Author Topic: Help needed with upcoming magistrates appearance for speeding.  (Read 224 times)

0 Members and 0 Guests are viewing this topic.

learnt_my_lesson

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 5
  • Karma: +0/-0
    • View Profile
Help needed with upcoming magistrates appearance for speeding.
« on: November 21, 2023, 02:17:12 pm »
Hello. Any help appreciated.

I' in England

Full disclosure before I present my plea:

I have been charged with and pleaded guilty (with mitigating/special circumstances) of speeding at 84mph in a variable limit zone of 50mph on M25 at 01:21 on 15/112022.

Okay, here goes details of the plea I plan to present:
In my responding to the single justice procedure pack/offence I have provided a plea guilty, with details that I received a call at roughly 11pm on 14/11/2022 that my late Father in law had been placed in emergency state and was hours from passing away.

My FIL had been discharged from hospital on the 10/11/2022, for treatment of hyperkalemia. My wife and I had spent time in Brighton with him and decided to go home to Derbyshire on night of Sunday 11/11/22, to get rest and return to work, as the hospital team stated he would be looked after. We were told he would not recover fully but had at least 2-3 months of hospice care. We were in a state of shock throughout as we processed the news of his condition.

On received the phone call, we rushed to pack and make arrangements with neighbours to look after house and pets etc, then commenced journey to Brighton from Chesterfield.

My case is that I momentarily sped on the stretch where I was flashed due to the traumatic nature of the event. It was 01:41 in the morning, I was the only car on the road, clear weather with no rain or spray and we were being pressured to get to the bedside of my father asap. My wife was flooded with tears and I was doing my best to drive safely and effectively.

I must add that I had 3 points previously (now lapsed) from August 2020, not important but I was being tailgated/flashed on a single lane A road at 11:30 pm and panicked.

Since then I have made every step to improve my driving and not offended at all. I am a professional Bus and Coach Driver (currently not working in that field in case I am disqualified) and make sure to drive with care. I emphasised my remorse of speeding on that night and stated that I usually initiate the in built speed restriction device in my car on motorways, but due to the stress I forgot to do so that night.

The FIL did not pass that evening but we were by his side 24 hours a day untill his passing on 23/11/22. I have submitted death certificate, hospital reports and hospice admittance/medical admin forms with my plea.

I have also prepared a financial statement as the traumatic experience surrounding his death triggered a gambling addiction, where I went on to rack up £20k debt between November and February. I cannot quantify this was a direct result of the experience but it coincided.

I have taken steps to repay the debt and am actively engaged in recovery through counselling, peeer support and receive clinical medication from my GP.

The magistrates have stated disqualification is a distinct possibility. I am hoping my case can at least sway them to reduce any ban period or at the best impose 6 points, but I am unsure if it is wise to approach in this manner?

Please could any of you help me prepare? I cannot afford legal advice owing to the debt.

Thanks in advance for anything of offer!



TLDR: Looking for advice to present mitigating/special circumstances alongside a guilty plea to excessive speeding.

Share on Facebook Share on Twitter


666

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 35
  • Karma: +0/-0
    • View Profile
Re: Help needed with upcoming magistrates appearance for speeding.
« Reply #1 on: November 21, 2023, 02:48:23 pm »
I have every sympathy with your predicament, as I'm sure the magistrates also will.

However, you say "We were in a state of shock throughout ...", "... we were being pressured ...",  "...I was doing my best to drive safely and effectively." and "due to the stress I forgot ...".

The obvious question arising from all of that is whether you should have been driving at all.

You need to be very careful lest what you think is mitigation is really an aggravating factor.

Maybe best to confine yourself to a sincere apology for a momentary lapse.
Agree Agree x 1 View List

learnt_my_lesson

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 5
  • Karma: +0/-0
    • View Profile
Re: Help needed with upcoming magistrates appearance for speeding.
« Reply #2 on: November 21, 2023, 02:52:12 pm »
Thank you.
Great point, Yes I will ensure I don't waffle and keep it blunt to the apology.

Should I refrain from mentioning about years driving without incident?

Thanks again

666

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 35
  • Karma: +0/-0
    • View Profile
Re: Help needed with upcoming magistrates appearance for speeding.
« Reply #3 on: November 21, 2023, 03:33:36 pm »


Should I refrain from mentioning about years driving without incident?


Were those the years before or after your three points?

I'd refrain, it would make no difference anyway!

M60NJP

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 57
  • Karma: +0/-2
    • View Profile
Re: Help needed with upcoming magistrates appearance for speeding.
« Reply #4 on: November 21, 2023, 05:28:18 pm »
You 'momentarily' sped in the one stretch that had a reduced motorway limit Be honest - would you believe that? I.e. that someone drove at/below the limit for the remainderof the journey at all, let alone with all the angst you have already referenced.

I fear this won't end well - even a basic fine will be plus considerable costs What are you hoping as an outcome, as it's vanishingly unlikely to be less than £100 (probably more) plus victim surcharge and c£600 costs?..............

Southpaw82

  • Administrator
  • *****
  • Posts: 188
  • Karma: +0/-0
    • View Profile
Re: Help needed with upcoming magistrates appearance for speeding.
« Reply #5 on: November 21, 2023, 05:33:58 pm »
I fear this won't end well - even a basic fine will be plus considerable costs What are you hoping as an outcome, as it's vanishingly unlikely to be less than £100 (probably more) plus victim surcharge and c£600 costs?..............

Costs of £600 on a guilty plea?

M60NJP

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 57
  • Karma: +0/-2
    • View Profile
Re: Help needed with upcoming magistrates appearance for speeding.
« Reply #6 on: November 21, 2023, 05:54:03 pm »
Do they not apply costs if the plea is immersed in appeal points which are deemed vexatious?
Agree Agree x 1 View List

Southpaw82

  • Administrator
  • *****
  • Posts: 188
  • Karma: +0/-0
    • View Profile
Re: Help needed with upcoming magistrates appearance for speeding.
« Reply #7 on: November 21, 2023, 06:19:04 pm »
Do they not apply costs if the plea is immersed in appeal points which are deemed vexatious?

Youíre going to have to run that one by me again. So far as I can tell, the OP is pleading guilty and presenting mitigation (which may be good or bad). Iím not sure where youíre coming from in relation to any appeal points or indeed vexatious ones.

andy_foster

  • Global Moderator
  • *****
  • Posts: 206
  • Karma: +3/-1
  • Location: Reading
    • View Profile
Re: Help needed with upcoming magistrates appearance for speeding.
« Reply #8 on: November 21, 2023, 08:30:30 pm »
The gist of M60NJP's point is that the OP is foolish for trying to mitigate this in court rather than accept the fixed penalty (which was never and would never have been offered for 84 in a 50 limit). If we overlook the point that no such offer was made or would ever have been made, the point about going to court in the hope of getting a less harsh penalty than a fixed penalty would generally be arguable - albeit utterly irrelevant in this case.

Some posters do not have the luxury of having enough time (or attention span) to both read the OP's post(s) and offer their sage advice.
I am responsible for the accuracy of the information I post, not your ability to comprehend it.

The Rookie

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 64
  • Karma: +2/-0
  • Gender: Male
  • Location: Warwickshire
    • View Profile
Re: Help needed with upcoming magistrates appearance for speeding.
« Reply #9 on: November 22, 2023, 08:07:05 am »
appeal points
He's not even been convicted and you're talking about appeals already?
Or did you actually mean mitigation points, or even factors a court should take into account when sentencing?

Given that 84/50 was always going to result in a full court hearing to consider a disqualification I'm not sure how the OP contributed (beyond the original speeding) to there now being a full court hearing, perhaps you can educate us on that?
There are motorists who have been scammed and those who are yet to be scammed!

learnt_my_lesson

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 5
  • Karma: +0/-0
    • View Profile
Re: Help needed with upcoming magistrates appearance for speeding.
« Reply #10 on: November 22, 2023, 12:20:42 pm »
Thanks for all of you help.
To make it clear that I am in no way denying I sped and am just looking for the best way to handle this case as I have never been to court for anything like this.
Could I add something that may be frivilous but notheless I need clarification if anyone can help, please:

I've read a few articles which states magistrates summary offences "must be Ďlaid before the Courtí within six calendar months from the date of the offence"

SLPN document was sent to me, dated 12/05/2023.

The "summons on referral to court" doc I was sent is dated 14/06/2023.

The offence occurred 15/11/2022.

Should I call the magistrates and request details of when the case wa slaid out before court?


Sorry I just want to exhaust every outcome is all.
Thanks again

andy_foster

  • Global Moderator
  • *****
  • Posts: 206
  • Karma: +3/-1
  • Location: Reading
    • View Profile
Re: Help needed with upcoming magistrates appearance for speeding.
« Reply #11 on: November 22, 2023, 12:49:17 pm »
Laying an information was the old way of instigating proceedings which resulted in the court issuing a summons. This still applies for private prosecutions, but public prosecutions must now be instigated by issuing a Written Charge and SJPN. It is these that must be issued within the 6 months. The summons on referral is a new stage in existing proceedings instigated by issuing a written charge and SJPN. There is no time limit on subsequent stages.
I am responsible for the accuracy of the information I post, not your ability to comprehend it.

learnt_my_lesson

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 5
  • Karma: +0/-0
    • View Profile
Re: Help needed with upcoming magistrates appearance for speeding.
« Reply #12 on: November 22, 2023, 01:25:31 pm »
Thank you Andy.

So I now conclude I may at best be offered 6 points and a fine of over £600 and at worst receive a 6 month ban.

Thanks for all the help from everyone here. I will post an update on outcome, the appearance date is 8th December

The Rookie

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 64
  • Karma: +2/-0
  • Gender: Male
  • Location: Warwickshire
    • View Profile
Re: Help needed with upcoming magistrates appearance for speeding.
« Reply #13 on: November 22, 2023, 02:58:03 pm »
the appearance date is 8th December
Good Luck.
There are motorists who have been scammed and those who are yet to be scammed!
Like Like x 1 View List

NewJudge

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 45
  • Karma: +3/-0
    • View Profile
Re: Help needed with upcoming magistrates appearance for speeding.
« Reply #14 on: November 22, 2023, 06:02:24 pm »
Quote
So I now conclude I may at best be offered 6 points and a fine of over £600 and at worst receive a 6 month ban.

I don't know how you come to that conclusion.

Assuming you plead guilty the sentencing guidelines suggest a fine of a week's net income. You will also pay a "Victim Surcharge" of 40% of the fine and a contribution towards prosecution costs which are usually £85-£90. As well as that, you will receive either a ban of between 7 and 56 days or 6 points. That speed is liable to attract either, though if forced to bet I would go for six points. If a ban is the decision, it is not likely to exceed 28 days.

BTW - you won't be "offered" anything. The court will decide on the sentence and it will be imposed.  8)
« Last Edit: November 22, 2023, 06:08:07 pm by NewJudge »
Like Like x 2 View List