Author Topic: Medway Code 19 Meadowbank - Resident Parking Permit Partially Displayed  (Read 10397 times)

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Medway Code 19 Meadowbank - Resident Parking Permit Partially Displayed

Hi Everyone,

Please, I need some advice about a Penalty Charge Notice (PCN) I received, and I'm not sure whether I should challenge it further or just pay the discounted amount before the 18th of February deadline.
Here's what happened: I was issued a PCN for not displaying my resident permit. The permit was on my dashboard but was partially covered by another permit. This happened due to some mitigating circumstances. I had just parked in front of my house after a two-hour journey from London and urgently needed to use the bathroom. I also have mobility issues, which makes it difficult for me to move quickly, especially when climbing stairs. I rushed inside, used the bathroom upstairs, and returned to my car in less than 10 minutes to swap my permit and collect my belongings—only to find a PCN on my windshield.
I called Medway Council's parking team and explained the situation. The lady I spoke to assured me that they would cancel the PCN if I appealed and provided proof of my resident permit. I followed her advice, sent in my appeal, and attached a copy of my permit. However, my appeal was rejected, which surprised me because, in the past, Medway Council has been known to cancel one PCN per year if a resident forgets to display their permit. I’ve experienced this myself before, and they asked for proof of the permit before cancelling the PCN.
I called several times trying to speak to the officer who gave me the initial advice, I knew her name. I eventually spoke with the same officer. This time, she seemed to backtrack on her earlier assurance. She said it depends on the discretion of the officer handling the appeal and that it's a personal decision. When I mentioned the previous policy of cancellation on submitting a valid resident permit; she said she’s only been in the job for six months and downplayed her earlier advice. I asked to speak to a manager to understand the change in policy, she said she would request a call back as no one was available. I haven’t received any call back yet (this was on Tuesday, 11th February 25).
Another issue is that the rejection letter I received, signed by Mr. Stokes, quoted the wrong penalty and discounted amounts. He listed £70 and £35, but the actual amounts on the PCN are £50 and £25. Could this error make any difference to my case?
I’m now unsure whether to continue challenging this—possibly all the way to a tribunal—or if I should just pay the discounted rate before the deadline to avoid it increasing to the full amount.
Any advice or suggestions on how to proceed would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks in advance!


Link to all relevant documents and pictures
https://ibb.co/album/QvcRMD
« Last Edit: February 14, 2025, 09:41:08 pm by El-Roi »

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Re: Medway Code 19 Meadowbank - Resident Parking Permit Partially Displayed
« Reply #1 on: »
What's happened is they've given you a lower level code 19 PCN because presumably the CEO saw a permit that was valid but no longer is. What is the other permit?

The rejection assumes no valid permit was there and has failed to address the contravention and your challenge and told you the wrong amount is due. Is that all they said?

I would go on with this. At most you are risking £25.
« Last Edit: February 14, 2025, 11:21:17 pm by stamfordman »

Re: Medway Code 19 Meadowbank - Resident Parking Permit Partially Displayed
« Reply #2 on: »
What's happened is they've given you a lower level code 19 PCN because presumably the CEO saw a permit that was valid but no longer is. What is the other permit?

London Borough


The rejection assumes no valid permit was there and has failed to address the contravention and your challenge and told you the wrong amount is due. Is that all they said?

Yes. The Complete rejection letter is what I uploaded. I only removed my personal details and the letter head.
Sent him a copy of my current permit expiring 26.12.2025. He acknowledged that in the rejection letter.

I would go on with this. At most you are risking £25.

On what basis am I likely to succeed. Please can you elaborate so I can understand.
Thanks



@stamfordman

" Medway serving you was visible" The Medway permit is larger but no other details were visible.
My car is always parked at the same spot with my permit. So the officer knows I have a valid permit. It was renewed to 26.12.25


I sent them a clear copy of my current Permit that was seen on the car when the PCN was issued as advised by the officer I spoke to.
No the CEO didn't see a Medway permit that was valid and no longer is.
PCN issued on that road is usually £25 / £50. A few years ago when a storm turned my permit over on the dashboard. It was cancelled when I sent in a copy of the permit with my appeal explaining the circumstances.
Just to be clear because the  rejection letter quoted the wrong amount payable will that make my chances of successfully taking it further greater?

If yes please can you explain.
Thanks

Re: Medway Code 19 Meadowbank - Resident Parking Permit Partially Displayed
« Reply #3 on: »
Are you using two accounts here?

Anyway the facts are you were given a code 19 invalid permit in a permit only bay. This usually means there is a permit but it's invalid such as through expiry. It may be the CEO was just confused by the clutter and should have issued a code 16 higher level no valid permit.

But your permit was valid at the time so I would go on with this, plus they've misled you with the rejection.





Re: Medway Code 19 Meadowbank - Resident Parking Permit Partially Displayed
« Reply #4 on: »
Is the correct grounds for appeal - "The alleged contravention did not occur"

Should I ignore the "Mitigating circumstances" grounds which was on the informal challenge and was not considered in the rejection letter?


How do I address the misleading information on the rejection letter? Is that sufficient to cancel the PCN. Just want to learn / understand incase I encounter such scenario in the future.

Will you help me draft a representation when I receive the NTO?

Re: Medway Code 19 Meadowbank - Resident Parking Permit Partially Displayed
« Reply #5 on: »
Is the correct grounds for appeal - "The alleged contravention did not occur"

Should I ignore the "Mitigating circumstances" grounds which was on the informal challenge and was not considered in the rejection letter?


How do I address the misleading information on the rejection letter? Is that sufficient to cancel the PCN. Just want to learn / understand incase I encounter such scenario in the future.

Will you help me draft a representation when I receive the NTO?

Yes the contravention did not occur and they misled themselves into thinking another contravention did occur.

The permit you displayed was obscured but it wasn't invalid.

I will help you draft formal reps to the NTO. As I said this isn't a big deal unless £25 is make or break...

Are you the registered keeper and is the V5C logbook up to date with correct address?

Re: Medway Code 19 Meadowbank - Resident Parking Permit Partially Displayed
« Reply #6 on: »
@El-Roi the informal rejection clearly demands an amount that exceeds the amount lawfully due, and that is a statutory ground for cancellation.

In the meantime I'll get hold of the traffic order.
I practice law in the Traffic Penalty Tribunal, London Tribunals, the First-tier tribunal for Scotland, and the Traffic Penalty Tribunal for Northern Ireland, but I am not a solicitor or a barrister. Notwithstanding this, I voluntarily apply the cab rank rule. I am a member of the Society of Professional McKenzie Friends, my membership number is FM193 and I abide by the SPMF service standards.

Quote from: 'Gumph' date='Thu, 19 Jan 2023 - 10:23'
cp8759 is, indeed, a Wizard of the First Order

Re: Medway Code 19 Meadowbank - Resident Parking Permit Partially Displayed
« Reply #7 on: »
OP, you have to make a choice.

If you are the registered keeper then you could either pay the discount or continue. If the latter, you might be exposed to the full penalty should your reps be unsuccessful.

As regards grounds, a strict interpretation of the regs means that the contravention did not occur. This follows because the authority accept that 'you have submitted a valid permit' and yet have cited grounds precluded by this fact. However, this is after the fact, IMO the key admission here as regards issuing the PCN on the chosen grounds is 'I must also note that no details of the permit are visible'.

As regards 'I must also note that.....CEOs within Medway do not have the capability', they might say this, I couldn't possibly comment!

Re: Medway Code 19 Meadowbank - Resident Parking Permit Partially Displayed
« Reply #8 on: »
@El-Roi the informal rejection clearly demands an amount that exceeds the amount lawfully due, and that is a statutory ground for cancellation.

Thanks

I will wait for the NTO

In the meantime I'll get hold of the traffic order.


Appreciated.

Re: Medway Code 19 Meadowbank - Resident Parking Permit Partially Displayed
« Reply #9 on: »
Is the correct grounds for appeal - "The alleged contravention did not occur"

Should I ignore the "Mitigating circumstances" grounds which was on the informal challenge and was not considered in the rejection letter?


How do I address the misleading information on the rejection letter? Is that sufficient to cancel the PCN. Just want to learn / understand incase I encounter such scenario in the future.

Will you help me draft a representation when I receive the NTO?

Yes the contravention did not occur and they misled themselves into thinking another contravention did occur.
Thanks for the confirmation

The permit you displayed was obscured but it wasn't invalid.
Correct. They have acknowledged that I submitted a valid permit alongside my informal challenge in the rejection letter.


I will help you draft formal reps to the NTO. As I said this isn't a big deal unless £25 is make or break...

Thanks. Appreciated
Funds are tight at the moment.I have a lot going on.

Are you the registered keeper and is the V5C logbook up to date with correct address?
Yes

Re: Medway Code 19 Meadowbank - Resident Parking Permit Partially Displayed
« Reply #10 on: »
OP, you have to make a choice.

If you are the registered keeper then you could either pay the discount or continue. If the latter, you might be exposed to the full penalty should your reps be unsuccessful.

What are chances of success if it goes all the way to Tribunal ?

As regards grounds, a strict interpretation of the regs means that the contravention did not occur. This follows because the authority accept that 'you have submitted a valid permit' and yet have cited grounds precluded by this fact. However, this is after the fact, IMO the key admission here as regards issuing the PCN on the chosen grounds is 'I must also note that no details of the permit are visible'.

I agree. But as Stamfordman pointed out another code 16 should have been issued instead.
As regards 'I must also note that.....CEOs within Medway do not have the capability', they might say this, I couldn't possibly comment!
Thanks Noted.

Re: Medway Code 19 Meadowbank - Resident Parking Permit Partially Displayed
« Reply #11 on: »
Are you the registered keeper with current DVLA details?

Re: Medway Code 19 Meadowbank - Resident Parking Permit Partially Displayed
« Reply #12 on: »
Are you the registered keeper with current DVLA details?

Yes

@El-Roi have you received anything further? The PCN is now up to £75, so a charge certificate has been issued. This is not the end of the world, but you need to tell us what you have received so that we can deal with it before you miss any deadlines.

I've also had this rather odd response from the council:

Quote
Please see attached the TRO relating to your request, located within the time allowed, and accept our apologies for any confusion caused previously. Medway Council holds copies of these older TROs but does not have the capacity to catalogue them and their contents to make the information easily retrievable to current staff.

There are no staff dedicated to retrieving older traffic orders that weren’t consolidated in 2015/2016 and no single register, as TROs have fallen under the remit of various employees/departments/teams in the past.

Orders that were not consolidated in 2015 or 2016 remain valid in their own right; the attached is one of these. There are a large number of orders that are not catalogued (both paper copies and scanned copies in various locations), meaning information requested about a specific road takes considerable time to identify; reading through all schedules for entries relating to a particular road.

Whilst there are no staff resources that can be diverted to catalogue the older TROs and their contents, this will be rectified via a separate project ahead of identifying and digitising all TROs at Medway Council.

All documents from this time have been archived and searching through the archives would take staff over the required amount of time to respond to an FOI. Therefore, investigating this further will require a charge.

All I've been sent it a draft copy of the Medway Council (Designated Parking Places) (Amendment) (No.2) Order 2001, so the council might struggle to produce a copy at the tribunal, but we need to deal with the charge certificate first.
I practice law in the Traffic Penalty Tribunal, London Tribunals, the First-tier tribunal for Scotland, and the Traffic Penalty Tribunal for Northern Ireland, but I am not a solicitor or a barrister. Notwithstanding this, I voluntarily apply the cab rank rule. I am a member of the Society of Professional McKenzie Friends, my membership number is FM193 and I abide by the SPMF service standards.

Quote from: 'Gumph' date='Thu, 19 Jan 2023 - 10:23'
cp8759 is, indeed, a Wizard of the First Order

@H C Anderson
@stamfordman
@cp8759

Update CC Charge Certificate received dated 28.04.25

cp8759-sent you a copy of the CC on 3rd May.

Should I upload a copy of the CC here?



No NTO was received. So couldn't make a formal representation as per earlier advice on this post

On 3rd May received a Charge Certificate dated 28th April 2025.

Waiting for the debt to be registered and I will complete the TE9 form.
Checked Medway website this afternoon, debt still showing at £75.
Called HMTCS (TEC); line was closed.
Will call TEC tomorrow to check if debt has been registered.

Any advice will be welcomed.
Thanks.