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Messages - Strawberries007

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1
Private parking tickets / Re: Parking Charge Notice Received.
« on: April 21, 2024, 02:56:37 am »
Thank you.
I've updated based on the helpful points you raised.

2
Private parking tickets / Re: Parking Charge Notice Received.
« on: April 20, 2024, 03:16:48 am »
Thank you.
I've managed to redact their submitted evidence and uploaded here.

Here's the PCN that was issued https://ibb.co/album/Hp1RMf
Here is their evidence pack sent to POPLA. https://ibb.co/238C06R

Please see posted earlier but here for ease of reference:
https://ibb.co/YDCg3MJ operator's response.
Operator Contract https://ibb.co/F5vKLGJ
Operator's Photo Pack https://ibb.co/WDXCx6f
Sunday evening is my deadline to submit my comments to their evidence.

3
Private parking tickets / Re: Parking Charge Notice Received.
« on: April 19, 2024, 09:27:10 am »
Thank you. I suspect I read somewhere that the one jas a maximum of 1000 words. So as I'd already stated and quoted these provisions and made the points in my appeal I wasn't going to reproduce in full again but shall prioritise that following your comment.

4
Private parking tickets / Re: Parking Charge Notice Received.
« on: April 19, 2024, 03:03:24 am »
I received a link to the operator's evidence pack on Monday so I need to reply by Sunday night.
Please see operator's response here.
Operator contract.
Operator's Photo Pack.

My response in draft. Also below.

I write in response to Premier Park Ltd’s (PP) evidence pack.

The PCN does not comply with POFA 2012 Para 9(2)(a) as it fails to name the relevant place. See para 1 of my appeal.

This road is North St. It is not Market Hall. The post code named as the “relevant place” CV21 2JR is Market Place and is over 100ms from the road between 9 (Nat west) and 11(vacant) 13 (New Look) North Road CV21 2AH which is the location of the road in the photos.

PP may monitor the road, but the fact remains that the address stipulated on the PCN is incorrect.

My para 3 has not been rebutted. The Order Form is not signed by the landowner. There’s no proof that the Customer named on the Order Form is the landowner of this road. There’s no land owner contract showing the landowner’s signature, name of the authorised signatory, director or secretary.

There is no proof that the “Customer “has the authority of the landowner. There is no proof of whether the Order Form/Contract was signed by the Owner, authorised representative or managing agent. There is no visible name or signature. The document was valid for a year.

PP have not provided evidence to rebut my para 9 regarding alteration of photos. This violates British Parking Association (BPA) Code of Practice Section 21.5a. As these are not the original images, the NtK is therefore invalid. PP Limited should have produced evidence of the original "un-cropped" images containing the required date and time stamp to evidence where the photographs show the car to be when there is a lack of any marker or sign to indisputably relate these photos to the location stated. They must prove the above statements otherwise. Alteration to any degree is prohibited and calls all images into question rendering the NtK non-compliant. February 2024 POPLA decision citing similar issue as reason for allowing the appeal. Code 2413353469

PP has not proved the accuracy of their camera’s timing to rebut my defence. See para 10. Surveillance cameras whether APNR and CCTVs must be independently calibrated, audited and checked. PP is put to strict proof that the surveillance system has not failed motorists within this site. It cannot be assumed that the camera and timing is correct. I’m not a surveillance operative. I use APNR to mean cameras used by parking operators to record cars. I was not driving so I don’t know what type of camera was used.

It is unreasonable to expect the driver to park and call to find out the privacy policy. This will only further allow PP to claim parking or waiting in a no parking zone. It will take the driver considerable time to search online and read the policy. Perhaps this is what the driver was doing at the time. The text on the sign is too small.

 

PP have not provided any photo showing the driver exiting the vehicle yet the PCN was issued for “Parking In A No Parking Area” and for “parking in breach of parking terms”.

The PCN should have been worded as “Waiting” as there is no proof the driver left the car at any time. They have showed the car waiting but the PCN claims “Parking”.

There was no entry sign and this makes driver susceptible to driving in as prey. PP state that their entrance signs are compliant with BPA but there’re no warning entrance signs. They also state an entrance sign is included in the image pack but as can be seen there is none.

Para 12. There is no proof of consent to advertise on the signs nor of Planning Permission. This is a criminal offence and POPLA should not allow PP to benefit from illegality.

PP have failed to establish keeper liability as the Notice to Keeper was not fully compliant with POFA 2012 legislation. They have failed to comply with paragraph 8, section (2)(a) which very clearly states: specify the vehicle, the relevant land on which it was parked and the period of parking to which the notice relates.

The Order Form is not signed by the landowner. There’s no proof that the Customer is the landowner of this road. There’s no land owner contract showing the landowner’s signature, name of the authorised signatory, director or secretary.

The photos supplied of the signs are stock copies of signs instead of photos of the actual signs on site. The remainder are from over two years ago. They’re unclear, illegible, nothing to show how close the car was to a sign and apart from the entrance photo are of another location. See my paragraphs 4 and 5.

I'm on the road all of today but shall work on it on Saturday.

 I'll be most grateful for your comments.

5
Private parking tickets / Almost Final Popla Appeal Premier Parking.
« on: March 29, 2024, 02:05:37 am »
My almost final Popla Appeal, thanks to everyone!

6
Private parking tickets / Re: Parking Charge Notice Received.
« on: March 28, 2024, 06:22:18 pm »
If anyone can please confirm my last day for submission.
Here is the back of the Ntk.

Thanks.

7
Private parking tickets / Re: Parking Charge Notice Received.
« on: March 28, 2024, 06:17:14 pm »
Many thanks.
I have effected the correction bar two points.
The recent POPLA judgement about digitally altered photos and the Consumer Rights Act.
I shall aim to do them latest tomorrow as I am delaying others waiting for me at the moment.

https://ibb.co/yBc8BBV

8
Private parking tickets / Re: Parking Charge Notice Received.
« on: March 28, 2024, 05:28:57 am »
Dear all,

Please see link to my POPLA appeal.

Your comments will be most appreciated.

I understand some are of the view there's no point but as I already missed the discount I thought to give it a shot.

PoPLA code received 26th Feb so I assume I have till Friday but prefer to submit tonight please.

Thank you.


Link to NtK here.

9
Private parking tickets / Re: Parking Charge Notice Received.
« on: March 26, 2024, 10:11:18 pm »
I wouldn't bother, IMO you're clutching at [pointless] straws which is a distraction.

Using the post code in GSV delineates an area immediately next to the Nat West. You won't win at IAS on such fine margins.

@b789, where does this appear in Schedule 4 either verbatim or its meaning?

the wording in the warning to the keeper does not strictly comply with PoFA, which it must do.

PoFA states:

9(1)A notice which is to be relied on as a notice to keeper for the purposes of paragraph 6(1)(b) is given in accordance with this paragraph if the following requirements are met.

.....
)warn the keeper that if, after the period of 28 days beginning with the day after that on which the notice is given—

(i)the amount of the unpaid parking charges specified under paragraph (d) has not been paid in full, and

(ii)the creditor does not know both the name of the driver and a current address for service for the driver,

the creditor will (if all the applicable conditions under this Schedule are met) have the right to recover from the keeper so much of that amount as remains unpaid;


'Warn', which can take on various forms. It does not have to state the words 'you are warned that....'.

The PCN says:
'You are advised that if ABC and DEF ..we will have the right to recover the unpaid charge from the keeper..'

This is a clear warning in anyone's language IMO.

Don't risk the discount on this point IMO.

Thanks. The discounted period ended a while back. I'm in the last couple of days left for POPLA appeal.

10
Private parking tickets / Re: Parking Charge Notice Received.
« on: March 26, 2024, 12:48:23 am »
The the parking firm under an obligation to write the correct address on the NtK?
Using Land Registry's Map Search there isn't any such address under that title. The closest is
MANAGEMENT SUITE, 19 MARKET MALL, THE CLOCK TOWERS SHOPPING CENTRE, RUGBY CV21 2JR
The NTK says Rugby Central Shopping Centre 19 Market Hall CV21 2JR. 

How do I prove there's no such place as 19 Market Hall at the Shopping Centre and if there is it's not where the car is photographed?
I've put together screenshots from the Land registry's site showing the closest description to the address on the NtK amongst the addresses listed under the title.

11
Private parking tickets / Re: Parking Charge Notice Received.
« on: March 25, 2024, 11:51:02 pm »
How do I prove the address of a location please?
The driver went into this side entrance by Natwest 9 North St, Rugby CV21 2AH
The NTK refers to it as Rugby Central Shopping Centre 19 Market Hall CV21 2JR.

CV21 2JR is show here.
Please see pdf image  showing the side entrance on North St beside Natwest (green line) where the car went a few feet, turn, waited then left (red line). I've put both images on the pdf showing the post codes on Google. Ofcourse Google could be wrong and it might be inadmissible in court but for certain, that road is North Rd not Market Hall.

12
Private parking tickets / Re: Parking Charge Notice Received.
« on: March 06, 2024, 12:00:34 am »
My appeal was rejected.

Below is their response.  I'll draft my POPLA appeal and post for comments.

PAYMENT DUE DATE: 11th March 2024

TOTAL AMOUNT DUE: £60.00

 

Dear xxx           

 

Thank you for your appeal against the above Parking Charge Notice (PCN) on behalf of the driver. We have carefully considered your appeal, however on this occasion the appeal has been rejected for the following reason;

                                                                                                                         

Whilst we note the comments and reason for appeal, as per our photographic evidence, the vehicle was parked in contravention of the advertised terms and conditions. As the vehicle was parked in an area where no parking is allowed, we can confirm that this PCN has been issued correctly.

You have now reached the end of our internal appeals procedure and therefore you now have two options; you can either pay or appeal to POPLA - you cannot do both:

You can pay the total amount due as shown above via the following payment options;

Call us on: 01302 513232
Pay online: www.pcnpayments.com
Send a postal order: Premier Park Ltd, PO Box 624, Exeter, EX1 9JG
Or, you can appeal to an Independent Appeals Service, POPLA (Parking on Private Land Appeals) using the POPLA reference code provided above. Please note, should you decide to appeal to POPLA and your appeal is subsequently rejected or you withdraw your appeal, the option to pay a discounted amount will no longer be available and the full amount of the PCN will become due. Please note, if you pay the PCN prior to appealing to POPLA, your appeal will be withdrawn as you will have accepted liability in full.

If you decide to appeal to POPLA, you will need to visit their website, www.popla.co.uk where further details of how to appeal (either online or by downloading the relevant forms) can be found. If you are unable to access their website, please call us for further information on how to obtain the forms. Please ensure your POPLA Reference Number, as noted above, is quoted on all correspondence to POPLA. You have 28 days from the date of this email to submit an appeal to POPLA. If you appeal to POPLA we will suspend recovery activity on the PCN and the charge will not increase until the appeal has been determined.

 By law we are also required to inform you that Ombudsman Services (www.ombudsman-services.org) provides an alternative dispute resolution service that would be competent to deal with your appeal. However, we have not chosen to participate in their alternative dispute resolution service. As such should you wish to appeal then you must do so to POPLA, as explained above.

If you do not make payment or submit an appeal to POPLA within the relevant timeframe, the outstanding PCN may be passed to our appointed debt collection agency for further action. All costs associated with this process will be added to the amount outstanding.


13
Private parking tickets / Re: Parking Charge Notice Received.
« on: February 18, 2024, 08:07:50 pm »
A couple of points after reviewing this thread… OP, you stated early on the following:

The driver and passenger went to pick up an order at the restaurant beside the Natwest bank.
From the cctv the wait was at least 15mins.

You then go on to state in your appeal:

The driver did not leave the car at any time nor turn off the engine of the car. The car was not parked and there was no intention to park at any time.

What exactly occurred? Did the driver park the car, switch off the engine and leave the car unattended for 15 minutes or was the car just stopped for a short duration in order to load or unload?

Would someone explain why the NTK is not compliant e.g. it was given in time, it contains the mandatory warning etc?

If it's compliant, then why is the OP claiming - without staring why - it is not?

I wrote early 9n in this thread that there could be a technical flaw with the NtK due to some wording without going into detail at this stage as it will not be for the PPC to determine. As far as I was concerned, there is only a requirement to raise the matter of the flawed NtK in order that it can be dealt with later by a legally trained mind, either at POPLA (questionable) or by a judge.

The technical point is that the wording in the warning to the keeper does not strictly comply with PoFA, which it must do.

PoFA paragraph 9(2) states that a NtK must-

9(2)(f) warn the keeper that if, after the period of 28 days…

The NtK does not warn the keeper. It advises the keeper.

Thank you B789 for your contribution.

The driver and passenger drove to the location in order to pick up an order at the restaurant.
I provided this background because you asked that I fill in some detail.

Can you please fill in some detail as to why the car was at that location? You say that the driver never left the car. However, that is irrelevant. How long was the car stopped, if at all, at that location?....
Was the driver picking up or dropping off a passenger?

The driver and passenger went to the location in the car. The passenger got out of the car and walked to the restaurant to pick up the order while the driver waited in the car. The wait was about 15mins.


Below is my intended reply.
I'll appreciate final comments please.
Thank you.


I appeal as the registered keeper.
I dispute your 'parking charge' and deny any liability or contractual agreement.  Further to, I will be making a complaint about your predatory conduct to your client landowner.

There will be no admissions as to who was driving and no assumptions can be drawn.
I am not obliged to identify the driver and decline to do so. You cannot transfer the driver’s purported liability to me. You have not served me with a Notice to Keeper (NtK) that strictly complies with Schedule 4 to the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012 (PoFA) and it is now too late to do so.

According to the driver, no contract could have been agreed as there were no signs that were prominent or even visible at the location, which is a breach of the BPA Code of Practice (CoP), section 19.2.
From the photos, it can be seen that the signs are beyond the gate and a camera mounted before the signs. This arrangement is evidently not in good faith as it all seems set to ambush the driver only for them to realise when it is too late.
The position of the signs does not give the driver an option to read the signs, terms and conditions decide whether or not they wish to enter into such “agreement”. By the time the driver gets to the signs, they’re already in.
Furthermore, according to your Parking Charge Notice (PCN), any signs at the location would have been “forbidding” if they stated “No Parking”, thus proving that there was no contract by conduct on offer.

Your PCN states that it is being issued because of “Parking In No Parking Area”.
The driver did not leave the car at any time nor turn off the engine of the car. The car was not parked.

The charge for parking could not have been agreed as there was no sign at the entrance of the road to that effect. This is in breach of BPA Code of Practice (CoP), section 19.1. “…. the driver should be made aware of from the start. You must use signs to make it easy for them to find out what your terms and conditions are.”

No entrance signs. This is in breach of S.19.2 BPA CoP.  “Entrance signs play an important part in establishing a parking contract and deterring trespassers. Therefore, as well as the signs you must have telling drivers about the terms and conditions for parking, you must also have a standard form of entrance sign at the entrance to the parking area. Entrance signs must tell drivers that the car park is managed and that there are terms and conditions they must be aware of. Entrance signs must follow some minimum general principles and be in a standard format”.
No contract to park could have been created or agreed. Therefore, there is no debt owed by the driver and I am not liable as the registered keeper.

I now require you to cancel the parking charge or issue me with a POPLA code where a trained assessor will likely agree with me that the PCN has not been issued correctly.

14
Private parking tickets / Re: Parking Charge Notice Received.
« on: February 09, 2024, 10:37:43 pm »
Noted. Shall remove the reference to the restaurant.
Is there any disadvantage to sending the appeal today? Ie 14 days not waiting till about the 28th day?

15
Private parking tickets / Re: Parking Charge Notice Received.
« on: February 09, 2024, 10:26:39 pm »
I can amend that to add that "the driver dropped off a passenger to pick up an order from the restaurant beside the Natwest bank on the premises".

Am I to submit my appeal by 11:59pm tonight?

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