Author Topic: Horizon Parking Charge Notice-Unauthorised Parking- Parkhouse Business Centre  (Read 165 times)

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bobbyc009

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Hi,

I have received a parking charge notice from Horizon parking for unauthorised parking. I am the registered keeper, the car was parked in the position of the Mercedes as visible on street view here- https://www.google.com/maps/@51.6351928,-0.7720531,3a,75y,82.24h,70.53t/data=!3m7!1e1!3m5!1sVERXPbjLrn5-goFBbDaYqA!2e0!6shttps:%2F%2Fstreetviewpixels-pa.googleapis.com%2Fv1%2Fthumbnail%3Fpanoid%3DVERXPbjLrn5-goFBbDaYqA%26cb_client%3Dmaps_sv.share%26w%3D900%26h%3D600%26yaw%3D82.24%26pitch%3D19.47%26thumbfov%3D90!7i16384!8i8192?coh=205410&entry=ttu



I appreciate in terms of parking it really isn't a great place to park. However I am unsure as to whether this specific space would be seen as private land and also the entrance signage does not detail the terms and conditions of parking. An appeal was made on account of the signage and location of the parking but this has been rejected by Horizon Parking, I would be grateful for any advice on whether this would be worth appealing to POPLA ?.



PCN-

https://postimg.cc/0MCyhnXN



The entrance to the business park-

https://postimg.cc/8sq9300k



The signage at the entrance-

https://postimg.cc/kVGd9tF7



The signage at the rear of the business park-

https://postimg.cc/p9b1chG0



The reason behind thinking that this may not be private land is due to the fact the street view shows a barriers for entrance a few years ago and the cars location is in front of this. Also when entering the business park it is possible to miss the entrance signage entirely, turn around and park up without seeing the additional signage at the rear. I am happy to accept if its not worth the appeal but thought I would ask for opinions here. Due to lack of parking in the local area many residents often park in the undesignated spaces around the business centre(usually after hours all though sometimes cars are left parked) and as far as we are aware this is the first time a private parking attendant has attended and manually ticketed the cars. It appears that we may have been lucky up to now. Any advice on this would be much appreciated and I apologise if I made any mistakes. Thanks a lot.


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b789

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Please let us know if the known keeper identified as the unknown driver in the appeal?

Horizon rarely, and definitely in this case, issue NtKs that rely on PoFA to hold the known keeper liable. The known keeper can only be liable if Horizon fully comply with all the requirements of PoFA. As they haven't, only the unknown driver is liable.

Have you, the known keeper identified the unknown driver, inadvertently or otherwise? Once the driver is known, the "golden ticket" becomes a "silver bullet" for Horizon and getting the PCN cancelled become much harder.

So, has the driver been identified and thus become known?

Irrespective of signage and anything else argued, this could have been cancelled with the following simple appeal:

This is an appeal by the registered keeper - No driver details will be given. Please do NOT try the trick of asking for driver details in order to get around the fact your NtK does not comply with PoFA. As there is no keeper liability, therefore, liability cannot flow from the driver to the keeper and so, is an automatic win at POPLA. Please cancel the notice or issue a POPLA code at which point you will auto withdraw.
« Last Edit: July 04, 2024, 07:49:17 pm by b789 »
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bobbyc009

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Thank you for your response, it's much appreciated. I can confirm the driver was not identified to Horizon Parking. Would this defence still be applicable for a POPLA appeal ?. Thanks.

DWMB2

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Do you have a copy of the initial appeal?

b789

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Basically... yes. However, it is advised to include as many points for the operator to rebut. They have to successfully rebut all points raised. The appellant only has to be successful on a single point.

You should lead with the lack of keeper liability due to non-PoFA NtK and then follow with the fact that the operator has not shown that the person it has issued the NtK to is the driver.

Use the following (but not limited to) points in your POPLA appeal:

1. The Notice to Keeper (NtK) does not meet PoFA requirements to hold the keeper liable.
2. The operator has not shown that the appellant is the driver.
3. The signage is inadequate and no contract was formed with the driver.
4. No landowner authority to issue PCNs in its own name.
5. No valid landowner contract.
6. Non compliance with any BPA Code of Practice rules you can find and so on...

You will need to expand on each point so that the assessor can understand your reasoning.
Never argue with an idiot. They will drag you down to their level and then beat you with experience. - Mark Twain.

bobbyc009

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Do you have a copy of the initial appeal?

I have a draft of this and will include it below. Looking back I was embarrassingly naive and ill advised. I wish I had come here earlier. Thank you for your response.

Draft Appeal-

I am writing to formally appeal Parking Charge Notice (PCN) number X, issued to my vehicle, X, on 12th of June 2024.


Grounds for Appeal

Unclear Signage: There is no signage on the entrance to the road nor any signage on the side of the road where the car was parked. The Parking Regulations Act 2000 requires clear signage at all entrances to a private car park.The absence of a sign at the entrance makes the terms and conditions of parking unclear. I also believe the location where the car was parked might be a public highway and not a private car park. Please find attached images of the location as taken today, they show a clear lack of visible signage indicating private parking is in enforcement. The image posted of the signage from your attendant is not from the location where the car was parked. I have included an image of this.

In light of the above points, I kindly request you to cancel the PCN.

Thank you for your time and consideration.

bobbyc009

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Basically... yes. However, it is advised to include as many points for the operator to rebut. They have to successfully rebut all points raised. The appellant only has to be successful on a single point.

You should lead with the lack of keeper liability due to non-PoFA NtK and then follow with the fact that the operator has not shown that the person it has issued the NtK to is the driver.

Use the following (but not limited to) points in your POPLA appeal:

1. The Notice to Keeper (NtK) does not meet PoFA requirements to hold the keeper liable.
2. The operator has not shown that the appellant is the driver.
3. The signage is inadequate and no contract was formed with the driver.
4. No landowner authority to issue PCNs in its own name.
5. No valid landowner contract.
6. Non compliance with any BPA Code of Practice rules you can find and so on...

You will need to expand on each point so that the assessor can understand your reasoning.

Thanks for this. I will take a few days to draft an appeal and will post it here for any recommended amendments. Generally with the recommended POPLA defence would there be a good chance of a successful appeal ?. I ask out of curiosity as not to get ones hopes up.

bobbyc009

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Just to add to this, in the appeal rejection they cited the following-

Please be advised, only the driver can appeal to POPLA. POPLA will not accept appeals from the keeper of the vehicle.

Would this be true ? and if so would this mean by identifying the driver the defence of Horizon failing to identify the driver would be undermined ?. Apologies I have not had a PCN before and want to make sure my appeal is a strong as possible. Thanks again.

b789

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Was this in Scotland?
Never argue with an idiot. They will drag you down to their level and then beat you with experience. - Mark Twain.

b789

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Never mind, I notice that it is not in Scotland where there is no keeper liability. Horizon are plain, outright lying by stating that only the driver can appeal to POPLA.

An immediate complaint to Horizon pointing out their blatant lie about only the driver being able to appeal to POPLA deserves an explanation and an apology. When you get a response to the complaint, you should report them to the BPA.

I also note another problem with the NtK in that the location is not defined as relevant land. I can enter "Parkhouse Business Centre" and get several locations throughout the country with that name. As there is ambiguity with the relevant land, it is just another point to use in your POPLA appeal.
« Last Edit: July 04, 2024, 09:05:32 pm by b789 »
Never argue with an idiot. They will drag you down to their level and then beat you with experience. - Mark Twain.

DWMB2

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An immediate complaint to Horizon pointing out their blatant lie about only the driver being able to appeal to POPLA deserves an explanation and an apology. When you get a response to the complaint, you should report them to the BPA.
Agreed - they're entirely misrepresenting the OP's position.

bobbyc009

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Never mind, I notice that it is not in Scotland where there is no keeper liability. Horizon are plain, outright lying by stating that only the driver can appeal to POPLA.

An immediate complaint to Horizon pointing out their blatant lie about only the driver being able to appeal to POPLA deserves an explanation and an apology. When you get a response to the complaint, you should report them to the BPA.

I also note another problem with the NtK in that the location is not defined as relevant land. I can enter "Parkhouse Business Centre" and get several locations throughout the country with that name. As there is ambiguity with the relevant land, it is just another point to use in your POPLA appeal.

I am glad I asked about this. I am of a nervous disposition so seeing things written in the manner which they are causes me to become quite anxious. They are effectively outright lying in order to scare people like myself. I will be complaining and reporting them as advised. Also thank you for the pointer regarding relevant land, this will be added to the appeal.

DWMB2

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I am of a nervous disposition so seeing things written in the manner which they are causes me to become quite anxious.
Exactly what they're hoping. BPA won't consider your complaint unless you have first complained to (and received a response from) Horizon, so do that before contacting BPA.

The main priority though is the POPLA appeal - try to find some examples on here and the MSE forum to help you with drafting, if necessary. Show us a draft before submitting anything so we can offer feedback. You should produce your appeal as a PDF document when you come to submit, then you can add images (of the signage, for example).

If you submit a robust appeal, there's a fair chance Horizon will withdraw to save them having to pay the POPLA fee.

bobbyc009

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I actually had another PCN from the week before for being parked in the same location but somehow missed the letter. Thankfully I saw it while trying to find the PCN for this appeal. I have appealed this other PCN using the first response on this thread, hopefully that should suffice. Interestingly on this occasion the charge was for parking outside of a marked bay rather than unauthorised parking. I have tried to put together a draft appeal for POPLA. Please find this here- https://smallpdf.com/file#s=fd4b9fe4-fe09-403c-9a75-b1ff959cfc4b, any and all advice would be welcome. Thank you.

H C Andersen

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OP, don't tell us what Horizon said in their response pl, show us.