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Messages - holycow

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1
FYI, these order for recovery came through. How can I send the PE3 by email? To what email address?
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1N0MRZJXFKj6aAbOizukWAWdx3dXseh25/view?usp=drivesdk

2
Yes I did:
1. Informal challenge in June and I requested the DVD
2. formal challenge in late September after getting the enforcement notice. They actually blocked me from submitting it online so I had to post the paper one!

They supposedly rejected my formal challenge on 8 oct but neglected to tell me of this before issuing the charge certificate.

It looks like they are playing very dirty but I don't see how I can prove it or what I can do about it :(

PCN status history on TFL.gov.uk here: https://drive.google.com/file/d/1whJEgIJGb9XDTfzHqF19W9ZN15K0xb0X/view?usp=drivesdk

4
Interesting - I actually don't seem to have the option to challenge online anymore. Procedural impropriety?

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1g_ELcAAhBkVkwXOxl6PixejXtUx0eiE2/view?usp=drivesdk

https://tfl.gov.uk/modes/driving/challenge-a-pcn

5
Any advice much appreciated

6
Enforcement notice now received. Do I appeal with the same as before?

https://drive.google.com/file/d/14BSTkl80yYr-_c_8c8w-PGdMuL9gC25z/view?usp=drivesdk

7
They've finally rejected my informal appeal (attached). Should I formally appeal with the same?

8
Speeding and other criminal offences / 24mph in 20mph zone
« on: July 21, 2025, 12:35:14 pm »
Hi everyone,

Driver clocked doing 24mph in 20mph zone. Speed course has been offered. Am I right in thinking that there aren't really any technicalities that can be appealed on (e.g. camera authorisation...etc)?

Thanks

9
The adjudicator dismissed the appeal. Is there anything else that can be done?

"It is important that the Appellant understands that the adjudicator is not in a position to give his legal advice. The adjudicator's role is to look at whether the parking charge has a basis in law and was properly issued in the circumstances of each particular case. The adjudicator's decision is not legally binding on the Appellant (it is intended to be a guide) and they are free to obtain independent legal advice if they so wish. However, the adjudicator is legally qualified (a barrister or solicitor) and decides the appeal according to their understanding of the law and legal principles.

The terms of this appeal are that I am only allowed to consider the charge being appealed and not the circumstances of other drivers or other parking events. The guidance to this appeal also makes it clear that I am bound by the law of contract and can only consider legal challenges not mistakes or extenuating circumstances. I am satisfied that the Operator's signage, which was on display throughout the site, makes it sufficiently clear that the terms and conditions are in force at all times and that a PCN will be issued to drivers who fail to comply with the terms and conditions, regardless of a driver's reasons for being on site or any mitigating factors. While noting their comments, it is clear from the evidence provided to this appeal that the Appellant did indeed enter and use the site otherwise than in accordance with the displayed terms by failing to ensure that their vehicle was properly registered with a valid E-permit or exemption on this occasion, having been allowed an adequate consideration period prior to the charge being issued. It is the driver's (rather than a third party's) responsibility to ensure that the terms and conditions of parking are properly complied with. I am satisfied on the evidence provided that the Operator has the authority to issue and enforce PCNs at this site. I am further satisfied as to the location of the contravention, that the correct vehicle has been identified entering and exiting the chargeable area at the times suggested in the images provided and that the correct Appellant is pursued.

I am satisfied that the Operator has proven their prima facie case. Whilst having some sympathy with the Appellant's circumstances, once liability has been established, only the Operator has the discretion to vary or cancel the parking charge based on mitigating circumstances. Accordingly this appeal is dismissed.
"

10
Finally found my portable DVD drive. Can't believe TFL opt to waste time and money burning and posting CD's, rather than simply emailing the 1.3mb video file .


That exit is absolutely atrocious with regular half an hour tailbacks.

The bus lane literally only serves one bus (No. 173) and is empty 99% of the time. There was no enforcement on the bus lane (for us) right up until our recent sign up to TFL's auto-pay scheme! (I know it doesn't make any sense  ;D )

I know none of this is really relevant but I'm just providing context...

https://drive.google.com/file/d/13FaxhTZupe5ZqmcRpErf27DUR-elJoAP/view?usp=drivesdk

11
The operator made their response on 30/06/2025 11:57:51.


We re-iterate our prima facie points,

We are not legally required to provide commercially sensitive information to the appellant and the appellants understanding of such legal requirements are fundamentally flawed.

If the charge progresses to court and is order, then all documents can be provided
Response to Operator

12
The operator made their IAS response on 24/06/2025 09:13:10.


We re-iterate our prima facie points.

There is no requirement or obligation to provide evidence for 'independent verification'. It is non-sensical to assume that signage can be erected and enforcement can take place without authority.

Evidence of our landowner authority has been provided to the IAS and therefore it is not unverified as the Independent adjudicator will verify its validity. Thus the appellants assertions regarding this and indeed their only point of appeal for not complying with the terms and conditions of site, as is their responsibility, is not relevant nor does it affect the validity of the charge.

By parking on site and making use of the facilities without valid digital parking session or being registered with a valid OPS E-permit the appellant is in direct contravention to the terms and conditions of the site and therefore contractually agree to pay a parking charge.

13
We have informally appealed with:

"I make this initial challenge as follows:

The PCN is unenforceable because:

1. The reference to The Interpretation Act is both irrelevant and confusing as the legislation pertaining to Bus Lane enforcement refers to actions which may be taken by the authority and/or appellant from the date of the notice.

2. The statement: "Any written correspondence received before the issue of the Enforcement Notice will not be treated as a formal representation." fetters discretion and is contrary to the legislation in that it clearly implies that you will send an Enforcement Notice when the legislation states "may" at 4(3)(e)

https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukla/1996/9/section/4/enacted

3. The statement: "It will not entitle you to the right of appeal." is both absurd and flies in the face of the law and natural justice. Further, the next statement about consideration seems to contradict what has been previously stated.

4. The statement: "Failure to respond or contact us within 28 days of the service date of this notice will result in the Enforcement Notice automatically being sent to you after this period." similarly fetters discretion and also misstates the time period.

5. The tfl.gov.uk/red-routes web address provided for paying the PCN is incorrect and results in a "sorry, this page cannot be found".

6. The alleged contravention did not occur:
The embedded photograph on the PCN  lacks any proof of relevant signage either passed or in situ.

Camera authorisation

I put you to strict proof that the camera used to capture the alleged contravention has the correct certification. If this is not forthcoming, this will be another ground of appeal.

In light of the above, please cancel the PCN.

I also request video footage of the alleged contravention to be sent to me"

14
Apologies, I completely missed that the operator actually provided a written response as well:

"The operator made their Prima Facie Case on 13/06/2025 16:56:48.

The operator reported that...
The appellant was the keeper.
The operator is seeking keeper liability in accordance with PoFA..
ANPR/CCTV was used.
The Notice to Keeper was sent on 09/05/2025.
A response was received from the Notice to Keeper.
The ticket was issued on 02/05/2025.
The Notice to Keeper (ANPR) was sent in accordance with PoFA.
The charge is based in Contract.

The operator made the following comments...
We note the appellants comments, however it does not exempt them from the terms and conditions of the site. It is the motorists responsibility to ensure that upon parking on private land that they review the terms and conditions of the site and park accordingly. The displayed terms state that parking is only permitted for vehicles with a Valid Digital Parking Session purchased through POPPAY with the full and correct VRM or vehicles who's VRM have been entered into the clubhouse tablet or Vehicles registered with a valid OPS E-permit.

The contravention photos provided show that the vehicle parked on site on site for in excess of 49 minutes. The exemption and payment data provided shows that no payment or exemption was registered for the appellants vehicle and therefore it was not permitted to be parked on site.

We acknowledge the appellants comments, however the assertions made do not affect the validity of the charge. The site and signage have all been approved by the IPC and therefore are compliant.

The IAS has sight of our landowner contract which shows that we have the appropriate landowner authority to enforce parking on site. The contract contains sensitive commercial data and therefore does not need to be provided to the appellant unless ordered by the court.

The Notice to Keeper is POFA compliant and therefore the registered keeper can be held liable for the charge.

By parking on site and making use of the facilities without valid digital parking session or being registered with a valid OPS E-permit the appellant is in direct contravention to the terms and conditions of the site and therefore contractually agree to pay a parking charge."

15
Hi legends,

TFL Bus lane PCN received for A13 Beckton exit
https://maps.app.goo.gl/unAxoYtNrwpiHoSy6?g_st=ac
No contravention video available, just images.

In 2022 we appealed a bus lane PCN on the grounds of "camera authorisation". Barking and Dagenham council failed to contest the appeal at London tribunals so we won by default. Is the "camera authorisation" angle still the way to go, now?

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