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Private parking tickets / Re: Elite parking pcn
« on: Yesterday at 06:08:21 pm »
any ideas guys? have I got a chance to cancel it or shall I pay it?
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How will BG handle a parking ticket if it gets sent to them?
Before we get into appeals, I note this is a British Gas van - who is the registered keeper of the vehicle, British Gas? I ask, as this may affect the approach to appeals.can I challenge the fast that the pictyure only shows my van parked up without the sign and therefore there is no contraventionIf you do, they'll probably refer you to one of the other pictures taken at the time, showing the vehicle parked directly next to the sign:
[img width=600.0000610351562 height=800.0000610351562]https://i.ibb.co/Z1hD1PPD/YUl3a-HFu-T2xn-VUsybit-LTDV2-Vk-Zh-VVp6-NG4w-Vk-Vrc-Glz-TSt-FNDl-Jc-Wgr-RDJDZE45c-TRRYm-VOZnh-OVj-VFOj.jpg[/img]
A far stronger challenge would seem to be that the ticket was issued for "parked in a Contractor / Visitor Bay without a valid permit", but the terms on the signage do not require a permit to be displayed. Do you have (or can you acquire) evidence to demonstrate that the driver was working as a contractor at that site?
Here's a better image of the signage in case we need it for the future;
[img width=600.0000610351562 height=800.0000610351562]https://i.ibb.co/C3hvQ4p2/Qzgrbj-J6a-Xpvb-FVBZDVr-K1-U5-RUl5-UFl-KSHl-Kd0t-Db-C9-HTlp-Kem83a1d-Td1-FPNktl-VEl6b-FVkc1h-DQk-VOOjo3-MT.jpg[/img]
And my question about the sign?If you asking about the number of secure A space signs there are 3 identical ones, one next to each pair of bays and one in middle of the garages.QuoteIs the Secure A Space sign you showed us a photo of previously the only one there?
The space isn't allocated to me specifically, it is available to all residents on the basis of first come, all together there 4 spacesThe same broad point applies, ensure you have and retain the bit of your lease that grants you the right to park a car in any of those 4 spaces, and any other written evidence of such a right.
Is the Secure A Space sign you showed us a photo of previously the only one there?come on guys this is ridiculous!!We agree, which is why we're trying to ensure you place yourself in the best position to challenge it.
If they're continuing to dish out PCNs, you'd be wise to do a bit of digging with the landlord/whoever owns the building and property to find out exactly what's gone on to result in them now operating on the site, and to see if the landowner can intervene.
A court claim is likely to eventually arise, and whilst you might have the makings of a good defence, it would in my view still be sensible to take steps to limit the value of the eventual claim, as there's never a 100% guarantee of success. Far better to defend a claim of £300 than £3,000.
Finally, I would ensure you have and retain copies of any evidence that shows that the space your car was parked in is allocated to you in your lease (Any maps for example outlining the boundaries of the space(s), or anything else that demonstrates that space is yours to use, etc.)
Re your questions, you can only appeal a charge to POPLA once that specific charge has been appealed and rejected by the operator.
Re BPA complaint, yes by all means, but again they will first expect you to complain to the operator.
You don't have to do anything unless you receive a Letter of Claim (LoC). I don't think that reporting them to the police will result in anything. Just make sure that you keep any other residents in the same situation informed as to how to dal with this.
Who are “they” and what did they send you?
Anything from Debt Recovery Plus should be ignored. Debt collectors are irrelevant and you should never contact them.
From the lease you've shown us, "Premises" is capitalised, suggesting it's a defined term. Is the meaning of "Premises" listed anywhere in the lease, as this might strengthen your argument further by showing that the parking space forms part of your lease?
Quotethe lease says we are all allowed to use the parking spaces as long as we park within marked bays.Can you please share with us the exact wording of this clause within your lease? It will potentially be a very useful argument in your favour.
As above, what does your lease say about parking. What it does not say is equally important.As I said in previous post, the bays are to be used by any resident first come first served, I asked one of the director who said secure a space contract had expired and they haven't renewed, he also denied any knowledge of PCS or any parking permit existence.
However, this is an easy one to deal with… as long as the unknown drivers identity is not revealed. There is no legal obligation on the known keeper (the recipient of the Notice to Keeper (NtK)) to reveal the identity of the unknown driver and no inference or assumptions can be made.
The NtK is not compliant with all the requirements of PoFA which means that if the unknown driver is not identified, they cannot transfer liability for the charge from the unknown driver to the known keeper.
Use the following as your appeal. No need to embellish or remove anything from it:QuoteI am the keeper of the vehicle and I dispute your 'parking charge'. I deny any liability or contractual agreement and I will be making a complaint about your predatory conduct to your client landowner.
As your Notice to Keeper (NtK) does not fully comply with ALL the requirements of PoFA 2012, paragraph 9(2)(a) in particular, you are unable to hold the keeper of the vehicle liable for the charge. Partial or even substantial compliance is not sufficient. There will be no admission as to who was driving and no inference or assumptions can be drawn. PCS has relied on contract law allegations of breach against the driver only.
The registered keeper cannot be presumed or inferred to have been the driver, nor pursued under some twisted interpretation of the law of agency. Your NtK can only hold the driver liable. PCS have no hope at POPLA, so you are urged to save us both a complete waste of time and cancel the PCN.
Comeback when the appeal is rejected.
Firstly, you say that it was claimed you were parked “in a bay behind my building”. So I guess you own or rent property, and will have some kind of lease or tenancy agreement describing the property and its parking spaces. What does it say - or not say - about parking spaces and is the space you were alleged to have parked in covered by this?
Secondly, do not identify the driver. See https://www.ftla.uk/private-parking-tickets/read-this-first-private-parking-charges-forum-guide/
Thirdly, following on from the second point, if the parking space is not covered by a lease or similar, the PCN from PCS does not comply with the legislation (https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2012/9/schedule/4) to hold the registered keeper liable. In particular, no “period of parking” is specified, and the vague statement about this is not good enough.