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Bus lane PCN Southwark Council

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Re: Bus lane PCN Southwark Council
Reply #45 on:
#46
Quote from: ILoveCats123 on August 13, 2026, 04:33:14 pm
@Incandescent

Hippocrates suggest that the time frame in which the EN was sent bares no relevance. Although the legislation doesn’t specify a limit in which an EN must be sent, you said that anything more than 3 months is considered abuse of process by LT.

Do we have any example cases?

I can have a look but really need to submit reps against the EN today as running out of time.

You cannot complain about something which is irrelevant and does not exist.

https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukla/1996/9/schedule/1/enacted

The law is clear: THERE IS NO TIME LIMIT TO SERVE AN ENFORCEMENT NOTICE. if you want to spend time chasing a red herring, then please crack on as I do not have the time.
Last Edit: August 13, 2026, 06:32:53 pm by Hippocrates
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@Incandescent!

I AM ABLE TO TAKE ON MORE CASES AS A REPRESENTATIVE AT THE LONDON TRIBUNALS. I HATE RETIREMENT.


If you do not challenge, you join "The Mugged Club".

cp8759 and mrmustard are true geniuses. I know my place in the hierarchy of The Three Musketeers. 😊 "The Clinician", "The Gentleman" and "The Showman"

There are "known knowns" which we may never have wished to know. This applies to them. But in the field the idea that there are also "unknown unknowns" doesn't apply as they hide in the aleatoric lottery. I know this is true and need to be prepared knowing the "unknown unknowns" may well apply.

To Socrates from "Hippocrates"
Re: Bus lane PCN Southwark Council
Reply #46 on:
#47
The CHief Adjudicator has made it clear to councils that delays of over 3 months to do anything in the enforcement process is grounds for cancellation, unless very good reasons are submitted.
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Re: Bus lane PCN Southwark Council
Reply #47 on:
#48
Even if, for argument’s sake, (wink) it isn’t relevant, then it’s not like the council can disregard our other arguments anyway. So I don’t see a harm.

I think we should include in the reps
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Re: Bus lane PCN Southwark Council
Reply #48 on:
#49
Well, if you do not wish to follow my advice, then count me out. The issue is a red herring. We are not talking about unconscionable delays re NORs. This is a completely different matter.

I will not put my name as a representative to a case in which I would be embarrassed.
Last Edit: August 13, 2026, 09:46:49 pm by Hippocrates
Logged
@Incandescent!

I AM ABLE TO TAKE ON MORE CASES AS A REPRESENTATIVE AT THE LONDON TRIBUNALS. I HATE RETIREMENT.


If you do not challenge, you join "The Mugged Club".

cp8759 and mrmustard are true geniuses. I know my place in the hierarchy of The Three Musketeers. 😊 "The Clinician", "The Gentleman" and "The Showman"

There are "known knowns" which we may never have wished to know. This applies to them. But in the field the idea that there are also "unknown unknowns" doesn't apply as they hide in the aleatoric lottery. I know this is true and need to be prepared knowing the "unknown unknowns" may well apply.

To Socrates from "Hippocrates"
Re: Bus lane PCN Southwark Council
Reply #49 on:
#50
Quote from: Incandescent on August 13, 2026, 07:04:24 pm
The CHief Adjudicator has made it clear to councils that delays of over 3 months to do anything in the enforcement process is grounds for cancellation, unless very good reasons are submitted.

Where please?
Logged
@Incandescent!

I AM ABLE TO TAKE ON MORE CASES AS A REPRESENTATIVE AT THE LONDON TRIBUNALS. I HATE RETIREMENT.


If you do not challenge, you join "The Mugged Club".

cp8759 and mrmustard are true geniuses. I know my place in the hierarchy of The Three Musketeers. 😊 "The Clinician", "The Gentleman" and "The Showman"

There are "known knowns" which we may never have wished to know. This applies to them. But in the field the idea that there are also "unknown unknowns" doesn't apply as they hide in the aleatoric lottery. I know this is true and need to be prepared knowing the "unknown unknowns" may well apply.

To Socrates from "Hippocrates"
Re: Bus lane PCN Southwark Council
Reply #50 on:
#51
Okay we’ll submit reps without mentioning the delay in serving the EN.

Once we can figure it out, we can deal with that part at LT. Sound good?
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Re: Bus lane PCN Southwark Council
Reply #51 on:
#52
Quote from: Hippocrates on August 13, 2026, 10:01:44 pm
Quote from: Incandescent on August 13, 2026, 07:04:24 pm
The CHief Adjudicator has made it clear to councils that delays of over 3 months to do anything in the enforcement process is grounds for cancellation, unless very good reasons are submitted.

Where please?
I read about this somewhere some time ago,  and was quite sure it is fact, but it is not in the Practice Directions, so can only assume it is in private correspondence from Mr Chan. I believe it is in an adjudication somewhere as a fairness issue.
Sorry cannot be more definite. Maybe Ivan knows more. However, there is a case in the Key Cases listing where delay is explored. This is under the old 1991 legislation. The case here is 1998 when it was PATAS
https://www.londontribunals.gov.uk/sites/default/files/keycases/Davis41.pdf
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Re: Bus lane PCN Southwark Council
Reply #52 on:
#53
I continued to dig around and things like this tend to be buried, but in the process for Bus Lane PCNs, it is stated that councils should normally respond to reps against an EN within three months.
I confess that there is no stricture against service of the EN  itself.

https://www.londontribunals.gov.uk/eat/understanding-enforcement-process/bus-lane-pcn-enforcement-process#en

However, it is clear that delays in enforcement is an issue that has been around since the 90s. Would a London Tribunals adjudicator be happy if the EN was served a year later ? Surely not.
Last Edit: August 13, 2026, 11:37:43 pm by Incandescent
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Re: Bus lane PCN Southwark Council
Reply #53 on:
#54
Quote from: Incandescent on August 13, 2026, 11:26:47 pm
I continued to dig around and things like this tend to be buried, but in the process for Bus Lane PCNs, it is stated that councils should normally respond to reps against an EN within three months.
I confess that there is no stricture against service of the EN  itself.

https://www.londontribunals.gov.uk/eat/understanding-enforcement-process/bus-lane-pcn-enforcement-process#en

However, it is clear that delays in enforcement is an issue that has been around since the 90s. Would a London Tribunals adjudicator be happy if the EN was served a year later ? Surely not.

We can raise this later.  Just got back from the visit to the local as too hot to go out during the day.  Quite close to the infamous YBJ in Kingston Road.  ;D
Last Edit: August 14, 2026, 12:24:10 am by Hippocrates
Logged
@Incandescent!

I AM ABLE TO TAKE ON MORE CASES AS A REPRESENTATIVE AT THE LONDON TRIBUNALS. I HATE RETIREMENT.


If you do not challenge, you join "The Mugged Club".

cp8759 and mrmustard are true geniuses. I know my place in the hierarchy of The Three Musketeers. 😊 "The Clinician", "The Gentleman" and "The Showman"

There are "known knowns" which we may never have wished to know. This applies to them. But in the field the idea that there are also "unknown unknowns" doesn't apply as they hide in the aleatoric lottery. I know this is true and need to be prepared knowing the "unknown unknowns" may well apply.

To Socrates from "Hippocrates"
Re: Bus lane PCN Southwark Council
Reply #54 on:
#55
The issue is further compounded by the fact that the law does not even state that an informal challenge needs to be considered but nearly all councils in London do.
Logged
@Incandescent!

I AM ABLE TO TAKE ON MORE CASES AS A REPRESENTATIVE AT THE LONDON TRIBUNALS. I HATE RETIREMENT.


If you do not challenge, you join "The Mugged Club".

cp8759 and mrmustard are true geniuses. I know my place in the hierarchy of The Three Musketeers. 😊 "The Clinician", "The Gentleman" and "The Showman"

There are "known knowns" which we may never have wished to know. This applies to them. But in the field the idea that there are also "unknown unknowns" doesn't apply as they hide in the aleatoric lottery. I know this is true and need to be prepared knowing the "unknown unknowns" may well apply.

To Socrates from "Hippocrates"
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