Free Traffic Legal Advice

Next time you go to any airport without a barrier system, but where they still want to extort money from motorists, you don't have to pay. All you do is wait for the Notice to Keeper and appeal only as the Keeper without blabbing the drivers identity, inadvertently or otherwise. You simply remind APCOA or whichever unregulated private parking company is running the scam, that you refer them to the answer given in Arkell v Pressdram (1971) because they can only hold the driver liable and you, the Keeper, are under no legal obligation to identify the driver to a private company for an alleged contravention that took place on 'non relevant land'.

Even if you did nothing and ignored everything that comes your way, such as powerless debt recovery threats and such, nothing would happen because APCOA are benign and do not litigate.

It's your money.

Thanks. All clear advice. I think on this one however I have jumped the gun and named the driver but will bear in mind for the future.

You need to search the forum because I’m not going to do it for you, but if you appeal, the appeal will be rejected, then you’ll get letters from debt collectors with increasing amounts and scary words like “CCJ”. Eventually they’ll give up.

The notice probably doesn’t comply with the requirements of PoFA 2012, it seems only to have some bits, you you may get POPLA to cancel the charge on a second appeal on this basis, as long as you don’t name the driver. However your email to them has implicitly identified the driver.

PoFA only comes into its own if the driver is not known, by transferring liability to the registered keeper. It looks as if they know who both of them are now.

Fair enough. I might just pay it while it is a small charge to make it go away....

Currently APCOA do not “do” court. Was your complaint taken as an appeal, what did you say in it?

If you didn’t appeal, there are sample APCOA/Stansted appeals here.

This was my email...., I hadnt received the 'Parking Charge' as it was 4 days after I went to Stansted.

Dear Sir/Madam,

Hope you are well. I was late to pay my express drop off charge at Stansted, it is my first time there since the new system in place. I understand that the option to pay £7 has been removed in the last two weeks? So now I have to pay £25. This feels unfair as it was my first time even if the system has been in place for a few months now, seeing as I and other users of the airport may not have been there in this time we would be unaware and unused to it. I am asking if in this instance only as a gesture of good will could I still make the payment of £7?

My registration is......

I look forward to hearing from you


In your experience if I do appeal, what normally happens then, will I still be bombarded with letters etc. Will they write and say they will drop the matter?

Quote from: WaltWhite on April 14, 2025, 12:31:11 pm

Hi

This is not correct any more at Stansted, the barriers have been removed for express drop off and pick up. Perhaps since the start of this year

Quote from: baroudeur on April 08, 2025, 12:02:37 pm

All Stansted parking is barrier controlled.

It seems that the op has his vehicle registered to an account with Stansted Airport parking which allows entry/exit to the car parks and payment to be made later via his account.  On this occasion he hasn't paid in time.

As a regular visitor to the airport it may have been wiser to have set up the account with auto-pay.

Edit: to clarify

Thank you for that update.  It went barrierless on 23rd January and is now pay online.

Rather fortunately, as a regular visitor I have already opened an account with Stanstead (and Luton) although I wasn't aware that it had gone barrierless since my last visit in December. My next trip should have been last week but another relative made the drop off

No problem. For a while they were offering those that forgot to pay on the first occasion a chance to pay £7 after receiving a Parking Charge letter. Now this has gone up to £25 if you pay within 14 days. A shame as I think if you go over the Dartford Bridge the first time without paying you get the chance to pay later....

The OP said reps were sent, whether they were made is to be determined. We don't know to what email address, how this was obtained, from whom, with what assurances, if any, their form and when.

OP, pl let's try and establish these details pl.

Or is this is now off thread?

From page 3 of this thread....
Given the email address by someone else in this thread
From:
Sent: 17 December 2024 23:06
To: Parking and Traffic Enforcement <parkingandtrafficenforcement@redbridge.gov.uk>; Parking and Traffic Enforcement <highways.parkingappeals@redbridge.gov.uk>; Parking and Traffic Enforcement <highways.parkingmanagement@redbridge.gov.uk>
Subject: Representations AF3....... (tried to submit this via website on 15th Dec)


Dear Sir Madam,

I am writing to formally challenge the Penalty Charge Notice (PCN) number AF...... issued to myself for allegedly failing to comply with traffic restrictions on Cleveland Rd, Ilford IG1. I believe that this charge has been unfairly issued and wish to present my case for your consideration.

Firstly the sign indicating the restriction against traffic is not of the 'hinged' type that should be only visible during School Term Time. This type of sign has not received authorisation as suitable signage to traffic outside of the School zone, from the Department of Transport, rending the PCN here null and void.

Secondly when attempting to make an online representation against this PCN, the website fetters discretion with regards to the grounds allowed. The LB Redbridge website indicates which grounds will not be considered here, and a public body should not adopt such a rigid policy that prevents it from exercising discretion in individual cases. I attach screenshots from the LB Redbridge website.

Finally the online representation page fetters to only one ground only for representation. Again this is unfair and does not allow for proper consideration of the possible grounds for a PCN to be contested. I also attach screenshots from the LB Redbridge website.

I look forward to hearing from you at your earliest convenience.

Kind regards,

It seems a complaint to the LGO is required, this will be far easier if I do it for you, so I'm going to drop you a PM.

Received today

Received today....

I have received this response to my Stage 2 complaint. I sent me complaint in yesterday and received this at 9.03 am today:

Date: 15 January 2025
 
Dear Mr
 
Thank you for your recent letter dated requesting escalation of your complaint to Stage 2 of the Complaints Procedure.
 
I am very sorry to hear that you are not happy with the reply you received from Gurpreet Kohli concerning the points raised in your original complaint.
 
I am writing to give you our response to your complaint received on 14 January 2025.

The contravention took place on 4th November 2024, for entering a pedestrian zone.   We contacted the DVLA and obtained the name and address of the registered keeper on on the 13th November 2024. 

 
 
The PCN was then issued on 13th November 2024, and printed on 14th November 2024.  You have 14 days from the date of 14th November to pay the reduced amount or 28 days from the 14th November 2024 to make representation.
 
The following is taken from government website:-Parking fines and penalty charge notices: Challenging a ticket - GOV.UK
 

 
The 28th day to make representation was 12th December 2024, as no payment or representation was received, on the 13th December 2024 a Charger Certificate was issued.
 
As the Charge Certificate was issued on the 13th December 2024 you are past the point where a representation can be made, hence why you were unable to make representation online.
 
This is our final response to your complaint/ appeal. You may now complain to the Local Government and Social Care Ombudsman. The Ombudsman is not a further appeal. It looks at whether public bodies have followed the right steps when taking action or reaching a decision.
The Ombudsman decides whether it can and should investigate complaints. For example, the Ombudsman may decide not to investigate your complaint if you have not been significantly personally affected by the issue you are raising. You can find out more information about what complaints the Ombudsman may consider on its website.

If you wish to raise your complaint with the Ombudsman you can find out more information about how to do so below:

Website:  https://www.lgo.org.uk/how-to-complain

Telephone: 0300 061 0614

Quote from: WaltWhite on January 14, 2025, 02:25:38 pm

Quote from: cp8759 on January 14, 2025, 11:04:15 am

@WaltWhite PCN debts do not appear on your credit history nor anywhere else, an Order for Recovery is not a CCJ and they do not have to be declared anywhere at all.

Thank you @cp8759 that is reassuring. Most appreciated.

The legal process was deliberately set up to avoid the county courts. That's why there is the Traffic Enforcement Centre. It is a form of county court, but with no courtrooms, and no judges too. Judges only become involved with reviews of TEC decisions. Of course this hasn't stopped councils intimidating people by putting 'county court' on their enforcement documents.

Thanks. What about this 'if the order of recovery is not complied with a warrant will be issued by the county court and bailiff action will commence'. I dont want bailiffs knocking on my door. Im just aware of how slow this complaints process is and that this is running along side at the same time....