Author Topic: Private parking fine from 2020, trace debt recovery letter  (Read 5479 times)

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Re: Private parking fine from 2020, trace debt recovery letter
« Reply #30 on: »
The Loc was via post.
I did send the email with the reference number and details but I will send the details again. Thanks

Re: Private parking fine from 2020, trace debt recovery letter
« Reply #31 on: »
Hi, I have received this today, please see attached.
Thanks

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Re: Private parking fine from 2020, trace debt recovery letter
« Reply #32 on: »
Who was the LoC addressed to? Due to you posting in the first person, it was assumed it was addressed to you.

Re: Private parking fine from 2020, trace debt recovery letter
« Reply #33 on: »
The letters are addressed to my husband.

Re: Private parking fine from 2020, trace debt recovery letter
« Reply #34 on: »
Same surname and address. I put those details on the email.

Re: Private parking fine from 2020, trace debt recovery letter
« Reply #35 on: »
Then he needs to be the one responding, as he'll be the one defending any claim. You can of course support/do things for him, but the letters should be in his name.

Re: Private parking fine from 2020, trace debt recovery letter
« Reply #36 on: »
So he needs to respond via email with his details not via my email with his details. Sorry for the confusion.

Re: Private parking fine from 2020, trace debt recovery letter
« Reply #37 on: »
If you are doing all the legwork for him, then you can use your own email address. It really doesn't matter as long as whoever is doing the work receives any emails.
Never argue with stupid people. They will drag you down to their level and then beat you with experience” - Mark Twain
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Re: Private parking fine from 2020, trace debt recovery letter
« Reply #38 on: »
The email used is largely immaterial - in whose name correspondence is sent is what matters.

Re: Private parking fine from 2020, trace debt recovery letter
« Reply #39 on: »
Thanks

Re: Private parking fine from 2020, trace debt recovery letter
« Reply #40 on: »
Hi, we have reviewed this today via email, please advise, thanks so much, Lucy

Re: Private parking fine from 2020, trace debt recovery letter
« Reply #41 on: »

We write in response to your email
The Parking Charge Notice was issued for parking without making payment or overstaying the time paid for on 20/10/2020 at Sea View Car Park, PL27 6SR, Polzeath. Evidence of the breach is attached for your reference. A full site map of the car park and signage are not available.
In accordance with Schedule 4 of the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012, our client is entitled to recover the parking charge from you as the registered keeper. You were invited to nominate the driver if it was not you, but no nomination was received. This right has now expired as recovery action has commenced.
Please also note that the agreement between our client and the landowner is not relevant to this matter. You are not a party to that agreement, and it cannot affect the validity of the Parking Charge Notice or support a defence.
additional £60 represents what is dressed up as a 'Debt Recovery' fee, and if so, is this nett or inclusive of VAT? If the latter, would you kindly explain why I am being asked to pay the operator’s VAT?
13. With regard to the principal alleged PCN sum: Is this damages, or will it be pleaded as consideration for parking?

The additional £70 applied to the Parking Charge is permitted under the International Parking Community (IPC) Code of Practice. Our client is a member of the IPC, a government-approved Accredited Trade Association, and follows its Code of Practice. The amount is reasonable, reflects the costs of recovery, and encourages payment without the need for further action.
By entering and parking on our client’s private land, you accepted the terms and conditions displayed at the entrance and throughout the site. Failure to comply with those terms constituted a breach of contract, and the Parking Charge Notice was issued correctly. Should legal proceedings be required, the claim will be for unpaid parking charges and breach of contract.
We note that you are seeking debt advice, and the matter has been placed on hold for 30 days. If payment is not made within that time, we may be instructed to issue a County Court claim.

 
You may wish to seek independent legal advice.
Yours sincerely
Moorside Legal



 

Millie

Collections Administrator

0330 828 5850

moorsidelegal.co.uk

 

 

 

This email may contain confidential and/or privileged information. If you are not the intended recipient (or have received this email in error) please notify the sender immediately and delete this email, together with any copies from your system. Any unauthorised use, copying, disclosure or distribution of the material in this email is strictly forbidden and may be unlawful. Please note that neither Moorside Legal nor the sender accepts any responsibility for viruses, and it is your responsibility to scan any attachments.

 

 

 

 

 

Moorside Legal Services Limited trading as Moorside Legal



Re: Private parking fine from 2020, trace debt recovery letter
« Reply #42 on: »
Moorside's utter incompetence would be laughable if it weren't such a serious matter. I advise you to respond by email to that response with the following:

Quote
Dear Sirs,

Re: Your purported Letter of Claim – [Client/PCN ref], Sea View Car Park, Polzeath – alleged event 20/10/2020

Your latest missive is yet another template non-response. It recycles stock phrases, misstates the law, and ignores the specific defects I identified. It is, frankly, legally embarrassing.

1. Protocol failure (again)
You still have not served a compliant Letter of Claim under the PAPDC and PD-PAC (PAPDC 3.1(a)–(d), 5.1–5.2; PD-PAC 6(a)–(c)). You even admit “a full site map of the car park and signage are not available”. That concession is fatal to any allegation that terms were properly communicated or incorporated on 20/10/2020.

2. Keeper liability – bare assertion is not evidence
Your one-line claim that Schedule 4 PoFA entitles recovery from the keeper is denied. Keeper liability is strict and only arises if every statutory condition is met. The NtK you rely on failed PoFA 9(2)(e)(i) (no compliant “invitation to keeper”), and you have produced neither that contemporaneous NtK nor proof of service under 9(4)–(6). Your curious suggestion that your “right has now expired as recovery action has commenced” is nonsense: commencing “recovery” does not transmute a non-compliant NtK into a compliant one. There is no presumption that the keeper was the driver: see VCS v Edward (2023) [H0KF6C9C]. I will not identify the driver.

3. The £70 add-on – unrecoverable double recovery
Your reliance on a trade association code to tack on £70 is misconceived. A private code does not override statute, the fixed small-claims costs regime, or the court’s duty to prevent double recovery. The add-on is routinely struck out as an abuse and any pleaded sum must be confined to the (denied) principal PCN. You have also been inconsistent (£60 in earlier material; £70 now) so please explain why the difference.

4. Standing/landowner authority – your position is hopeless
Your statement that “the agreement between our client and the landowner is not relevant” is risible and betrays a basic misunderstanding of locus standi. Only a party with authority from the landowner can (a) offer parking contracts to motorists, and (b) sue in its own name for alleged breach. This is not optional “background” – it goes to the very heart of the cause of action. The Supreme Court in ParkingEye v Beavis proceeded on the explicit premise that the operator held landowner authority; absent that authority the claim would have failed at the first hurdle. Your client is put to strict proof.

Produce now:

• The contemporaneous, unredacted landowner agreement in force on 20/10/2020 (redactions limited to commercially sensitive rates only), expressly granting your client authority to: manage/operate the site; erect and maintain signage; offer parking contracts; issue PCNs; and commence legal proceedings in its own name.
• A landowner (or superior titleholder) witness statement exhibiting that agreement and confirming its scope and duration.
• The site boundary plan and the schedule of signs cross-referenced in that agreement.

Your refusal to provide this is not merely non-compliance with the PPSCoP requirement for written authority on reasonable request; it is an admission that you cannot prove standing. Issue on that footing and the claim will be met with an application to stay/strike for want of standing and for unreasonable conduct costs.

5. Signage and incorporation
You concede you cannot provide a site map or signage set. That is the evidence by which you would hope to prove offer, terms, prominence, and incorporation. Without it, you have no contract case. Strict proof remains required of wording, positioning, dimensions, illumination, and the terms in force on the material date.

6. “Debt advice” fiction
Nowhere did I request a 30-day hold for debt advice. Your file note to that effect is false. Rectify your records immediately. This is a data accuracy issue (UK GDPR, Art. 5(1)(d) and Art. 16).

7. Service & communications – no web portal
I will not use your web portal. Do not direct me to it again. All future correspondence must be by email to: [your email] or by post to: [your postal address]. You may choose either channel. For the avoidance of doubt, “service” via a portal will not be accepted and portal notifications will be ignored. Update your records accordingly and confirm.

8. What you must provide (or discontinue)
To progress this pre-action exchange properly, serve a compliant PAPDC pack within 14 days, comprising:

(i) the items in §4 above (standing/authority);
(ii) the full ANPR data and stills; machine audit/VRM logs (entry, payment, whitelist/permit look-ups) for the relevant period;
(iii) the contemporaneous NtK and proof of service relied upon for PoFA;
(iv) the complete signage set and site plan applicable on 20/10/2020;
(v) a breakdown of the principal sum and a confirmation that the £70 add-on will not be pursued.

Failing that, confirm the matter is closed.

If you nevertheless issue a County Court claim without first curing these defects, I will apply to stay/strike under PD-PAC 15(b) and seek costs under CPR 27.14 for unreasonable conduct. Your client has been on clear notice for months. Proceeding on template bluster while disavowing the relevance of standing would merely compound the embarrassment.

Yours faithfully,

[Name of defendant]

[Postal address]
[Email]
[Your ref/Our ref]
Never argue with stupid people. They will drag you down to their level and then beat you with experience” - Mark Twain

Re: Private parking fine from 2020, trace debt recovery letter
« Reply #43 on: »
Hi, thanks so much. I was hoping after the last email we would not hear anything but obviously not. I have sent what you have advised. I thought if we got to October it would be 5 years and not count anyways but I think that is Scotland! I hope this resolves it. Thanks again for all your help. I really appreciate it. Lucy :)

Re: Private parking fine from 2020, trace debt recovery letter
« Reply #44 on: »
Yes, the statute of limitation is 5 years for Scotland and 6 years for England and Wales.

I am still very confident this will never get as far as a hearing. However you have to go through the motions.

Just now, in another thread, you can see a claim issued by the utter incompetents, Moorside Legal, was discontinued just 24 hours before the hearing:

https://www.ftla.uk/private-parking-tickets/small-claim-court-letter-received-observed-leaving-site-ukcps-sheff/
Never argue with stupid people. They will drag you down to their level and then beat you with experience” - Mark Twain