Author Topic: APCOA,Parking on Yellow or Hatched lines, Northwick Park Hospital  (Read 2174 times)

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Re: APCOA,Parking on Yellow or Hatched lines, Northwick Park Hospital
« Reply #15 on: »
If the driver hasn't been identified then APCOA would seem to have unwittingly given you as the keeper a potential lifeline, as they would seem not to have complied with Schedule 4 of the Protection of Freedoms Act (there's a link in my signature at the bottom of each page), and are therefore unable to recover the charge from you as the keeper.

You could therefore appeal as the keeper, along the lines of the below:

Dear Sirs,

I have received your Parking Charge Notice (Ref: ______) for vehicle registration mark _______, in which you allege that the driver has incurred a parking charge. I note from your correspondence that you are not seeking to hold me liable as the registered keeper, under Schedule 4 of the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012. There is no obligation for me to name the driver and I will not be doing so. I am therefore unable to help you further with this matter, and look forward to your confirmation that the charge has been cancelled. If you choose to decline this appeal, you must issue a POPLA code.

Yours,

Re: APCOA,Parking on Yellow or Hatched lines, Northwick Park Hospital
« Reply #16 on: »
If the driver hasn't been identified then APCOA would seem to have unwittingly given you as the keeper a potential lifeline, as they would seem not to have complied with Schedule 4 of the Protection of Freedoms Act (there's a link in my signature at the bottom of each page), and are therefore unable to recover the charge from you as the keeper.

You could therefore appeal as the keeper, along the lines of the below:

Dear Sirs,

I have received your Parking Charge Notice (Ref: ______) for vehicle registration mark _______, in which you allege that the driver has incurred a parking charge. I note from your correspondence that you are not seeking to hold me liable as the registered keeper, under Schedule 4 of the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012. There is no obligation for me to name the driver and I will not be doing so. I am therefore unable to help you further with this matter, and look forward to your confirmation that the charge has been cancelled. If you choose to decline this appeal, you must issue a POPLA code.

Yours,

Many thanks Sir, highly appreciated your draft. I will send this appeal by this evening.


I tried to list below all events in the chronological order related to this PCN. And have collated all documents / letters within one zip file attached.

07-Sept : PCN affixed on the windscreen of the vehicle with an option to pay £30 (reduced charge) or dispute by making an appeal within 28 days
21-Sept : Representation made by the patient in the vehicle (my mother in this case)
03-Oct : Rejection letter for the representation sent to the Representor (my mother in this case) highlighting appeal can be made to POPLA within 28 days
31-Oct : Appeal to POPLA date expired
03-Nov : Notice to the registered keeper of the vehicle issued (in my name) with an option to dispute within 28 days or pay £60.
01-Dec (future) : Date of expiry to dispute the PCN


Many thanks.
« Last Edit: December 28, 2023, 09:41:05 am by DWMB2 »

Re: APCOA,Parking on Yellow or Hatched lines, Northwick Park Hospital
« Reply #17 on: »
If the driver hasn't been identified then APCOA would seem to have unwittingly given you as the keeper a potential lifeline, as they would seem not to have complied with Schedule 4 of the Protection of Freedoms Act (there's a link in my signature at the bottom of each page), and are therefore unable to recover the charge from you as the keeper.

You could therefore appeal as the keeper, along the lines of the below:

Dear Sirs,

I have received your Parking Charge Notice (Ref: ______) for vehicle registration mark _______, in which you allege that the driver has incurred a parking charge. I note from your correspondence that you are not seeking to hold me liable as the registered keeper, under Schedule 4 of the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012. There is no obligation for me to name the driver and I will not be doing so. I am therefore unable to help you further with this matter, and look forward to your confirmation that the charge has been cancelled. If you choose to decline this appeal, you must issue a POPLA code.

Yours,


Posted online.

Many thanks for your help and support thus far.

Re: APCOA,Parking on Yellow or Hatched lines, Northwick Park Hospital
« Reply #18 on: »
Let us know when they reply (and what with). Keep an eye on your spam emails, and if they don't reply in the time allowed, chase them up.

Re: APCOA,Parking on Yellow or Hatched lines, Northwick Park Hospital
« Reply #19 on: »
Let us know when they reply (and what with). Keep an eye on your spam emails, and if they don't reply in the time allowed, chase them up.

We are yet to receive response from the APCOA, it's been 3 weeks since 23-Nov and still counting.
We regularly checking emails (incl SPAM) and posts and will keep doing so.

The latest status available online (https://pcnpayments.apcoa.co.uk/pcnonline/step2.php), as below :

"This Charge Notice has now been passed to an Enforcement Agent and therefore payment cannot be accepted on this website. Payment must be made directly to the Enforcement Agent and you must refer to any correspondance you have received from them on how payment can be made."


Though the system generated response on 23-Nov upon submission of Appeal :

Dear xxxxx,
Thank you for submitting your challenge/appeal to PCN/ECN reference: NP80008661. A copy of your submission is attached for your records.

Your case will be placed on hold and will not progress in accordance with our procedure.

If you have challenged your notice within 14 days from the date of the notice, the case will not increase in cost whilst it is on hold.

PLEASE DO NOT MAKE PAYMENT WHILST YOUR CASE IS UNDER REVIEW.
Your appeal will be considered and a response sent to you via email within 35 days from submission date. Duplicate submission of emails or appeals may result in delay in responding to your appeal.


Yours sincerely"


Regards

Re: APCOA,Parking on Yellow or Hatched lines, Northwick Park Hospital
« Reply #20 on: »
Let us know when they reply (and what with). Keep an eye on your spam emails, and if they don't reply in the time allowed, chase them up.

Attached the DEBT management letter we received in the name of the passenger and not the driver.

APCOA didn't issue the new POPLA code as requested by us.

What would be our next course of action ?

Many thanks for your help in advance.
« Last Edit: December 27, 2023, 05:27:10 pm by DWMB2 »

Re: APCOA,Parking on Yellow or Hatched lines, Northwick Park Hospital
« Reply #21 on: »
IMO, this thread is more complex than it might appear on the surface.

OP, going back to the start, an appeal was submitted against a NTD served on the vehicle and subsequently rejected. The rejection states that unless payment is made or an appeal lodged with POPLA, APCOA reserve the right to implement debt recovery procedures.

Subsequently a Notice to Keeper was issued under PoFA. A NTK is not 'debt recovery'.

This is procedural nonsense.

PoFA can only be engaged if the creditor does NOT know the driver's details.
If the initial 'appeal' against the NTD gave the driver's details (whether by accident or design) then there was no power to issue a NTK. And if the appeal didn't reveal the driver, then APCOA could only pursue the charge from the keeper after issuing a NTK...but the 'debt management letter is address to the OP's mother!!

OP, can we please see the original appeal sent in Sept. (you say this was posted by your mother who was the passenger and patient. Subsequently, you posted that the NTK was addressed to you)

And forget about the contravention, we need to sort out who's who and what procedures have and have not been followed.

And pl stop referring to 'we' and 'our', notices and letters are addressed to individuals so 'the passenger', 'the driver', the 'keeper' pl.
« Last Edit: December 26, 2023, 03:52:23 pm by DWMB2 »

Re: APCOA,Parking on Yellow or Hatched lines, Northwick Park Hospital
« Reply #22 on: »
They appear to have passed it onto debt collectors before the 35 days they give themselves to respond is up.

I doubt it makes any difference though it does suggest the £70 they appear to have added is premature.
« Last Edit: December 24, 2023, 11:11:13 am by slapdash »

Re: APCOA,Parking on Yellow or Hatched lines, Northwick Park Hospital
« Reply #23 on: »

My issue in part is what's 'it' and why the OP's mother who doesn't feature in the process after a NTK has been issued.

Re: APCOA,Parking on Yellow or Hatched lines, Northwick Park Hospital
« Reply #24 on: »
Dear Forum members

To bring transparency and clarity, listed below all events in the chronological order related to this APCOA PCN. All relevant letters, in chronological order, can be found within one zip file attached.

The passenger – Patient, the elderly Lady
Registered keeper – data from DVLA record

07-Sept-23 : PCN affixed on the windscreen of the vehicle with an option to pay £30 (reduced charge) or dispute by making an appeal within 28 days i.e. 05-Oct-23(?). Full charge is £60.
21-Sept-23 : The Patient (elderly lady), passenger in the vehicle submitted the representation (attached separately again)
03-Oct-23 : Representation rejected, communication sent to the Representor (The Patient) with an option to pay reduced charge of £30 in 14 days i.e. 17-Oct-23 (?) or full charge of £60 after 14 days OR appeal to POPLA within 28 days i.e. 31-Oct-23 (?). Full charge payable if appealed to POPLA. If do nothing, recover monies via debt recovery and proceed with Court action
03-Nov-23 : Notice to Keeper (NTK) of the vehicle issued to RK (registered keeper) in hard copy with an option to dispute within 28 days i.e. 30-Nov-23 (?) or pay £60.
23-Nov-23 : RK submitted disputed charge via online
23-Nov-23 : APCOA confirmed receipt of appeal with response within 35days i.e. 27-Dec-23 (?)
14-Dec-23 : Debt Recovery Plus notice issued in the name of the Patient for £130 (including an unexplained additional charge of £70) with an option to pay in full or in 4 installments by 28-Dec-23 OR go legal to court.
25-Dec-23 : No correspondence received from APCOA yet by RK against the appeal submitted on 23-Nov-23 by RK

Happy to add details where required.

Many thanks.
« Last Edit: December 28, 2023, 09:41:23 am by DWMB2 »

Re: APCOA,Parking on Yellow or Hatched lines, Northwick Park Hospital
« Reply #25 on: »
AMS and H C Andersen, please see the direct messages I've sent you.

Happy New Year!

Re: APCOA,Parking on Yellow or Hatched lines, Northwick Park Hospital
« Reply #26 on: »
PCN cancelled!
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