Author Topic: Lewisham, NSL, code 33 e, bus, cycle lane, Lewis Grove  (Read 1217 times)

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Re: Lewisham, NSL, code 33 e, bus, cycle lane, Lewis Grove
« Reply #15 on: »
I can send this, and attach my own photos referred to as fig 1 and 2?
No, the whole point is that you tell them the photos are at that link I sent you. If you simply attach them to the representation, they'll claim they carefully considered them and you'll have no way of knowing (let alone proving) whether they did or not.

Just replace fig.1 and fig.2 with the names of the files in your dropbox folder.
I practice law in the Traffic Penalty Tribunal, London Tribunals, the First-tier tribunal for Scotland, and the Traffic Penalty Tribunal for Northern Ireland, but I am not a solicitor or a barrister. Notwithstanding this, I voluntarily apply the cab rank rule. I am a member of the Society of Professional McKenzie Friends, my membership number is FM193 and I abide by the SPMF service standards.

Quote from: 'Gumph' date='Thu, 19 Jan 2023 - 10:23'
cp8759 is, indeed, a Wizard of the First Order

Re: Lewisham, NSL, code 33 e, bus, cycle lane, Lewis Grove
« Reply #16 on: »
Sorry to be a pest, just confirming that's OK to send in the thread? I'm struggling a tad with the heading/section to refer to, but if it doesn't matter too much also then if you kindly confirm for me it will help, and I'll submit it today
Which image in your dropbox folder is "Fig.1" and which one is "fig.2"?
I practice law in the Traffic Penalty Tribunal, London Tribunals, the First-tier tribunal for Scotland, and the Traffic Penalty Tribunal for Northern Ireland, but I am not a solicitor or a barrister. Notwithstanding this, I voluntarily apply the cab rank rule. I am a member of the Society of Professional McKenzie Friends, my membership number is FM193 and I abide by the SPMF service standards.

Quote from: 'Gumph' date='Thu, 19 Jan 2023 - 10:23'
cp8759 is, indeed, a Wizard of the First Order

Re: Lewisham, NSL, code 33 e, bus, cycle lane, Lewis Grove
« Reply #17 on: »
They are not in the folder sorry, I drew them while writing the appeal, so I've PM'd you a link to both the files. If you could kindly add them into there, I've modified the appeal this way to accomodate:

Dear Sirs

PCN x VRM x

I make these representations on the following grounds:

<<Not sure what to put here, as specifically I will be clicking the 'I wish to challenge my PCN for another reason' option in the appeal form?>>

Fig.1 is Lewisham council's first photographic evidence in their PCN. It is edited it to display a green rectangle to show exactly where the driver was parked stationary as the driver had reason to leave the car, and a red line indicating where the first frame of the Lewisham council's video footage begins. The two red circles indicate the two lamposts displaying the signage specific to this case.

The driver parked here after turning into Lewis Grove from Lee High Road, and the only signage until then was a warning of a Bus, Cycle and Taxi lane 240 yards ahead. The next sign, infront of the parked position in fig.1 and in the google street view image (fig.2) states the lane is now 160 yards ahead, but the lane marking is now solid white (marked in red).

As the solid lane marking ends at the junction with Mercia Grove, and in the driver's perspective the assumed final warning sign of the impeeding restriction is also in clear view, one naturally assumes the safest thing to do is to turn back on oneself toward Lee High Road. At this point, it is impossible to assume that the other lane is also restricted.

During the turn, in which the space in Mercia Grove as well as the broken lane markings are utilised, the signage is only visible once the driver is face on having completed the turn. Using the council's own video footage in the earliest stage of the recording (red line, fig.1) it is clear to see the driver is too close to the signage to have actually had ample time to react to them. This can be simplified by asking why the council's cameras do not begin recording at a reasonable distance from the signage as to effectively rule out this situation from occurring. Images GSV 1,2,3, and 4 are depicting the entire route, and only in the last one does the driver have a chance to view the signs. Please note these are angles taken from Google street view, and were not the exact angles of the driver, who also had to navigate this road at ~1am, with no signs of other traffic as to have obtained any forewarning of any restriction on the adjacent lane. The images can be found here * link *.

Re: Lewisham, NSL, code 33 e, bus, cycle lane, Lewis Grove
« Reply #18 on: »
I've sent you two links, one for fig 1 and one for fig 2, just add the links directly into the text of your representation.
I practice law in the Traffic Penalty Tribunal, London Tribunals, the First-tier tribunal for Scotland, and the Traffic Penalty Tribunal for Northern Ireland, but I am not a solicitor or a barrister. Notwithstanding this, I voluntarily apply the cab rank rule. I am a member of the Society of Professional McKenzie Friends, my membership number is FM193 and I abide by the SPMF service standards.

Quote from: 'Gumph' date='Thu, 19 Jan 2023 - 10:23'
cp8759 is, indeed, a Wizard of the First Order

Re: Lewisham, NSL, code 33 e, bus, cycle lane, Lewis Grove
« Reply #19 on: »
Rejection received, seems like a cookie-cutter response because they're just mentioning all the routes including Bonfield Road which I never even knew of before.



Here is the map of what I described in green, the red marker shows the junction they are talking of

« Last Edit: September 22, 2023, 07:59:38 pm by blad4 »

Re: Lewisham, NSL, code 33 e, bus, cycle lane, Lewis Grove
« Reply #20 on: »
Well we now have the council on the hook for telling you a blatant lie. Providing you put the links I sent you by PM to add into the representation, they've not clicked on them and the below time-stamped screenshot shows that as of right now they've still not looked a them:



Paragraph 1(7) of Schedule 1 to the 2003 Act says:

(7)It shall be the duty of the enforcing authority to whom representations are duly made under this paragraph—
(a) to consider them and any supporting evidence which the person making them provides; and
(b) to serve on that person notice of their decision as to whether they accept that the ground in question has been established.


They've obviously not fulfilled their duty to consider "any supporting evidence which the person making them provides", so I think an appeal on this point should succeed.

It's obviously an untested strategy, but it should work (I don't see how an adjudicator would say it's OK for the council to not only ignore but not even bother looking at your supporting evidence) and as they've not reoffered the discount, it's a no-brainer to carry on.

Would you like me to represent you at the tribunal?
« Last Edit: September 23, 2023, 03:30:26 pm by cp8759 »
I practice law in the Traffic Penalty Tribunal, London Tribunals, the First-tier tribunal for Scotland, and the Traffic Penalty Tribunal for Northern Ireland, but I am not a solicitor or a barrister. Notwithstanding this, I voluntarily apply the cab rank rule. I am a member of the Society of Professional McKenzie Friends, my membership number is FM193 and I abide by the SPMF service standards.

Quote from: 'Gumph' date='Thu, 19 Jan 2023 - 10:23'
cp8759 is, indeed, a Wizard of the First Order

Re: Lewisham, NSL, code 33 e, bus, cycle lane, Lewis Grove
« Reply #21 on: »
Definitely! I would be so grateful.

And yep, I’ll send you the PDF confirmation of the appeal they sent me which includes the two links whenever convenient.

Re: Lewisham, NSL, code 33 e, bus, cycle lane, Lewis Grove
« Reply #22 on: »
I practice law in the Traffic Penalty Tribunal, London Tribunals, the First-tier tribunal for Scotland, and the Traffic Penalty Tribunal for Northern Ireland, but I am not a solicitor or a barrister. Notwithstanding this, I voluntarily apply the cab rank rule. I am a member of the Society of Professional McKenzie Friends, my membership number is FM193 and I abide by the SPMF service standards.

Quote from: 'Gumph' date='Thu, 19 Jan 2023 - 10:23'
cp8759 is, indeed, a Wizard of the First Order
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Re: Lewisham, NSL, code 33 e, bus, cycle lane, Lewis Grove
« Reply #23 on: »
Thank you so much again Ivan! You completely relieved me of the stress of appealing, then most probably losing, as well as the money saved. And all executed with extreme precision and professionalism!! Thank you