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Messages - Snowynight

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1
Hi @b789, could you please advise how I should respond? Thanks very much.


Hi,

Finally received a response yesterday from noreply@moorsidelegal.co.uk below, and the original PCN with some photos and the appeal were also attached in the email. What can we do next?

"
 We write in relation to the above matter.
 
 Moorside Legal acts on behalf of Alliance Parking as an external debt recovery agent for legal action. Communication between Moorside Legal and Alliance Parking typically relates to case progression, operational instructions, and status updates. These exchanges concern the management of the Parking Charge Notice (PCN) from a business‑to‑business standpoint.
 
 Because this communication does not contain your personal data nor does it identify you directly or indirectly, it does not fall within the scope of personal data as defined under the UK GDPR.
 
 Under the UK GDPR, organisations are required to disclose personal data, not operational records or internal communications. Any correspondence between Moorside Legal and Alliance Parking that relates purely to process, case management, or administrative instructions is considered business information, not personal data.
 
 As required under Article 15 of the UK GDPR and in line with ICO guidance, the purposes for which we process your personal data are to manage and enforce parking terms and conditions. The categories of personal data we hold include vehicle registration details, keeper details obtained from the DVLA, and correspondence history.
 
 Please be advised that the help@moorsidelegal.co.uk mailbox is not monitored. Accordingly, we advise that you register on our Customer Portal using the link below:
 🔗 https://portal.moorsidelegal.co.uk
 Should you choose not to utilise the Portal, please direct all future correspondence to dpo@apn.co.uk.
 
 Our Privacy Policy outlines where we collect personal data from and the lawful basis on which we may process it. You can read more about how and why we hold and process your personal data via the following link:  https://moorsidelegal.co.uk/privacy-policy/
 
 If you need any assistance, feel free to contact us on 0330 822 9950.
 
 Please see the attached PCN, which was correctly issued in accordance with Schedule 4 of the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012. This legislation allows us to hold the registered keeper liable for the full outstanding balance if driver details are not provided.
 
 To view the supporting photographic evidence, kindly visit the link below and quote reference ******:
 🔗  https://www.pay-my-pcn.co.uk/live-3sc-user/
 
 By entering and parking the vehicle on our client's private land, you agreed to enter into a contract with our client and to be bound by the terms and conditions of that contract. The terms and conditions were clearly displayed in prominent places within the car park. Due to your failure to comply with the terms and conditions, our client has issued the PCN therefore if we are instructed to issue a claim the reason would be for Unpaid parking charges/breach of contract.
 
 You have already made representation to our client, who have responded accordingly. We cannot overturn their decision.
 
 In our client’s letter notifying you of the rejection of your appeal, you were advised of the option to escalate the matter to an Independent Adjudication Service administered by our client’s Accredited Trade Association. As your appeal was also rejected at that stage, we must inform you that all avenues of appeal have now been exhausted.
 
 Considering the evidence, we are satisfied that the PCN has been issued in line with industry standards and is compliant with the International Parking Community’s (IPC) code of practice. The signage of the car park also complies with the International Parking Community’s Code of Practice.
 
 Please be advised that the original amount of the PCN was £100.00. As outlined in the notice, a reduced amount of £60.00 would have been accepted as full and final settlement if payment had been received within 14 days from the date of issue. Unfortunately, as no payment was received within that time frame, the opportunity to pay the reduced amount has now expired. As a result of continued non-payment and additional charges, the balance has increased and now stands at £170.00.
 
 The additional charge which has been levied on your Parking Charge of £70 is the amount set out in both the British Parking Association and International Parking Community Codes of Practice as the amount which may be added to a Parking Charge when a Parking Charge remains unpaid and when further recovery is required. Our client is a member of the International Parking Community which is a government approved Accredited Trade Association (ATA) for Private Parking. Our client adheres to the ATA’s Code of Practice. The £70 does not represent the cost of recovery but is a reasonable amount in relation to the Parking Charge amount, in order to encourage early payment of the Parking Charge without the need for debt recovery. It is a fair amount set by our client’s government-approved Accredited Trade Association Code of Practice. There are however also costs incurred by our client in relation to debt recovery services.
 
 It is unclear why you would need to inspect any agreement between our client and the landowner as you are not party to that agreement, nor could it aid your dispute or any potential defence.
 
 
 Please note that we will not be addressing any further correspondence related to disputes of the same nature, as we have already provided you with a response. However, should you wish to raise a new dispute, we will investigate the matter further and respond accordingly.
 
 We ask that you make the full payment of £170.00 within 7 days of receipt of this email.
 
 
 You can make payment in the following ways: 
 • Contact us on 0330 822 9950 (our opening times are Monday- Friday 9:00- 17:00);
 • portal.moorsidelegal.co.uk - Login to our portal
 • https://pay.moorside.legal - Quick Pay
 
 
 If you fail to respond or make payment, we may be instructed by our client to issue legal proceedings against you. This will incur further costs and fees that will be added to the outstanding balance. You may wish to seek independent legal advice. 
 "
 ======

They claimed "The terms and conditions were clearly displayed in prominent places within the car park" - but again as I appealed before it is not true:

There is no entrance sign. And the only sign that appears to relate to the car park is tiny and practically hidden, not placed in close proximity (but about 25 feet away from the parking spaces), i.e., the tiny one on the building behind the trees and green space, not obvious at all. The font size is too small to be able to signify it relates to the car park. So motorists cannot be expected to read a sign that they did not see because of its distance from the car park and because it is obscured by a tree which had a lot more leaves on it when the PCN was issued compared to the picture they showed as evidence (there is only one taken by them in winter 2019 when tree leaves already fell off).

2
Hi,   

Finally received a response yesterday from noreply@moorsidelegal.co.uk below, and the original PCN with some photos and the appeal were also attached in the email. What can we do next?

"
   We write in relation to the above matter.
   
   Moorside Legal acts on behalf of Alliance Parking as an external debt recovery agent for legal action. Communication between Moorside Legal and Alliance Parking typically relates to case progression, operational instructions, and status updates. These exchanges concern the management of the Parking Charge Notice (PCN) from a business‑to‑business standpoint.
   
   Because this communication does not contain your personal data nor does it identify you directly or indirectly, it does not fall within the scope of personal data as defined under the UK GDPR.
   
   Under the UK GDPR, organisations are required to disclose personal data, not operational records or internal communications. Any correspondence between Moorside Legal and Alliance Parking that relates purely to process, case management, or administrative instructions is considered business information, not personal data.
   
   As required under Article 15 of the UK GDPR and in line with ICO guidance, the purposes for which we process your personal data are to manage and enforce parking terms and conditions. The categories of personal data we hold include vehicle registration details, keeper details obtained from the DVLA, and correspondence history.
   
   Please be advised that the help@moorsidelegal.co.uk mailbox is not monitored. Accordingly, we advise that you register on our Customer Portal using the link below:
   🔗 https://portal.moorsidelegal.co.uk
   Should you choose not to utilise the Portal, please direct all future correspondence to dpo@apn.co.uk.
   
   Our Privacy Policy outlines where we collect personal data from and the lawful basis on which we may process it. You can read more about how and why we hold and process your personal data via the following link:   https://moorsidelegal.co.uk/privacy-policy/
   
   If you need any assistance, feel free to contact us on 0330 822 9950.
   
   Please see the attached PCN, which was correctly issued in accordance with Schedule 4 of the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012. This legislation allows us to hold the registered keeper liable for the full outstanding balance if driver details are not provided.
   
   To view the supporting photographic evidence, kindly visit the link below and quote reference ******:
   🔗  https://www.pay-my-pcn.co.uk/live-3sc-user/
   
   By entering and parking the vehicle on our client's private land, you agreed to enter into a contract with our client and to be bound by the terms and conditions of that contract. The terms and conditions were clearly displayed in prominent places within the car park. Due to your failure to comply with the terms and conditions, our client has issued the PCN therefore if we are instructed to issue a claim the reason would be for Unpaid parking charges/breach of contract.
   
   You have already made representation to our client, who have responded accordingly. We cannot overturn their decision.
   
   In our client’s letter notifying you of the rejection of your appeal, you were advised of the option to escalate the matter to an Independent Adjudication Service administered by our client’s Accredited Trade Association. As your appeal was also rejected at that stage, we must inform you that all avenues of appeal have now been exhausted.
   
   Considering the evidence, we are satisfied that the PCN has been issued in line with industry standards and is compliant with the International Parking Community’s (IPC) code of practice. The signage of the car park also complies with the International Parking Community’s Code of Practice.
   
   Please be advised that the original amount of the PCN was £100.00. As outlined in the notice, a reduced amount of £60.00 would have been accepted as full and final settlement if payment had been received within 14 days from the date of issue. Unfortunately, as no payment was received within that time frame, the opportunity to pay the reduced amount has now expired. As a result of continued non-payment and additional charges, the balance has increased and now stands at £170.00.
   
   The additional charge which has been levied on your Parking Charge of £70 is the amount set out in both the British Parking Association and International Parking Community Codes of Practice as the amount which may be added to a Parking Charge when a Parking Charge remains unpaid and when further recovery is required. Our client is a member of the International Parking Community which is a government approved Accredited Trade Association (ATA) for Private Parking. Our client adheres to the ATA’s Code of Practice. The £70 does not represent the cost of recovery but is a reasonable amount in relation to the Parking Charge amount, in order to encourage early payment of the Parking Charge without the need for debt recovery. It is a fair amount set by our client’s government-approved Accredited Trade Association Code of Practice. There are however also costs incurred by our client in relation to debt recovery services.
   
   It is unclear why you would need to inspect any agreement between our client and the landowner as you are not party to that agreement, nor could it aid your dispute or any potential defence.
   
   
   Please note that we will not be addressing any further correspondence related to disputes of the same nature, as we have already provided you with a response. However, should you wish to raise a new dispute, we will investigate the matter further and respond accordingly.
    
   We ask that you make the full payment of £170.00 within 7 days of receipt of this email.
   
   
   You can make payment in the following ways: 
      • Contact us on 0330 822 9950 (our opening times are Monday- Friday 9:00- 17:00);
      • portal.moorsidelegal.co.uk - Login to our portal
      • https://pay.moorside.legal - Quick Pay
   
   
   If you fail to respond or make payment, we may be instructed by our client to issue legal proceedings against you. This will incur further costs and fees that will be added to the outstanding balance. You may wish to seek independent legal advice. 
   "
   ======

They claimed "The terms and conditions were clearly displayed in prominent places within the car park" - but again as I appealed before it is not true:

There is no entrance sign. And the only sign that appears to relate to the car park is tiny and practically hidden, not placed in close proximity (but about 25 feet away from the parking spaces), i.e., the tiny one on the building behind the trees and green space, not obvious at all. The font size is too small to be able to signify it relates to the car park. So motorists cannot be expected to read a sign that they did not see because of its distance from the car park and because it is obscured by a tree which had a lot more leaves on it when the PCN was issued compared to the picture they showed as evidence (there is only one taken by them in winter 2019 when tree leaves already fell off).

3
I went on the ICO website Live chat for complaints and expressed concerns that the DPO email link at Moorside legal is not being monitored.  Not sure what action will be taken.
Also sent a recorded delivery letter to Moorsides registered address in Oldham..don't expect anything in return but its something that can be presented in court.

Hi @Maximum Bob, did you get any response at all?

4
It's been over a week since I sent complaints to Moorside, SRA, CMA, ICO (via online form) but I haven't heard anything back yet (apart from an auto response).
What shall I do next? Should I send a letter by post to Moorside at all? Thanks

5
Yes, issue complaints to everyone on the list. If no one bothers to alert these organisations/authorities to the abuse of process by these firms, then nothing is ever going to happen.

Sure, I will do.
My other question was: should I include attachments (screenshots, extracts, etc) or just say "I can provide..." (as per your earlier Reply #17) and provide them only upon request?

6
For now, just resend (reply) the rejected LoC response mail with the following before the original text:

Quote
“On [date] I sent an Article 15 subject access request to help@moorsidelegal.co.uk using the exact subject line specified in Moorside Legal’s own privacy notice, ‘Data Subject Rights – [My Name]’. Within minutes I received a stock email stating ‘this mailbox is not monitored’ and directing me to their portal. This shows that the only published DPO/contact email is configured to auto-reply that it is ‘not monitored’, and that consumers attempting to use the route specified in the privacy notice are immediately told it is not available.”

THat should not receive any "bounce" message response, and will therefore have been "served" on them.

Thanks. I replied to the auto-response mail and didn't receive any bounce email. 
 
Now should I send complaints to: 
ICO
SRA
CMA
apn.co.uk?

and could I please clarify if attachments are needed?

Before I send the complaint emails, could I please clarify:

I noticed a change in Reply #17:
"I can provide:
- Screenshots or extracts from Moorside Legal’s Privacy Notice showing help@moorsidelegal.co.uk as the contact and DPO email.
- A copy of their Letter of Claim.
- My emails to help@moorsidelegal.co.uk, including one with the exact “Data Subject Rights – [Name]” subject.
- Moorside Legal’s “mailbox not monitored, use the portal” reply."

and only SRA and CMA are listed.

compared to Reply #11:
"I attach..." with the files attached.


So should I attach files this time or?

And do I still send complaints to ICO and apn.co.uk as per Reply #11?


7
Thanks! As expected I received an auto-response with the modified subject line.

Before I send the complaint emails, could I please clarify:

I noticed a change in Reply #17:
"I can provide:
- Screenshots or extracts from Moorside Legal’s Privacy Notice showing help@moorsidelegal.co.uk as the contact and DPO email.
- A copy of their Letter of Claim.
- My emails to help@moorsidelegal.co.uk, including one with the exact “Data Subject Rights – [Name]” subject.
- Moorside Legal’s “mailbox not monitored, use the portal” reply."

and only SRA and CMA are listed.

compared to Reply #11:
"I attach..." with the files attached.


So should I attach files this time or?

And do I still send complaints to ICO and apn.co.uk as per Reply #11?

8
Thanks so much for all replies!

Ok, I'll try to send emails to help@moorsidelegal.co.uk with the subject you suggested and see what comes back.
And should I still send other complaint emails also?

9
Given the auto response, I think it’s unlikely for them to reply to my email. What should I do? Do I have to use the portal?

10
Yes, that’s what I used :(

11
Thanks.
I sent the email but only got an auto reply below that the email address is not monitored. It seems they force people to use their portal.  Is there another email?

“Thank you for contacting Moorside Legal.

Please be advised that this mailbox is not monitored. We request that you access our online portal at https://portal.moorsidelegal.co.uk and follow the instructions provided to submit your enquiry.

Alternatively, you may contact us by telephone on 0330 822 9950 between the hours of 9:00am and 5:30pm, Monday to Friday.


Third parties
If you are contacting us on behalf of someone else, we will need their authority before we can speak with you. They can provide us with this authority by calling us on 0330 822 9950 or by writing to us confirming their full name, address, reference number, your full name, and that they consent to us sharing their personal data with you.

Alternative contact
For immediate payment, please visit https://portal.moorsidelegal.co.uk

If a claim has been issued
Please note that if a County Court Claim has been issued against you, sending an email or a portal request will not suspend or delay the proceedings. You must comply with any instructions issued by the Court to avoid a Judgment being entered against you. You may also wish to obtain independent legal or debt advice.

Yours sincerely
Moorside Legal

0330 822 9950
moorsidelegal.co.uk”

12
Thanks again @b789.

In their letter (see image - https://ibb.co/93YHQt2z), there's actually no mention of a "contract", just "unpaid invoice". So should we tweak our email accordingly? Thanks 

13
Thanks very much for your replies @jfollows @b789.

Apologies - I tried to insert an image with its link but it didn't seem to display. So I added the link - https://ibb.co/93YHQt2z.

They don't seem to have an email address on their website. There's another post referencing help@moorsidelegal.co.uk. Is it the one to use?

14
After nearly 3 years, I (the registered keeper) received a Letter Before Claim from a solicitor "Moorside Legal" for a parking fine/invoice by Parking Control Management UK Ltd. See attached. 

 

Image link - https://ibb.co/93YHQt2z (Sorry, can't seem to display it as embedded here)

There is no detail about the case at all in the letter, and I don’t seem to find an email address from their website. I checked my notes and think it was at High Path Estate - SW19, the small car park on the south portion of Hayward Close (right next to the outdoor gym). I think the landowner is Housing Association. 

We appealed before, mainly on the ground - breach of the IPC Code of Practice Schedule 1 . 

"Signs should, where practicable, be placed at the entrance to a Car Park. Otherwise the signage within the Car Park must be such as to be obvious to the Motorist. " 
π
There is no entrance sign. And the only sign that appears to relate to the car park is tiny and practically hidden, not placed in close proximity (but about 25 feet away from the parking spaces), i.e., the tiny one on the building behind the trees and green space, not obvious at all. The font size is too small to be able to signify it relates to the car park. So motorists cannot be expected to read a sign that they did not see because of its distance from the car park and because it is obscured by a tree which had a lot more leaves on it when the PCN was issued compared to the picture they showed as evidence (there is only one taken by them in winter 2019 when tree leaves already fell off). 

Could you please kindly suggest our options?

15
Good point! I'll update it.

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