3. Presumption that devices are operating correctly to be repealed
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cp8759

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Presumption that devices are operating correctly to be repealed
« on: January 26, 2025, 03:04:01 pm »
This will be interesting: https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2025/01/21/computer-always-right-law-sub-postmaster-horizon-scandal/

It could place the burden on councils / the Crown to prove that equipment and devices is working correctly. The CPS might pull it off in the majority of cases, local authorities not so much.
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Southpaw82

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Re: Presumption that devices are operating correctly to be repealed
« Reply #1 on: January 26, 2025, 07:39:27 pm »
IIRC, it’s a common law presumption, so statute would need to intervene (again) to displace it. It’s likely that it would only do so in respect of criminal offences, so it probably wouldn’t affect decriminalised enforcement. They might even exempt cameras altogether.
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cp8759

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Re: Presumption that devices are operating correctly to be repealed
« Reply #2 on: January 26, 2025, 10:51:10 pm »
It is a common law presumption, but reporting of such matters is very often only partially accurate, but it's pretty clear that the subject is statutory intervention. It'll be interesting to see what they come up with.
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I practice law in the Traffic Penalty Tribunal, London Tribunals, the First-tier tribunal for Scotland, and the Traffic Penalty Tribunal for Northern Ireland, but I am not a solicitor nor a barrister. Notwithstanding this, I voluntarily apply the cab rank rule. I am a member of the Society of Professional McKenzie Friends, my membership number is FM193.

Quote from: 'Gumph' date='Thu, 19 Jan 2023 - 10:23'
cp8759 is, indeed, a Wizard of the First Order

roythebus

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Re: Presumption that devices are operating correctly to be repealed
« Reply #3 on: January 27, 2025, 12:41:34 pm »
The presumption that a device is working correctly all the time is like getting an MoT on your var, it's only valid the moment the certificate is written out. Your headlamp could fail the moment your car moves off the test lane. It even says so on the bit of paper.
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cp8759

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Re: Presumption that devices are operating correctly to be repealed
« Reply #4 on: January 27, 2025, 12:52:23 pm »
Quote from: roythebus on January 27, 2025, 12:41:34 pm
The presumption that a device is working correctly all the time is like getting an MoT on your var, it's only valid the moment the certificate is written out. Your headlamp could fail the moment your car moves off the test lane. It even says so on the bit of paper.
The presumption has nothing to do with any certificate, indeed most devices (phones, watches, lifts, laptops, routers, GPS satellites...) do not have any certificate whatsoever, so I'm not sure your analogy works?
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I practice law in the Traffic Penalty Tribunal, London Tribunals, the First-tier tribunal for Scotland, and the Traffic Penalty Tribunal for Northern Ireland, but I am not a solicitor nor a barrister. Notwithstanding this, I voluntarily apply the cab rank rule. I am a member of the Society of Professional McKenzie Friends, my membership number is FM193.

Quote from: 'Gumph' date='Thu, 19 Jan 2023 - 10:23'
cp8759 is, indeed, a Wizard of the First Order
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