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Messages - Cant Park Anywhere Mate

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Hi all, just a quick one to say, the RK finally submitted the appeal today (14th September). The appeal rejection letter said " You have 28 days from the date of this letter to submit an appeal to POPLA", and the letter was dated 18th August so +28 days = 15th September. So, cutting it fine but, submitted in time.



Anyway, the POPLA form was pretty straightforward. The final reply was tweaked slightly, namely to remove any "I"s which might ruin everything. A paragraph was also added to clarify the sign wording also, which states "60 minutes free parking. charges apply to all vehicles after 60 minutes". And the fact that any reasonable person would interpret this as "pay for hours after the free one".


Below is the appeal submitted to POPLA in full:


Spoiler (hover to show)


And now we wait!

2
Thanks b789, good catch! I stayed up late to write it so I mgith have done so elsewhere; I'll review before submitting

All alright otherwise though? Sorry it's so long. Guess it's moot as they'll likely just decline that appeal anyway.

I'll have another crack at the consultation in a couple hours



Edit: There were about 38 questions in the consultation, and most required in-depth reading of various parts of code and the minutae of the changes the government proposed amendments... gah!

they also extended the consultation until the 26th September without informing me! So for others reading: you still have time.

They musty have extended it literally at the 11th hour: the email received last night, when "save and come back  later" was selected, said "You have until the close date of 5 Sep 2025 to submit your response.".

But sitll now it is 26th Septembe r- guess I had time to complete it properly after all!! Link: https://www.gov.uk/government/consultations/private-parking-code-of-practice


I finished it at 00:17 on 26th September so it might not even count, but the response did go through. I skipped the last 10 or so quesitons due to running out of time; if I hadn't, it would easily have been 3-4 hours of work! They could have told us how many Qs there would be, how long to allow...


Main things form my point of bview were:

1. Unfair PCNs

2. The keeper avoids private car parks as much as possible because they know they operate unfairly e.g. no known grace period so if one enters one then leaves, one may get stung anyway, and things like parking but overstaying by even 0.01 seconds would result in the same charge as overstaying by 9 hours would

3. The fact both appeals feel entirely like hoops to jump throiugh which are never taken seriously and alwayus auto-rejected. Case in point: I found 0 threads on this forum where an appeal at either stage were successful; I know 0 people who have successfully appealed; all news articles about unfair parking charges include the infamous "appeal was rejected" line; I've never heard of any other outcome than "appeal rejected£". And yet they try and say 1. POPLA is independent and 2. appeals are taken seriously.


Anyway, hopefully it actually submitted. The Keeper genuinely does avoid private car parks with ANPR cameras, and this PCN from the one time I caved and used one, one of the few I've ever used, is like vindication to be honest.


/rant

3
Right I've just been doing the Private Parking (Code of Practice) Act 2019 Public Consultation as it closes at 23:59 on 5th September, i..e in less than 24 hours

Does anyone know how many quesitons there are? I'm 9 questions in, I see up to Q14 on the current page, and  I've been at it for an hour already; it's way past bed time now. The response involves reading several pages of context info before answering each quesiton as well; I'm nodding off at my desk, here!


All I really wanted to say in it, was that I actively avoid ANPR car parks because I'm worried i'll receive a PCN in bas faith. It just so happened that I was right to be worried: per this thread, I did eventually get stung by using an ANPR car park normally.

Sometimes if I am forced to enter suhc a car park, then leave due to lack of parking or what have you, I am left worrying for days after, whether tor ot they might fine me for "parking" despite not even parking, because yes they do work like that, yes thhey absolutely would call my 5mph drive around the car park before leaving, "parking without paying"...



Anyway, pleas let me know if you recall how many Qs the public consultation has!

Link: https://www.gov.uk/government/consultations/private-parking-code-of-practice

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Hi, I'm back - I finally got round to amending the appeal. I've added thhe "here's what POFA sayus, and here's what TCP actually did" section. I also tweaked some other bits to suit. Please let me know what you think!

I mean, I know POPLA will reject it as well anywya, but still!

Many thanks - hope I'm not too late for the parking consultation response, which is my next job (sorry if I am!!)



Revised v2 Intended POPLA Appeal in Spoiler:

Spoiler (hover to show)

5
Hi, I've had a review of the forum to put together a reponse.


Firstly, I forgot to say: the appeal rejection letter included phtoos of the signage on site in daylight, dated 14th november 2023 (dates in French for some reason)

As below, is it alright to reference their photos of the signage? Their several phtoos match my 1 photo.


Below is my intended POPLA appeal, which I admit I've been a bit lazy: It is mostly just a copy paste of b789's first reply in this thread, with following changes:

- Added the first line, inspired by the 2nd thread linked below, as an introduction

- Removed the reference to the man on the Clapham omnibus

- Added "I quote" to the 2nd para.

- Added text italicised, to address the original appeal (added only latter 2 paragraphs of original appeal, removed the bit about having "no hope at POPLA, re-organised as bullets), and its rejection


- After that, I've included a summary of their rejection, and why I think it's essentially just a "nuh uh" reply

- At the very end, as italicised, "find attached the relevant info"


Intended POPLA Appeal in Spoiler:
Spoiler (hover to show)



_______________________________________


I must admit I've been a bit lazy for a few reasons:

1. As b789 said, their original reply includes all the relevant detail, and it is better written than anything I'd have come up with,

2. I explored other threads, linked below: frequently things played out differently to my own case, such that the POPLA appeal either was different/not applicable, or absent e.g. thread starts with debt collectors's letter/past the point of POPLA. So has less luck with those than with the reply already provided


Some of the threads I explored:

CSPM Merrywalks park GL5 - Debt collectors jumped the gun with a letter during the "cool-off" time after the first appeal. Anyway, OP's appeal references the usual POFA 2012 paragraph 8 section 4 etc. So far the most relevant thread, which I've used.

The vech vehicle was parked in an an area dis designated for registered users only Related to a stopped delivery van not parking but I pinched the initial appeal sentence from here.

Horizon Parking - Barn Hoppitt - Epping Forest - Too early, no POPLA advice yet


PCN CUP Enforcement 6 months late - No POPLA code (too late) so no POPLA appeal

Euro Car Parks - DCBL Debt Recovery - As above, late/recurring debt, no POPLA appeal

UK Parking Control -- Parking Out Of Hours -- Money Claim Issued - Too far down the line, court next. Check back in on 17th September.


There was another one with an appeal to the other one, ICP I think, not POPLA, which I leeft alone in case of baked-in procedural differences. b789 I saw you in all of the above threads! And jfollows in many as well - thank you both especially for all the time you dedicate to this!



Closing questions:

1. Please let me know your thoughts on "my" intended appeal wording

2. I have not clicked through on POPLA yet to see what their appeal form looks like - I assume I'll be able to attach files

2a. I was going to attach the same files included in my OP: the sign photos, and the confirmation emmail of payment via the Parkonomy website. I presume that's wise

2b. Do I need to attach a scan/photo of the PCN letter or will they already have that?

2c. Same for the TCP appeal and their rejection: do I need to upload that or will they already have it?

2d. Also, in the above, I've assumed they can see the TCP rejection so I haven't repeated it all - is that okay?


Thank you!

6
...unjust parking fines, and to redress the balance in these "David vs Goliath" fights.

And this is another reason why far too many people get in a panic about these PCNs. If you can find the word "fine" anywhere in all the paperwork, I will give you £100 for every occurrence.



Good point - Invoice, not fine!


Quote

Click the link in my signature if you can find the time to take part in the ongoing government consultation about the upcoming legislation that will finally throttle this rogue industry.



I'll definitely give that a look! Thank you - Even before the date of this incident, I'm always nervous of any predatory car park with the threatening signs of being run by some company itching to hand out a PCN via ANPR readings, because I feel like even my presence could be viewed as a contravention, e.g. stopping to look for spaces then leaving, etc... Generally I avoid such car parks altogether.

7
Hi all,


As expected, TCP rejected the appeal. The full response is copied below, with identifying info removed, and line breaks added where the text editor removed them (but typos etc. left in).


Needless to say, next step is an appeal via POPLA. Please let me know if their response materially changes anything - the POPLA appeal will likely be tomorrow.






Spoiler tags might not work on this forum - here goes:



Spoiler (hover to show)

8
Hi everyone, sorry for the silence. I last checked back on the forum before I'd had any replies and was busy until now-ish.

Thank you to everyone that has replied, even those who said the appeal is likely to be rejected because it's good to know the methods TCP might use!

The registered keeper submitted an appeal today using the quote kindly provided above by b789. There was no embellishment, and no attachments were included. The appeal identified the RK only, not the driver.

The RK understands that today is the last day to appeal within 14 days before the fine ratchets up to £100, too.


The RK wants to extend their thanks to all of you, and especially b789 who broke down the legislation clearly, thoroughly, and provided a concise rebuttal to this matter.

The RK would very likely not have figured all this out re. legislation gaps and non-compliance by TCP, certainly not within a reasonable amount of hours vs. just paying the fine. The RK is cognizent that this means the parking giants can win by exploiting the fact that the ordinary citizen isn't well versed in law, specifically that regarding parking fines.

So the RK would also like to thank this entire forum for creating the resource that allows normal people to be assisted by thoose informed on the matter, to share the most successful angles of defence against believed-unjust parking fines, and to redress the balance in these "David vs Goliath" fights.

Thank you!


ETA: I'll come back when the RK receives a response to the appeal, of course!

9
The letter (please say if any info is left uncensored):








_______________________________________________________


This is in relation to a parking charge letter received from Total Car Parks by the registered keeper today, 11th August. Letter is dated 5th August, and concerns an event on 1st August.



The car park: Gorleston High Street Shopping Centre car park. Address: 8 Duke Road, Gorleston-on-Sea, Great Yarmouth, Norfolk, NR31 6RL (NB: Google Maps says the postcode is NR31 6LL, however the letter and parking payment confirmation email say it is NR31 6RL)


It is the larger of the two car parks of the same/similar name; both are managed by Total Car Parks (TCP), both have the reference 8017; the one of concern is the larger one, behind Farmfoods, and has the Instavolt charging within it (see below link).


Here is a Google Maps link to the car park with signage photographed (although the photo is from July 2023, there is a picture of the same signage, taken 1st August, at the bottom of this post - not a great photo, but still)


The event


On 1st August 2025, the driver parked in Gorleston High Street Shopping Centre car park, arriving around 8.30pm (this aligns with what TCP claim). The car park offers 1 hour of free parking, and thereafter is is £1.60 for up to 2 hours, £2.60 for up to 4 hours.


The driver attempted to buy a pay-and-display ticket but the on-site payment machine did not accept card, so they photographed the sign and opted to pay later once the free hour ran out, via the Parkonomy app/website as advertised by the signage. Just before the free hour expired, the driver used the Parkonomy website to add time by paying for 2 hours of parking, setting the start time to 9.20pm and the end time to 11.20pm. Thus, paying for an extra 2 hours on top of the free 1 hour.


They received a confirmation email for this, dated 9.19pm (thus showing payment was made before the free hour expired). The email shows 2 hours of time paid for, the cost of £1.75 (included SMS alert and booking fee), and the inputted start and end times (9.20pm; 11.20pm).

Edit: A screenshot of the payment confirmation email is now included at the bottom of this post.


The driver later got in the car in question and left the car park at 11.15pm, before the 11.20pm deadline (this aligns with the exit time of the letter).



In spite of the driver paying for 2 hours over and above the free 1 hour, the registered keeper received the attached letter demanding a £100 payment. The stated contravention is: "Paid less than displayed tariff".


The registered keeper truly feels the fine is entirely unjust: the driver paid for the time that the car was parked for. And had appropriate payment machines been installed, the driver could have paid using Contactless, rather than retroactively via a website, which may be what has triggered this letter.


So far, they have taken no action; below is the plan:


The registered keeper intends to appeal this letter, first via the TCP appeals process. If this is rejected, they shall appeal to the arbitrator POPLA (on reverse side of letter), even if doing so forfeits the chance of paying the reduced £60.


The registered keeper would appreciate assistance in how to appeal on both fronts (both to TCP and to POPLA).


Should both appeals be rejected, they seek further advice on what happens next:


1. Would it be a court appearance (they are willing to attend court in person)


2. Should it come to court: should they appoint a solicitor? if not, any relevant case references?


3. Should the court rule against them, it is appreciated they will have to pay coiurt costs as the losing party: roughly how much that might be, e.g. from past similar cases?


Please see below partial photograph of signage, taken on 1st August (unfortunately it only captures 1 of the 2 signs but see Google Maps link above for both signs)


Many thanks for reading all this!


Edit: Gaps between paragraphs reduced ("preview" strips away al line breaks!)




Payment confirmation email:


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