3. NIP for 2x offences, speeding and failure of identification.
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NIP for 2x offences, speeding and failure of identification.
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Good afternoon,
I would like to request help with the NIP I have received. After getting over the initial shock I can summarise where I'm up to below.
2/8 NIP received stating the following charges:
Offence 1: 31.3.25 failed to give info re the identification of a driver of a vehicle.
Offence 2: 24/2/25 going 25mph in a 20 zone (caught by mobile camera).
 Today 4/8 I called the number on the letter and they advised me to plead guilty to the speeding charge and not guilty to offence 1 which contradicts the advice I read on the read this first page.

The first I had heard about any of this was a few days ago as I didn't receive the initial request for details. I am dealing with West Yorkshire Police and was surprised to find there are no reminder letters as it's not the first time I personally have had things lost in the post and I'm sure it won't be the last. I'm not sure if it would be relevant to defend my case but I do have evidence on my phone of at least three times that things have been misdelivered to a street a few streets away with a similar sounding name.
My VC5 is up to date so can only assume the initial notice was lost as I have received other reminders through from the DVLA such as vehicle tax.

The advice I have seen here is to plead not guilty to both charges and then try to negotiate to accept just the speeding fine. I have never had to go to court for anything before so I'm just wondering if this is still the nest route to go down or if I should plead guilty to the speeding and not guilty to the not giving details as I genuinely didn't get the letter. Honestly, I'm so upset because why would I want to go through all of this and get points on my clean license when I could have just done a speed awareness course had I received the initial documents.

If I do the guilty to one and not guilty to the other are they likely to want to see me in court and will I then likely be liable for a bunch of court costs on top of the fine? It seems unjust when I really didn't get the letter if I'm going to have to fork out £100s+++ due to an administrative error I had no control over.

Trying to keep things in perspective and not spiral as I have a roof over my head and enough to eat so doing better than most of the world, I suppose much worse things happen to people than extra court costs :(
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Re: NIP for 2x offences, speeding and failure of identification.
« Reply #1 on: »
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I called the number on the letter and they advised me to plead guilty to the speeding charge and not guilty to offence 1

No don't do that.

It might work but it might not. The speeding charge has no legs unless you plead guilty to it. That is your "leverage" if you do what is usually advised on here. If you plead guilty to speeding (without ensuring the FtP charge will be dropped) and the police decide to continue with the FtP charge you may have difficulty defending it and will end up convicted of both.

Of course if you want to you can simply plead not guilty to both. The speeding charge will be discontinued (they have no evidence you were driving). But it means you will have to convince the court that the original request for driver's details was not received. It is not an easy task (if it was everybody would do it) and the cost of failure is high. As well as a hefty fine and prosecution costs you will receive six points and an endorsement which will see a considerable increase in your premiums for up to five years. It is an endorsement that really needs avoiding if possible.

Before the pandemic it was necessary to attend court to undertake this arrangement and speak to the prosecutor (the agreement of the prosecutor is required as the court cannot accept it without that agreement). However, during the pandemic most courts accepted a written request to do the deal. Local police prosecutors made an agreement with their courts that the magistrates’ legal advisors could accept the deal. In some areas this arrangement has carried on, so you may have to attend court or you may not.

I'm assuming that you were the driver at the time of the alleged speeding offence?
« Last Edit: August 04, 2025, 05:56:21 pm by NewJudge »
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Re: NIP for 2x offences, speeding and failure of identification.
« Reply #2 on: »
Thank you for the very comprehensive advice. I will proceed as you advised. Yes I was the driver.
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Re: NIP for 2x offences, speeding and failure of identification.
« Reply #3 on: »
Hi,

Following on from my case I took the advice of pleading not guilty to both cases. I did NOT mention that I never received a letter as I read on someone else's post that this would be a defence to the speeding charge meaning that I would be potentially on the hook for the more serious charge of not responding.
Today on another professional healthcare forum I'm on I by coincidence saw someone who is in a similar position to me and who is under investigation for dishonesty by our professional body!! I can't believe that an admin error could potentially now be putting my career at risk!! I have done some research and apparently if I'm convicted of the failure to respond then I will be under investigation for fitness to practice. I am seriously spiralling  :'( 
I'm trying to be rational and think that from what I've read here that is unlikely to happen but now I'm threating that if I get someone on a bad day and I'm convicted of both it's game over for me. Last 15 years of my life and the rest of it down the drain.
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Re: NIP for 2x offences, speeding and failure of identification.
« Reply #4 on: »
Cool story bro
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Re: NIP for 2x offences, speeding and failure of identification.
« Reply #5 on: »
Not that it's much help, but if I worked in a profession where the outcome of a letter getting lost in the post could see me dismissed, I might consider an alternative career. However, that's by the way.

If you want to avoid a conviction for “Failing to Provide Driver’s Details” (FtP) there are only two alternatives:

1. Negotiate the arrangement I have suggested.
2. Plead Not Guilty to the charge (without the arrangement).

Option 2 means offering a defence to the charge.  All you have is your testimony that the original notice was not received, together with some evidence that a small number of other items have failed to arrive in the post previously. You might succeed. My feeling is that you will not.

If the prosecutor does not accept your offer under option 1 (which is highly unlikely) you will be in the same position as you would be under option 2 – having to defend the FtP charge.

Whilst there is a chance that you may successfully defend the FtP charge, I believe there is a far greater certainty that your offer (to plead guilty to speeding if the FtP charge is dropped) will be accepted.

The arrangement I have suggested is well known to all court users – prosecutors, magistrates and their legal advisors. It is negotiated all the time. Prosecutors understand that administrative issues such as yours occur and generally they have no wish to secure convictions for more serious offences provided they are satisfied that nobody is trying to secure an unjust outcome.

On this site and its now defunct predecessor (“Pepipoo”) I believe that there was only one known occasion when the arrangement was not accepted. In that case the defendant was less than polite to the prosecutor.

If  I was asked to rate the chances of a successful outcome to each of your two options I would say >99% for option one, whilst I would say only 50% (at best) for option 2.

Have you heard back from the court yet following your response?
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Re: NIP for 2x offences, speeding and failure of identification.
« Reply #6 on: »
Quote from: NewJudge on August 23, 2025, 12:26:35 pm
Not that it's much help, but if I worked in a profession where the outcome of a letter getting lost in the post could see me dismissed, I might consider an alternative career. However, that's by the way.

If you want to avoid a conviction for “Failing to Provide Driver’s Details” (FtP) there are only two alternatives:

1. Negotiate the arrangement I have suggested.
2. Plead Not Guilty to the charge (without the arrangement).

Option 2 means offering a defence to the charge.  All you have is your testimony that the original notice was not received, together with some evidence that a small number of other items have failed to arrive in the post previously. You might succeed. My feeling is that you will not.

If the prosecutor does not accept your offer under option 1 (which is highly unlikely) you will be in the same position as you would be under option 2 – having to defend the FtP charge.

Whilst there is a chance that you may successfully defend the FtP charge, I believe there is a far greater certainty that your offer (to plead guilty to speeding if the FtP charge is dropped) will be accepted.

The arrangement I have suggested is well known to all court users – prosecutors, magistrates and their legal advisors. It is negotiated all the time. Prosecutors understand that administrative issues such as yours occur and generally they have no wish to secure convictions for more serious offences provided they are satisfied that nobody is trying to secure an unjust outcome.

On this site and its now defunct predecessor (“Pepipoo”) I believe that there was only one known occasion when the arrangement was not accepted. In that case the defendant was less than polite to the prosecutor.

If  I was asked to rate the chances of a successful outcome to each of your two options I would say >99% for option one, whilst I would say only 50% (at best) for option 2.

Have you heard back from the court yet following your response?


Ok thank you. I might just be catastrophising. I've contacted our mental health helpline and they calmed me down a lot. I think the not responding charge might be looked dimly on if I were convicted (as could be seen as dishonest) but I've followed the advice here so I'm not going to think about things that are unlikely to happen/haven't yet happened. The support line told me to calm down as I'm not going to be struck off for going 25 in a 20 zone.
I haven't heard back yet but they said I should hear back within 28 days on the letter so if nothing has come through by then I will ring and email the court to make sure it's not lost in the post...again  :-[   
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Re: NIP for 2x offences, speeding and failure of identification.
« Reply #7 on: »
I don’t see how any properly directed regulator could find that not responding to a s 172 notice is dishonest (“conduct that the ordinary man in the street would say was dishonest”), absent some extraordinary factor pointing to dishonesty. Dishonesty is not an element of the offence (unlike say theft or fraud).
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Re: NIP for 2x offences, speeding and failure of identification.
« Reply #8 on: »
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I don’t see how any properly directed regulator could find that not responding to a s 172 notice is dishonest..

Especially if it wasn't received!
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Re: NIP for 2x offences, speeding and failure of identification.
« Reply #9 on: »
For the OP to be convicted of the s. 172 charge, the court would have to find as fast that the notice was delivered, meaning that on the balance of probabilities they didn't believe him.
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