3. Private Parking Solutions - PCN received - Uxbridge industrial estate
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Private Parking Solutions - PCN received - Uxbridge industrial estate
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Upon entering the industrial estate, the driver stopped on the main thoroughfare about 200 yards into the estate (
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). The car may have remained stationary for brief period while the driver was checking details of the intended destination on the industrial estate, all the while remaining in the vehicle.

The driver saw no double yellow lines or any notices/signs regarding parking.

On 12th October, I, the registered keeper with V5C in my possession, received a PCN through the post

The driver has no photos of any signage. Google street view (dated Jun 2023) does not seem to show any relevant signs.


« Last Edit: October 12, 2024, 05:59:46 pm by tango33 »
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Re: Private Parking Solutions - PCN received - Uxbridge industrial estate
« Reply #1 on: »
We need to see all dates and times on the Notice to Keeper (NtK). Please resubmit.

Also, are the redacted evidential photos taken by ANPR or are they taken manually by an operative?

Too much redaction!
« Last Edit: October 12, 2024, 05:07:41 pm by b789 »
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Re: Private Parking Solutions - PCN received - Uxbridge industrial estate
« Reply #2 on: »
Quote from: b789 on October 12, 2024, 04:59:56 pm
We need to see all dates and times on the Notice to Keeper (NtK). Please resubmit.
Updated the image.

Quote from: b789 on October 12, 2024, 04:59:56 pm
Also, are the redacted evidential photos taken by ANPR or are they taken manually by an operative?
Timestamp says 4 seconds apart and it looks like they were taken from slightly different positions so I guess an operative in a vehicle?

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Re: Private Parking Solutions - PCN received - Uxbridge industrial estate
« Reply #3 on: »
Quote from: tango33 on October 12, 2024, 04:22:33 pm
The driver has no photos of any signage. Google street view (dated Jun 2023) does not seem to show any relevant signs.
On the entrance to Wallingford Road, GSV has a more up to date image from June 2024 showing some signage from PPS. But unless there is signage visible all the way down the roads they claim to cover, they'll be hard pushed to enforce.

As an aside, the older GSV images show vehicles parked all over the place. Must be a right pain to do business and have your employees be able to park if they no longer allow parking on the road.
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Re: Private Parking Solutions - PCN received - Uxbridge industrial estate
« Reply #4 on: »
Go on their website as though to appeal (paypps.co.uk) and see what other evidential photos they have. Whilst the two photos in the NtK are only 4 seconds apart, the time on the NtK suggests that the vehicle was observed still there at 10:32. Not that will affect the outcome but there must be evidential photos available with theme showing 10:32 otherwise they are lying.

Again, the photos in your image have completely redacted the evidential image and we cannot see exactly where the vehicle is alleged to have "parked". Is in a parking space? Is it on the road? We want to assist but overly redacting what we have to work on isn't helping.
« Last Edit: October 13, 2024, 01:43:30 pm by b789 »
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Never argue with stupid people. They will drag you down to their level and then beat you with experience” - Mark Twain
Re: Private Parking Solutions - PCN received - Uxbridge industrial estate
« Reply #5 on: »
Quote from: The Slithy Tove on October 13, 2024, 12:50:54 pm
On the entrance to Wallingford Road, GSV has a more up to date image from June 2024 showing some signage from PPS. But unless there is signage visible all the way down the roads they claim to cover, they'll be hard pushed to enforce.
The driver looked for signs but did not identify any and didn't see the small sign at the site entrance.

Not surprising, I believe, given the nature of the junction (potential queued traffic, unusual layout) and the sign seems only to be on the right hand side of the road and possibly visible for no more than 1 second when entering the estate.
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Re: Private Parking Solutions - PCN received - Uxbridge industrial estate
« Reply #6 on: »
Quote from: b789 on October 13, 2024, 01:21:02 pm
Again, the photos in your image have completely redacted the evidential image and we cannot see exactly where the vehicle is alleged to have "parked". Is in a parking space? Is it on the road? We want to assist but overly redacting what we have to work on isn't helping.
Sorry, I didn't make it obvious but the Google maps link marks the position of the car (
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) on the road, parked facing south, no "parking space" as such and no double yellow lines.
« Last Edit: October 13, 2024, 03:28:30 pm by tango33 »
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Re: Private Parking Solutions - PCN received - Uxbridge industrial estate
« Reply #7 on: »
Yes. But is the car on the side of the road, in a parking space or bay or is it simply stopped at the side of the road. Are there any signs nearby or are there any markings of any sort where the vehicle was stopped?

What about the "further images" on their website?
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Never argue with stupid people. They will drag you down to their level and then beat you with experience” - Mark Twain
Re: Private Parking Solutions - PCN received - Uxbridge industrial estate
« Reply #8 on: »
Quote from: b789 on October 13, 2024, 03:35:04 pm
Yes. But is the car on the side of the road, in a parking space or bay or is it simply stopped at the side of the road. Are there any signs nearby or are there any markings of any sort where the vehicle was stopped?
At the side of the road, no markings on the road.

Quote from: b789 on October 13, 2024, 03:35:04 pm
What about the "further images" on their website?
There is a picture of a parking sign that would seem to be approx. 30 metres north of the car. It is attached about 2 metres up a street lamp.

There are images that document a 10 minute stop.
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Re: Private Parking Solutions - PCN received - Uxbridge industrial estate
« Reply #9 on: »
So, appeal as the Keeper with the following:

Quote
I am the keeper of the vehicle and I dispute your 'parking charge'. I deny any liability or contractual agreement and I will be making a complaint about your predatory conduct to your client landowner.

As your Notice to Keeper (NtK) does not fully comply with ALL the requirements of PoFA 2012, you are unable to hold the keeper of the vehicle liable for the charge. Partial or even substantial compliance is not sufficient. There will be no admission as to who was driving and no inference or assumptions can be drawn. PPS has relied on contract law allegations of breach against the driver only.

The registered keeper cannot be presumed or inferred to have been the driver, nor pursued under some twisted interpretation of the law of agency. Your NtK can only hold the driver liable. PPS have no hope at POPLA, so you are urged to save us both a complete waste of time and cancel the PCN.

Do not select any options that admit you were the driver. PPS are going to reject the appeal, no matter what goes into it but the main thing is to get a POPLA code.
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Re: Private Parking Solutions - PCN received - Uxbridge industrial estate
« Reply #10 on: »
Appeal submitted.

Thank you for your help.
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Re: Private Parking Solutions - PCN received - Uxbridge industrial estate
« Reply #11 on: »
Appeal denied, response below:



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Re: Private Parking Solutions - PCN received - Uxbridge industrial estate
« Reply #12 on: »
Will prepare a POPLA appeal for you. However, is there any chance you can get some photos of the general layout of the are and any signs that they purport form the contract? The GSV images are from 2020 or earlier:

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Never argue with stupid people. They will drag you down to their level and then beat you with experience” - Mark Twain
Re: Private Parking Solutions - PCN received - Uxbridge industrial estate
« Reply #13 on: »
If you are not from the area, I live near here and can pass by after work one day and take some pics.
« Last Edit: October 16, 2024, 10:29:46 am by dave-o »
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Re: Private Parking Solutions - PCN received - Uxbridge industrial estate
« Reply #14 on: »
Quote from: dave-o on October 16, 2024, 10:27:41 am
If you are not from the area, I live near here and can pass by after work one day and take some pics.

That would be great as it will assist in the POPLA appeal.

The OP has until 17th November to submit the POPLA appeal, so no rush.
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Never argue with stupid people. They will drag you down to their level and then beat you with experience” - Mark Twain
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