm being clear.

I know judges are not mathematicians but somehow the point needs to be made
See
« Last Edit: May 12, 2025, 04:55:07 pm by kgw »

Re: Parkmaven NtK and unsuccessful appeal
« Reply #50 on: »
I think the significant discussion arising from this is indicative of the fact that there's a fair chance that different judges could reach different conclusions on the point. Regardless of whether or not they should, different judges have a tendency to differ as to how prescriptively they interpret the provisions of PoFA. (Frankly the whole of Schedule 4 is clumsily worded in my view, to the extent that it has caused much needless confusion, but that's another matter)

You've now heard in detail two different views on the matter - I'm not sure your case would be benefitted by an overly protracted further debate rehashing the same points. If you're up for a fight, which it seems like you are, we can see how the case progresses.

Re: Parkmaven NtK and unsuccessful appeal
« Reply #51 on: »
But is there a "warning" in ParkMaven's NtK? In this respect, the factual the notice must "warn" the Keeper, could be interpreted as directory, not mandatory. However, it falls within paragraph 9(2), which means that all those sub-points (a to i) are mandatory.

The Notice 'MUST WARN' the Keeper... but it doesn't. It simply 'advises'. Wecoiuld go on about this forever. For now, it will only be POPLA who have to be persuaded and they are usually fairly thick when it comes to analysing the nuances of PoFA, to the point of absurdity.

If it is ever litigated, the odds of it ever going as far as a hearing in front of a judge are probably less than 1%. If it ever does, then these points could be argued in the Witness Statement.

The only way this could ever be determined, once and for all, is if an appeal is made on these points and even then, it would only be persuasive, not binding unless it went to a higher court.
Never argue with stupid people. They will drag you down to their level and then beat you with experience” - Mark Twain

Re: Parkmaven NtK and unsuccessful appeal
« Reply #52 on: »
For b789:

With respect:

From the Traffic Management Act 2004 General Regs:

Notice to Owner

.l(3) A notice to owner must, in addition to the matters required to be included in it under regulation 3(2) of the 2022 Appeals Regulations, state—


Another statute using the expression 'must state'.

There is case law that 'must state' does not impose a verbatim requirement. If authorities(or in this case a PPC) depart from the wording then they do so at the risk that the alternative might not be substantially compliant. But as long as the same meaning is conveyed and the alternative does not mislead then taking the document as a whole the courts have held that compliance has been achieved.

https://www.londontribunals.gov.uk/sites/default/files/keycases/R%20on%20the%20application%20of%20Hackney%20Drivers%20Association%20Ltd%20v%20The%20Parking%20Adjudiactor%20Lancashire%20County%20Council.pdf

I believe that PoFA is subject to the same analysis.



Re: Parkmaven NtK and unsuccessful appeal
« Reply #53 on: »
The phrase "must state" does not appear in Schedule 4 of the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012 (PoFA). Instead, paragraph 9(2) opens with the phrase "The notice must—" followed by a list of specific requirements at sub-paragraphs (a) to (i).

Several of these sub-paragraphs then use the words "state that" or similar phrasing to describe what the notice must contain. This distinction matters because the legal framework of PoFA is not the same as that under the Traffic Management Act 2004 (TMA).

Under the TMA, local authorities issue penalty charge notices using statutory powers, and courts have accepted substantial compliance with requirements like “must state” so long as the notice is not misleading and conveys the necessary information. However, PoFA operates in a contractual law context.

There is no automatic liability for the keeper; liability can only be transferred if the parking operator strictly complies with each of the requirements listed under paragraph 9(2). PoFA is a statutory gateway, and each condition is a mandatory precondition.

While some flexibility in language may be acceptable—such as using a synonym for “invite”—the meaning must still be clear, and ambiguity or implication is not enough. A notice that merely implies the keeper may pay, without clearly and directly inviting them to do so, does not satisfy paragraph 9(2)(e)(i).

Courts are less tolerant of ambiguity under PoFA because it governs the creation of liability where none previously existed. Therefore, comparisons to statutory law enforcement under the TMA are not applicable, and the threshold for compliance under PoFA remains strict.
Never argue with stupid people. They will drag you down to their level and then beat you with experience” - Mark Twain

Re: Parkmaven NtK and unsuccessful appeal
« Reply #54 on: »

I don't see myself arguing semantics in court, eg that "advising" is different from "warning". If you search "advising vs warning" on the web, there are many hits, indicating to me that if there's a difference it's subtle.

On the other hand, I can see arguing the substantial failures of the NtK in regards to other paragraphs of 9(2).

Imho (e) and (f) are not clumsily worded and I feel pretty comfortable proving non-compliance with (e) (see my earlier posts).

Could I have please have your opinion about NtK compliance with other paragraphs, especially the (b)(c)(d) group and (i) ?



I feel this debate is worthwhile because a lot of threads I see on the "private parking tickets" section of this forum deal with PoFA compliance.


We'll see if there are any next steps but I'd rather not be the guinea pig. FYI, the only reason I started this whole kerkuffle is because I have a mail redirection and received the NtK one day after the end of the "discount" period (as stated on the NtK). This was a carshare deal and I can't charge more than the discounted amount to the driver.
« Last Edit: May 12, 2025, 07:12:05 pm by kgw »

Re: Parkmaven NtK and unsuccessful appeal
« Reply #55 on: »
Got an answer from POPLA. Pretty much as expected and carefully written ... but they don't address the 9(2)(e) non-compliance:

Your complaint about POPLA decision xxxxx

Thank you for your contact outlining the reasons why you are unhappy with the decision that has been reached by the assessor in your appeal. This was passed to me by the POPLA team as I am responsible for investigating complaints.

It is worth pointing out that before submitting an appeal, our website informs appellants that POPLA is a one-stage appeal service and we cannot reconsider your appeal if you disagree with our decision.

Clearly, the crux of your complaint is that you are unhappy with the outcome reached in the assessment of your appeal. I have noted the following points and I will address each one separately below:

You have stated that the assessor has misinterpreted the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012 (PoFA 2012).

I refer to section 9(2)(f) of PoFA 2012, which states that the notice to keeper must: “warn the keeper that if, at the end of the period of 28 days beginning with the day after that on which the notice to keeper is given:
(i)            The amount of the unpaid parking charges has not been paid in full, and
(ii)            The creditor does not know both the name of the driver and a current address for service for the driver,
(iii)         
the creditor will have the right to recover from the keeper so much of the amount that remains unpaid
”.

The notice to keeper states:
[ Guests cannot view attachments ]

The assessor was therefore satisfied that it is compliant.

Although the notice to keeper requests payment within 28 days, this is assuming that the keeper is the driver. For the avoidance of doubt, the purpose of PoFA 2012 is to ensure that liability is transferred to the correct, liable party; requesting payment from the driver within 28 days is not a breach of PoFA 2012. Having reviewed the assessor’s response, I can see that this is clearly explained.

You have stated that the assessor dismissed your claim that the notice to keeper is in breach of the Private Parking Sector Single Code of Practice (the Code).

Within your appeal, you made reference to Section 8.1.2.e of the Code, which states: “that if the recipient appeals within 28 days of receiving the parking charge, the right to pay at the rate applicable when the appeal was made must stand for a further 14 days from the date (subject to 8.1.2d) they receive notification that their appeal has been rejected”.

This section of the Code makes reference to the amount of the charge due when an appeal response is issued. While the notice asks motorists to pay within 28 days from the date of issue, the notice is not in breach of this section. In this case, I can see that you appealed on 13 January 2025, 19 days after the date of issue. In accordance with Section 8.1.2.e of the Code, the amount due should have been £100. However, the operator held the charge at the discounted rate. Please note that this ground of appeal does not affect the validity of the parking charge notice.

You have stated the assessor has incorrectly claimed that the Code only applies to signage until 2026.

I refer to the assessor’s rationale, which explains:
The sector Code of Practice has been jointly created by the British Parking Association (BPA) and the International Parking Community (IPC). It is largely based on the Government’s Private Parking Code of Practice, which was published in February 2022, and subsequently withdrawn in June 2022. The new Code came into force on the 1 October 2024. It is stipulated in the Code that the parking operator needs to comply with all elements relating to signage by 31 December 2026. Therefore, for any aspects of this case relating to signage, I will be referring to version 9 of the BPA Code of Practice. This is applicable for parking events that occurred from 1 February 2024.

I refer to the Code, which states:
[ Guests cannot view attachments ]
The assessor therefore correctly considered the applicable British Parking Association Code of Practice when assessing the adequacy of the signage. Having reviewed the assessor’s rationale, I am satisfied that their assessment of the signage is appropriate based on the available evidence.

You have stated that the assessor failed to uphold POPLA’s own standards regarding operator rebuttals.

It is important to explain that POPLA’s role is solely to assess whether a parking charge notice was issued correctly in the first instance. While the parking operator is responsible for rebutting the appellant’s claims and demonstrating that the charge was issued correctly, it is not within POPLA’s remit to address any shortfalls in its internal appeals procedure.

You are unhappy that the assessor accepted the operator’s landowner contract as evidence of the operator’s authority to issue parking charge notices on the land.

When assessing appeals, POPLA must consider the evidence provided by both parties.

I refer to the assessor’s rationale, which explains:
In this case the operator has provided a witness statement and an enforcement agreement and I am satisfied that the operator has the authority to issue PCN’s on this site. The operator does not need to provide a full copy of the full contract as it may contain commercially sensitive information.

While I note the appellant’s comments, from the information provided from the operator I am satisfied therefore, that the operator had sufficient authority on the date of the contravention.

Furthermore, if authority had since been removed, it is likely that the landowner would remove the signage at the same time. Not many landowners would look on quietly while someone operates on their land without their permission. The evidence provided in relation to this appeal meets the criteria POPLA requires, and therefore I am satisfied that the operator has sufficient authority at the site on the date of the parking event.


In the absence of evidence to suggest otherwise, the assessor could only be satisfied that the operator had the relevant authority at the time.

Overall, having reviewed both the appeal and your complaint, I am satisfied the decision reached is appropriate based on the evidence presented.

In terms of POPLA’s role in the parking industry, I refer to the FAQs section of our website, which explains:
[ Guests cannot view attachments ]

In closing, I am sorry that your experience of using our service has not been positive. However, POPLA’s involvement in your appeal has now ended and this response concludes our complaints process. It will not be appropriate for us to correspond further on this matter and all further correspondence will be noted on your case, but not responded to.

You are of course, free to pursue this matter further through other means, such as the Courts. For independent advice, you may wish to contact Citizens Advice at: www.citizensadvice.org.uk or call 0345 404 05 06 (English) or 0345 404 0505 (Welsh).

[ Guests cannot view attachments ]
« Last Edit: May 21, 2025, 07:27:48 pm by kgw »

Re: Parkmaven NtK and unsuccessful appeal
« Reply #56 on: »
Just goes to show how useless and incestuously involved with the very companies they are supposed to adjudicate on. I wouldn't worry. A POPLA decision is not binding on the appellant and has absolutely no bearing on anything going forward.
Never argue with stupid people. They will drag you down to their level and then beat you with experience” - Mark Twain

Re: Parkmaven NtK and unsuccessful appeal
« Reply #57 on: »
FYI, Parkmaven have sent a payment reminder
[ Guests cannot view attachments ]

[ Guests cannot view attachments ]

Re: Parkmaven NtK and unsuccessful appeal
« Reply #58 on: »
So what?

You ignore all reminders and subsequent debt recovery letters. Debt collectors are powerless to do anything except to try and persuade the low-hanging fruit on the gullible tree to pay up out of ignorance and fear.

Come back when you receive a Letter of Claim (LoC).
Never argue with stupid people. They will drag you down to their level and then beat you with experience” - Mark Twain

Re: Parkmaven NtK and unsuccessful appeal
« Reply #59 on: »
As expected, here's the first debt recovery letter.
They call themselves bailiffs but there's a note at the bottom that says "this case is not subject to High Court or bailiff action"

No LOC yet.

[ Guests cannot view attachments ]
« Last Edit: July 28, 2025, 12:41:11 pm by kgw »