Author Topic: PCN issued when I was parked in their car park and eating in the restaurant. (Read 118 times)

Alf1956 · « **on:** February 02, 2025, 05:09:26 pm »

I went for a meal at the Aagrah restaurant 108 Barnsley Road, Wakefield, WF1 5NX on 25th December 2024. It does say on the signs on the wall that you must register your car in the restaurant. I went in and had my meal and asked the staff if I can register my car and they told me it was not required which I am now upset as I received a PCN on 20/01/2025 I have my credit card statement with the time and date showing that I was actually in the restaurant at the time. I am led to believe that they have to issue you with the PCN within 14 days is this correct? The letter that they sent makes me think that this is correct as the letter states " We are writing to you in relation to the above parking charge. We have very recently identified that the notice informing you of this PCN may not have reached you due to an issue with our postal service provider we have therefore reissued the PCN to you with an updated issue date " The updated issue date is the date of the letter 20/01/2025.

Can anybody shed any light on this matter in relation to if the ticket has timed out because it was not issued within 14 days and if I am liable to pay the ticket because I was actually in the restaurant at the time of the ticket.

Thanks in anticipation

mickR · « **Reply #1 on:** February 02, 2025, 05:24:19 pm »

the car park appears to be solely for the restaurant so approach the owner/manager ask them to get it cancelled as you can prove you were a customer
do this as the vehicle keeper don't mention who was actually driving.

DWMB2 · « **Reply #2 on:** February 02, 2025, 07:45:59 pm »

Welcome to FTLA.

Can you please show us the back of the notice?

As issues at their end mean they have not delivered the notice to you as the registered keeper within 14 days, they can only pursue the driver - they don't know who that is (unless you tell them), so, as the keeper only, you can appeal along the lines of the below (NB - if you are not the registered keeper, if it's a lease/hire vehicle for example, then let us know as the appeal will be different):

Dear Sirs,

I have received your Parking Charge Notice (Ref: ________) for vehicle registration mark ____ ___, in which you allege that the driver has incurred a parking charge. I note from your correspondence that you are not seeking to hold me liable as the registered keeper, under Schedule 4 of the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012 ("The Act"). You have failed to issue a Notice to Keeper in accordance with The Act, and it is now too late for you to do so.

There is no obligation for me to name the driver and I will not be doing so. I am therefore unable to help you further with this matter, and look forward to your confirmation that the charge has been cancelled. If you choose to decline this appeal, you must issue a POPLA code.

Yours,

If appealing online, be careful there are no drop down/tick boxes that cause you to identify who was driving, and keep a close eye on your spam folder for their response. If they do not respond within 28 days, chase them.

Alf1956 · « **Reply #3 on:** February 02, 2025, 08:48:50 pm »

Hello
Thank you for your replies as you have all been very helpful and with your help I am hoping to resolve this issue.
Alf

Alf1956 · « **Reply #4 on:** February 02, 2025, 09:44:16 pm »

Quote from: DWMB2 on February 02, 2025, 07:45:59 pm

Welcome to FTLA.

Can you please show us the back of the notice?

As issues at their end mean they have not delivered the notice to you as the registered keeper within 14 days, they can only pursue the driver - they don't know who that is (unless you tell them), so, as the keeper only, you can appeal along the lines of the below (NB - if you are not the registered keeper, if it's a lease/hire vehicle for example, then let us know as the appeal will be different):

Dear Sirs,

I have received your Parking Charge Notice (Ref: ________) for vehicle registration mark ____ ___, in which you allege that the driver has incurred a parking charge. I note from your correspondence that you are not seeking to hold me liable as the registered keeper, under Schedule 4 of the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012 ("The Act"). You have failed to issue a Notice to Keeper in accordance with The Act, and it is now too late for you to do so.

There is no obligation for me to name the driver and I will not be doing so. I am therefore unable to help you further with this matter, and look forward to your confirmation that the charge has been cancelled. If you choose to decline this appeal, you must issue a POPLA code.

Yours,

If appealing online, be careful there are no drop down/tick boxes that cause you to identify who was driving, and keep a close eye on your spam folder for their response. If they do not respond within 28 days, chase them.

I have posted the back of the PCN.

DWMB2 · « **Reply #5 on:** February 02, 2025, 09:48:22 pm »

If you are the registered keeper, then the appeal I suggested above is suitable.

Alf1956 · « **Reply #6 on:** February 02, 2025, 10:37:34 pm »

Quote from: DWMB2 on February 02, 2025, 09:48:22 pm

If you are the registered keeper, then the appeal I suggested above is suitable.

Thank you

b789 · « **Reply #7 on:** February 03, 2025, 12:38:40 pm »

Understand that as long as the unknown (to CEL) driver is not identified, you, the known Keeper cannot be liable for the charge. The driver and the Keeper are separate legal entities and there is no legal obligation on the Keeper to identify the driver to an unregulated private parking company.

As the known Keeper, you must always refer to the unknown driver in the third person. No "I did this or that". Only "The driver did this or that". Don't tell 'em your name Pike!

Alf1956 · « **Reply #8 on:** February 03, 2025, 07:40:42 pm »

Quote from: b789 on February 03, 2025, 12:38:40 pm

Understand that as long as the unknown (to CEL) driver is not identified, you, the known Keeper cannot be liable for the charge. The driver and the Keeper are separate legal entities and there is no legal obligation on the Keeper to identify the driver to an unregulated private parking company.

As the known Keeper, you must always refer to the unknown driver in the third person. No "I did this or that". Only "The driver did this or that". Don't tell 'em your name Pike!

Thank you

Alf1956 · « **Reply #9 on:** February 03, 2025, 10:01:57 pm »

Dear Sir / Madam 02/02/2025
I am writing to you in response to PCN 283435069507

You have failed to comply with the requirements of Schedule 4 of The Protection Of Freedoms Act 2012 namely, but not limited to, failing to deliver the notice within the relevant period of 14 days as prescribed by section 9 (4) of the Act. You cannot, therefore, transfer liability for the alleged charge from the driver at the time to me, the keeper.

There is no legal requirement to name the driver at the time and I will not be doing so.

Any further communication with me on this matter, apart from confirmation of no further action and my details being removed from your records, will be considered vexatious and harassment. This includes communication from any Debt Collection companies you care to instruct.

Alf1956 · « **Reply #10 on:** February 03, 2025, 10:04:15 pm »

Quote from: Alf1956 on February 03, 2025, 10:01:57 pm

How does this look regarding my appeal? I have not yet submitted it yet as I need approval from you guys first.

Dear Sir / Madam 02/02/2025
I am writing to you in response to PCN 283435069507

You have failed to comply with the requirements of Schedule 4 of The Protection Of Freedoms Act 2012 namely, but not limited to, failing to deliver the notice within the relevant period of 14 days as prescribed by section 9 (4) of the Act. You cannot, therefore, transfer liability for the alleged charge from the driver at the time to me, the keeper.

There is no legal requirement to name the driver at the time and I will not be doing so.

Any further communication with me on this matter, apart from confirmation of no further action and my details being removed from your records, will be considered vexatious and harassment. This includes communication from any Debt Collection companies you care to instruct.

DWMB2 · « **Reply #11 on:** February 03, 2025, 10:08:05 pm »

I provided you with an appeal you could use verbatim. I'm not sure why you've chosen to amend it. My recommendation would be the wording I've already provided.

Alf1956 · « **Reply #12 on:** February 03, 2025, 11:04:04 pm »

Dear Sir/Madam 03/02/2025

I have received your Parking Charge Notice Ref: 28435069507 for vehicle registration mark S33 ALF in which you allege that the driver has incurred a parking charge. I note from your correspondence that you are not seeking to hold me liable as the registered keeper, under Schedule 4 of the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012 ("The Act"). You have failed to issue a Notice to Keeper in accordance with The Act, and it is now too late for you to do so.

There is no obligation for me to name the driver and I will not be doing so. I am therefore unable to help you further with this matter, and look forward to your confirmation that the charge has been cancelled. If you choose to decline this appeal, you must issue a POPLA code.

Yours,

b789 · « **Reply #13 on:** February 03, 2025, 11:38:16 pm »

Easy when you follow the advice. Send that and wait for the rejection which will include a POPLA code for the secondary appeal.

In the meantime, keep trying Plan A which is to get the landowner (the restaurant?) to get it cancelled. I’m sure they don’t want any bad publicity on sites such as TrustPilot giving bad reviews about spurious invoices for £100 for simply being a patron of the business.

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Author Topic: PCN issued when I was parked in their car park and eating in the restaurant. (Read 118 times)

Alf1956

PCN issued when I was parked in their car park and eating in the restaurant.

mickR

Re: PCN issued when I was parked in their car park and eating in the restaurant.

DWMB2

Re: PCN issued when I was parked in their car park and eating in the restaurant.

Alf1956

Re: PCN issued when I was parked in their car park and eating in the restaurant.

Alf1956

Re: PCN issued when I was parked in their car park and eating in the restaurant.

DWMB2

Re: PCN issued when I was parked in their car park and eating in the restaurant.

Alf1956

Re: PCN issued when I was parked in their car park and eating in the restaurant.

b789

Re: PCN issued when I was parked in their car park and eating in the restaurant.

Alf1956

Re: PCN issued when I was parked in their car park and eating in the restaurant.

Alf1956

Re: PCN issued when I was parked in their car park and eating in the restaurant.

Alf1956

Re: PCN issued when I was parked in their car park and eating in the restaurant.

DWMB2

Re: PCN issued when I was parked in their car park and eating in the restaurant.

Alf1956

Re: PCN issued when I was parked in their car park and eating in the restaurant.

b789

Re: PCN issued when I was parked in their car park and eating in the restaurant.