Author Topic: Redbridge - Contravention Code 16. All signs obscured or painted over  (Read 3055 times)

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Hi All. Back again. This one is so frustrating.

The driver of the vehicle found a PCN attached to their windscreen when returning from a restaurant in Ilford, Redbridge. They do not visit this area very often so are unaware of restrictions in and around this area. However, they did check the signs upon entering the area and when parking.

PCN is shown at the bottom of this post. I've also uploaded all images I'll be referring to on google drive - hope that is ok: https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1z9bwDy9vIGG_g6Iz4Xxk2oU6r70GGKm7?usp=drive_link


The route the driver took to get to the parking space is shown in map.jpg. All of this is recorded on dashcam, with additional photos taken from the dashcam footage and from the passenger of the car taking photos after the PCN was found.

The driver turned from Ilford Lane into Jersey Road. The signs upon entry are obscured. All of the signs on jersey road are also obscured, some of which are shown in the photos, but all can be clearly seen in the dashcam footage. These are photos 1 to 5 in the google drive link.

The driver then turned left briefly onto Lowbrook Road and then right into Paget Road - where the parking space is immediately on the left after the double yellow lines.

The photo google street view.jpg shows what the parking restriction sign should have looked like. But if you look at photo 6 - driving into paget road.jpg, you can see that the sign is facing in the wrong direction. Photo 7 - paget road sign.jpg shows the sign from the other side and it is obscured. This is next to the space the driver parked.

Photo 8 - paget road looking at lowbrook road.jpg shows the sign located on Lowbrook Road opposite the parking space, which is also obscured. Photo 9 - lowbrook road.jpg is a sign a little further down on Lowbrook Road which is also obscured.

Point being none of the signs on approach to parking, at the parking spot, or when walking away from the parking spot were visible or legible. I dont have evidence of signs further along Lowbrook Road, but the driver has confirmed that they were obscured as well.

The PCN evidence the enforcement officer has uploaded shows a clearly legible sign. This is photo 10 - PCN Evidence Photo.jpg. However, I have located this sign on Google Street View and it is quite some considerable distance down Paget Road. You can see how far down in 11 - PCN Evidence Location.jpg. Unfortunately, the driver did not go down there to verify this sign.

Google street view of sign taken photo of: https://tinyurl.com/2dnfhwwt

It's interesting the enforcement officer chose this sign to photograph so far along. There is a sign closer to the parking spot, which I am guessing was also obscured, so they did not choose to use that as evidence. However, the driver has no evidence of this and the location is quite far for them to go back and check.

The evidence photos the enforcement officer uploaded conveniently fail to show the sign right next to the parked vehicle, nor the signs opposite on Lowbrook Road. This seems to me to be deliberate.
EDIT - in fact, the last photo taken of the vehicle is at 13:00:46. The photo taken of the legible sign is at 13:03:59. The enforcement officer had to walk for over 3 minutes to find a legible sign to take a photo of.

After finding the PCN, the driver stopped to speak to an enforcement officer who was nearby (he may not have been the same person who issued the ticket). He confirmed that the signs being obscured were known to Redbridge Council and they they would be sending someone to replace them. Why they are issuing tickets whilst the signs are obscured seems very underhand to me!

Please could you advise on whether:

1. This is contestable and likelihood of being successful
2. How to challenge the ticket

Thank you!




« Last Edit: September 28, 2025, 04:56:22 pm by fezster »

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Re: Redbridge - Contravention Code 16. All signs obscured or painted over
« Reply #1 on: »
Not sure why you've redacted Reg.mark and PCN number? Please provide them.

Re: Redbridge - Contravention Code 16. All signs obscured or painted over
« Reply #2 on: »
Won't that allow anyone to then potentially submit an appeal. Not sure why anyone would do that but feels wrong to put the information on a public forum. Happy to pm the details if that's a more secure way to do it.

Re: Redbridge - Contravention Code 16. All signs obscured or painted over
« Reply #3 on: »
I think I can safely say that in some 50,000 posts since this forum started disclosing this info has not caused ay probs.

Re: Redbridge - Contravention Code 16. All signs obscured or painted over
« Reply #4 on: »
Fair enough. Image below.


Re: Redbridge - Contravention Code 16. All signs obscured or painted over
« Reply #5 on: »
I've marked out the location of all of the signs around the vicinity of the parking spot.

There are four signs on Paget Road itself - each numbered on the lamppost on Google Street View. The CEO has taken a picture of number 4.




The entry from Ilford Lane onto Jersey Road has signs saying "Permit holders parking only past this point", which I can see on Google Street View from Sep 2024 (albeit, they do have some spray painted on them even back then!). I understand the council can rely on these signs alone to enforce tickets (i.e. the signs on the street are not technically required). However, as you can see from this image from my dashcam, these signs were totally illegible, especially whilst driving.

« Last Edit: September 28, 2025, 11:07:52 pm by fezster »

Re: Redbridge - Contravention Code 16. All signs obscured or painted over
« Reply #6 on: »
This is a permit parking area and their evidence just shows you on the road and a repeater sign which as you say isn't anywhere near your car.

A PPA must have clear entry signs. The repeater signs are only there to remind you you're in a PPA.

This area seems to be one giant PPA or a load of separate PPAs.





« Last Edit: September 29, 2025, 12:33:55 pm by stamfordman »

Re: Redbridge - Contravention Code 16. All signs obscured or painted over
« Reply #7 on: »
How should I proceed? So far, I only have the PCN which was attached to the windscreen. Do I need to submit an informal appeal at this stage or should I wait for something in the post?

I've also pulled out a number of tribunal cases for this area which referenced obscured signage. I think all were refused - but they make reference to the signage on entrance to the zone, which in my case is also obscured.

London tribunal links:

Jersey Road:
---------------
2240159591
2240321124

Lowbrook Road:
---------------
224058052A
2250069032


Example appeal decision (224058052A):

Quote
The allegation in this case is that the vehicle was parked without payment of the parking charge. The Appellant criticises the quality of the signage. He says that there were no road markings and that time plates had been vandalised with black paint. He has provided video footage as supporting evidence.

The Enforcement Authority’s case is that the vehicle was parked in a Restricted Parking Zone. In a Restricted Parking Zone there is no requirement for road markings or roadside signs. The requirement is that entry point signs indicate restrictions to the motorist as he/she enters the zone. There may also be ‘repeater’ signs within the zone but the motorist is deemed to be on notice of the restrictions within the zone as he/she passes the entry point sign.

The appeal fails for a number of reasons. Firstly, the signs shown by the Appellant appear to be repeater signs which are not legally necessary. Second, it is noticeable the Appellant did not approach close to some of the signs which suggests they could still be read through the paint. Thirdly, no motorist should form the idea he can take advantage of such vandalism. The motorist who parks at a location where he genuinely cannot read the signage takes a chance and can have no reasonable complaint if issued a PCN.

I am satisfied the signage of restrictions was substantially compliant, clear and adequate.

Having considered all the evidence I am satisfied that the contravention occurred and that the PCN was properly issued and served. I am not satisfied that any exemption applies.

Re: Redbridge - Contravention Code 16. All signs obscured or painted over
« Reply #8 on: »
So for this adjudicator, it doesn't matter a damn whether councils fail do their duty under Regulation 18 (1)(b) of the The Local Authorities’ Traffic Orders (Procedure) (England and Wales) Regulations 1996
https://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/1996/2489/regulation/18
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Re: Redbridge - Contravention Code 16. All signs obscured or painted over
« Reply #9 on: »
Can someone tell me what the sequence of events are after receiving a PCN attached to a car?

1. Is a notice sent in the post?
2. Does the 14 day window start from the notice in post (or the day the PCN was attached to the car)?
3. How many appeal stages there are?


Re: Redbridge - Contravention Code 16. All signs obscured or painted over
« Reply #10 on: »
Any help please?

Re: Redbridge - Contravention Code 16. All signs obscured or painted over
« Reply #11 on: »
Can someone tell me what the sequence of events are after receiving a PCN attached to a car?

1. Is a notice sent in the post?
2. Does the 14 day window start from the notice in post (or the day the PCN was attached to the car)?
3. How many appeal stages there are?

If you only do video hearings you can't get this adjudicator who only does ones 'on the papers' i.e. postal hearings.
I help you pro bono (for free). I now ask that a £40 donation is made to the North London Hospice before I take over your case. I have an 85% success rate across 2,000 PCNs but some PCNs can't be beaten and I will tell you if your case looks hopeless before asking you to donate.

Re: Redbridge - Contravention Code 16. All signs obscured or painted over
« Reply #12 on: »
Can someone tell me what the sequence of events are after receiving a PCN attached to a car?

1. Is a notice sent in the post?
2. Does the 14 day window start from the notice in post (or the day the PCN was attached to the car)?
3. How many appeal stages there are?

If you only do video hearings you can't get this adjudicator who only does ones 'on the papers' i.e. postal hearings.

https://www.londontribunals.gov.uk/eat/understanding-enforcement-process/parking-penalty-charge-notice-enforcement-process
I help you pro bono (for free). I now ask that a £40 donation is made to the North London Hospice before I take over your case. I have an 85% success rate across 2,000 PCNs but some PCNs can't be beaten and I will tell you if your case looks hopeless before asking you to donate.

Re: Redbridge - Contravention Code 16. All signs obscured or painted over
« Reply #13 on: »
Thank you - I did read that page, and so it looks like I should go ahead and make a representation, as I will not receive anything in the post.

I'd like some advice on whether there are any technical challenges I can make on the PCN?

If not, whether or not the obscured signage (on both entry to the zone and in/around the parking spot), plus the fact the CEO has evidenced a sign 100m away - are these all strong grounds for an appeal? Or if anything else I should be considering or adding.

Thanks!

Re: Redbridge - Contravention Code 16. All signs obscured or painted over
« Reply #14 on: »
Please use imgbb.com to give us a copy of the pcn. Select do not auto delete and Use BB Full linked code
I help you pro bono (for free). I now ask that a £40 donation is made to the North London Hospice before I take over your case. I have an 85% success rate across 2,000 PCNs but some PCNs can't be beaten and I will tell you if your case looks hopeless before asking you to donate.