3. fake PCN recording or croydon council mistake ?!
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Re: fake PCN recording or croydon council mistake ?!
« Reply #15 on: »
Send this fast.

1. The signage is unclear as the right hand one is facing the wrong direction to be seen.

2. I make this collateral challenge against the validity of the PCN as it is missing mandatory information as provided at Para. 4 (8 ) (v) of https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukla/2003/3/section/4/enacted

(v)that, if the penalty charge is not paid before the end of the 28 day period, an increased

charge may be payable.

Clearly, this refers to Para. 4 (8 ) (iii):


(iii)that the penalty charge must be paid before the end of the period of 28 days beginning

with the date of the notice;


Therefore, it follows that the statement: If you fail to pay the Penalty Charge or make representations before the end of a period of 28 days beginning with the date of service of this notice an increased charge of £240 may be payable. adds to the lack of clarity by its omission. Even on its own, whether the required information was included or not, it is also arguable that it conflates the two periods using the word "or" which many would view as being conjunctive. Furthermore, even if the statement were to be interpreted disjunctively, there is still no clarity due to the missing information.

In light of the above, I ask that the appeal be allowed.
« Last Edit: August 12, 2025, 04:46:58 pm by Hippocrates »
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I REGRET THAT, FOR THE PRESENT, I AM UNABLE TO TAKE ON ANY MORE CASES AS A REPRESENTATIVE AT THE LONDON TRIBUNALS. THIS IS FOR BOTH PERSONAL AND LEGAL REASONS. PLEASE DO NOT PM ME UNLESS YOU HAVE POSTED YOUR THREAD ON THE FORUM AND I WILL ATTEMPT TO GIVE ADVICE.


If you do not challenge, you join "The Mugged Club".

cp8759 and mrmustard are true geniuses. I know my place in the hierarchy of The Three Musketeers. 😊 "The Clinician", "The Gentleman" and "The Showman"

There are "known knowns" which we may never have wished to know. This applies to them. But in the field the idea that there are also "unknown unknowns" doesn't apply as they hide in the aleatoric lottery. I know this is true and need to be prepared knowing the "unknown unknowns" may well apply.

To Socrates from "Hippocrates"
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Re: fake PCN recording or croydon council mistake ?!
« Reply #16 on: »
Many thanks.



"Online representation against a Penalty Charge Notice receipt.

******* Please do not reply to this email *******

Dear Mr ...

Penalty Charge Notice Number: CR22907776

Vehicle Registration Number: NX18XAP

ACKNOWLEDGEMENT OF CORRESPONDENCE

Thank you for your recent correspondence regarding the issue of the above penalty charge notice.

Please note that it will be logged to the relevant team for investigation and they will respond in due course. The statutory response times are 56 for formal representations and 90 days for informal representations. Please note that the current amount due will be held whilst we are dealing with the matter."
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Re: fake PCN recording or croydon council mistake ?!
« Reply #17 on: »
Quote from: concoj on August 13, 2025, 02:40:31 am
Many thanks.



"Online representation against a Penalty Charge Notice receipt.

******* Please do not reply to this email *******

Dear Mr ...

Penalty Charge Notice Number: CR22907776

Vehicle Registration Number: NX18XAP

ACKNOWLEDGEMENT OF CORRESPONDENCE

Thank you for your recent correspondence regarding the issue of the above penalty charge notice.

Please note that it will be logged to the relevant team for investigation and they will respond in due course. The statutory response times are 56 for formal representations and 90 days for informal representations. Please note that the current amount due will be held whilst we are dealing with the matter."
The response times quoted are not statutory for the LLA & TfL Act 2003 which the PCN was issued under. The 56 days applies to formal reps under the Traffic Management Act 2004, and there is no statutory limit in either legislation for responding to informal representations, although most adjudicators would look askance at any response over 90 days (3 months), on the grounds of unfairness.
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Re: fake PCN recording or croydon council mistake ?!
« Reply #18 on: »
Rejected sorry Hippocrates
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Re: fake PCN recording or croydon council mistake ?!
« Reply #19 on: »
not surprised but awaiting Hippos return for further instructions
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Quote from: andy_foster
Mick, you are a very, very bad man
Re: fake PCN recording or croydon council mistake ?!
« Reply #20 on: »
I have read the NOR. It is rather unhinged. Tribunal time as agreed. Kingston manager has transposed to Croydon? Can these people actually read and write?
« Last Edit: September 15, 2025, 10:08:45 pm by Hippocrates »
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I REGRET THAT, FOR THE PRESENT, I AM UNABLE TO TAKE ON ANY MORE CASES AS A REPRESENTATIVE AT THE LONDON TRIBUNALS. THIS IS FOR BOTH PERSONAL AND LEGAL REASONS. PLEASE DO NOT PM ME UNLESS YOU HAVE POSTED YOUR THREAD ON THE FORUM AND I WILL ATTEMPT TO GIVE ADVICE.


If you do not challenge, you join "The Mugged Club".

cp8759 and mrmustard are true geniuses. I know my place in the hierarchy of The Three Musketeers. 😊 "The Clinician", "The Gentleman" and "The Showman"

There are "known knowns" which we may never have wished to know. This applies to them. But in the field the idea that there are also "unknown unknowns" doesn't apply as they hide in the aleatoric lottery. I know this is true and need to be prepared knowing the "unknown unknowns" may well apply.

To Socrates from "Hippocrates"
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Re: fake PCN recording or croydon council mistake ?!
« Reply #21 on: »
https://youtube.com/shorts/py-ZPOpWarQ

Like the joke, they cannot tell the difference between the date and date of service. I have offered to pay half if I lose. This is what fame does to you. In any event, @concoj bought me a bottle of champagne which greeted me upon my arrival from my island in July.  ;D

NOR:  The PCN clearly states: "If you fail to pay the Penalty Charge or make representations before the end of a period of 28 days beginning with the date of service of this notice an increased charge of £240 may be payable"

Therefore, clearly advises you that if you do not make payment or a representation within 28 days of the date of this notice you may be liable for an increased charge.

This laughter is actually helping my sciatica.
« Last Edit: September 16, 2025, 09:40:23 am by Hippocrates »
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I REGRET THAT, FOR THE PRESENT, I AM UNABLE TO TAKE ON ANY MORE CASES AS A REPRESENTATIVE AT THE LONDON TRIBUNALS. THIS IS FOR BOTH PERSONAL AND LEGAL REASONS. PLEASE DO NOT PM ME UNLESS YOU HAVE POSTED YOUR THREAD ON THE FORUM AND I WILL ATTEMPT TO GIVE ADVICE.


If you do not challenge, you join "The Mugged Club".

cp8759 and mrmustard are true geniuses. I know my place in the hierarchy of The Three Musketeers. 😊 "The Clinician", "The Gentleman" and "The Showman"

There are "known knowns" which we may never have wished to know. This applies to them. But in the field the idea that there are also "unknown unknowns" doesn't apply as they hide in the aleatoric lottery. I know this is true and need to be prepared knowing the "unknown unknowns" may well apply.

To Socrates from "Hippocrates"
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Re: fake PCN recording or croydon council mistake ?!
« Reply #22 on: »
Torero, torero …
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Re: fake PCN recording or croydon council mistake ?!
« Reply #23 on: »
Logged
I REGRET THAT, FOR THE PRESENT, I AM UNABLE TO TAKE ON ANY MORE CASES AS A REPRESENTATIVE AT THE LONDON TRIBUNALS. THIS IS FOR BOTH PERSONAL AND LEGAL REASONS. PLEASE DO NOT PM ME UNLESS YOU HAVE POSTED YOUR THREAD ON THE FORUM AND I WILL ATTEMPT TO GIVE ADVICE.


If you do not challenge, you join "The Mugged Club".

cp8759 and mrmustard are true geniuses. I know my place in the hierarchy of The Three Musketeers. 😊 "The Clinician", "The Gentleman" and "The Showman"

There are "known knowns" which we may never have wished to know. This applies to them. But in the field the idea that there are also "unknown unknowns" doesn't apply as they hide in the aleatoric lottery. I know this is true and need to be prepared knowing the "unknown unknowns" may well apply.

To Socrates from "Hippocrates"
Re: fake PCN recording or croydon council mistake ?!
« Reply #24 on: »
Quote from: concoj on August 12, 2025, 10:29:16 am
Thanks so much for your willingness to help Hippocrates! I really appreciate it.




IKEA it is.
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I REGRET THAT, FOR THE PRESENT, I AM UNABLE TO TAKE ON ANY MORE CASES AS A REPRESENTATIVE AT THE LONDON TRIBUNALS. THIS IS FOR BOTH PERSONAL AND LEGAL REASONS. PLEASE DO NOT PM ME UNLESS YOU HAVE POSTED YOUR THREAD ON THE FORUM AND I WILL ATTEMPT TO GIVE ADVICE.


If you do not challenge, you join "The Mugged Club".

cp8759 and mrmustard are true geniuses. I know my place in the hierarchy of The Three Musketeers. 😊 "The Clinician", "The Gentleman" and "The Showman"

There are "known knowns" which we may never have wished to know. This applies to them. But in the field the idea that there are also "unknown unknowns" doesn't apply as they hide in the aleatoric lottery. I know this is true and need to be prepared knowing the "unknown unknowns" may well apply.

To Socrates from "Hippocrates"
Like Like x 1 View List
Re: fake PCN recording or croydon council mistake ?!
« Reply #25 on: »
Tribunal website down for maintenance.
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I REGRET THAT, FOR THE PRESENT, I AM UNABLE TO TAKE ON ANY MORE CASES AS A REPRESENTATIVE AT THE LONDON TRIBUNALS. THIS IS FOR BOTH PERSONAL AND LEGAL REASONS. PLEASE DO NOT PM ME UNLESS YOU HAVE POSTED YOUR THREAD ON THE FORUM AND I WILL ATTEMPT TO GIVE ADVICE.


If you do not challenge, you join "The Mugged Club".

cp8759 and mrmustard are true geniuses. I know my place in the hierarchy of The Three Musketeers. 😊 "The Clinician", "The Gentleman" and "The Showman"

There are "known knowns" which we may never have wished to know. This applies to them. But in the field the idea that there are also "unknown unknowns" doesn't apply as they hide in the aleatoric lottery. I know this is true and need to be prepared knowing the "unknown unknowns" may well apply.

To Socrates from "Hippocrates"
Re: fake PCN recording or croydon council mistake ?!
« Reply #26 on: »
[[The PCN clearly states: "If you fail to pay the Penalty Charge or make representations before the end of a period of 28 days beginning with the date of service of this notice an increased charge of £240 may be payable"]]

Two words are missing that changes everything: “fail to”.

“If you fail to pay the Penalty Charge or (“fail to”) make representations before the end of a period of 28 days beginning with the date of service of this notice an increased charge of £240 may be payable". That was they intended to state (possibly)
« Last Edit: September 28, 2025, 01:57:59 pm by concoj »
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Re: fake PCN recording or croydon council mistake ?!
« Reply #27 on: »
Tribunal website still playing up. Will not allow times to be chosen.

When are the best times for you to have your hearing?
Choose all of the times when you (or your representative) would prefer to have your hearing.

************

I am e mailing them.
« Last Edit: September 28, 2025, 08:32:14 pm by Hippocrates »
Logged
I REGRET THAT, FOR THE PRESENT, I AM UNABLE TO TAKE ON ANY MORE CASES AS A REPRESENTATIVE AT THE LONDON TRIBUNALS. THIS IS FOR BOTH PERSONAL AND LEGAL REASONS. PLEASE DO NOT PM ME UNLESS YOU HAVE POSTED YOUR THREAD ON THE FORUM AND I WILL ATTEMPT TO GIVE ADVICE.


If you do not challenge, you join "The Mugged Club".

cp8759 and mrmustard are true geniuses. I know my place in the hierarchy of The Three Musketeers. 😊 "The Clinician", "The Gentleman" and "The Showman"

There are "known knowns" which we may never have wished to know. This applies to them. But in the field the idea that there are also "unknown unknowns" doesn't apply as they hide in the aleatoric lottery. I know this is true and need to be prepared knowing the "unknown unknowns" may well apply.

To Socrates from "Hippocrates"
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  3. fake PCN recording or croydon council mistake ?!