Author Topic: Disqualified in NI on a GB Licence.  (Read 375 times)

0 Members and 0 Guests are viewing this topic.

LeosPappa

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 1
  • Karma: +0/-0
    • View Profile
Disqualified in NI on a GB Licence.
« on: August 22, 2024, 10:04:58 pm »


I work in England. My wife and kids live in NI.
I tavel home most weekends.

My residency status, 194 days in England, makes me eligible for a GB licence but ineligible for an NI Licence.

I was over the limit last year. Class 1. Plead guilty. 12 month ban with resit requirement.

I did the year disqual and went for my provisional again. DVLA sent a full licence, said I wasn't required to resit.

Driving in NI in June I was stopped as I had been regularly the last year. All other times another person was driving as I was disqualified. This time I was driving. Flag on the vehicle for ANPR, didn't change vehicle.

Officers at side of road are split on opinion. Officer conducting the stop believed I wasn't licenced as i didn't take another test. Other officer believes I've been issued a full licence thus is valid. Unsure of this I ring DVLA with loudspeaker on. They hear DVLA handler say I have a full licence and have been issued one after disqualification date ended. Say that they won't issue me a provisional.

Cautioned at side of road and I get someone else to drive rest of the way.

Had checked licence prior ro driving.

Because I'm not living in NI I don't meet the residency requirements for a licence here.

PPS has sent court summons to me saying uninsured and unlicensed. No where in the paperwork is it mentioned that i live in England. Bor does it make mention of an email the investigating officer got from my insurer saying that they accept my DVLA issued licence and are covering me.

I literally can't get a provisional in NI legally. I have to make a declaration that I'm in NI 185 days or more per year or will be in the coming future. Making this declaration falsely will be met with her ft fines and possible jail. So I'm not doing that.

I've sent DVA messages and they say I can book with an English provisional but not a full licence. I can't get an English provisional.

Advice please so I can drive in NI legally and not be prosecuted when I have a licence issued by DVLA.

Share on Facebook Share on Twitter


NewJudge

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 280
  • Karma: +11/-0
    • View Profile
Re: Disqualified in NI on a GB Licence.
« Reply #1 on: August 23, 2024, 09:59:12 am »

Class 1. Plead guilty. 12 month ban with resit requirement.


I don't know much about the legislation in NI, but I have found this:

https://www.judiciaryni.uk/files/judiciaryni/media-files/Driving%20with%20Excess%20Alcohol.pdf

It seems that not only is disqualification obligatory (as it is in E&W) but also, unlike in E&W,  disqualification "until tested" is as well. This is the legislation to which that document, above, refers:

https://www.legislation.gov.uk/nisi/1996/1320/article/41/made

"Disqualification until test is passed

41.—(1) Where this paragraph applies to a person the court must order him to be disqualified until he passes the appropriate driving test."


Any ban or other requirement ordered by a court applies to you as a person, not to any licence you may hold. If, for example, as well as your GB licence you had one issued by another country and you were subject to a ban, you could not continue driving on the basis that the details of the ban were not recorded on your second licence. I believe the same principle must apply to the re-test order.

From what you say this may present you with some difficulty as it seems the DVLA will not issue you with a provisional licence. I find this odd because courts in E&W do have the power to disqualify a driver until a test is passed so your situation must arise from time to time.

The Rookie

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 518
  • Karma: +11/-1
  • Gender: Male
  • Location: Warwickshire
    • View Profile
Re: Disqualified in NI on a GB Licence.
« Reply #2 on: August 23, 2024, 12:07:52 pm »
12 month ban with resit requirement.
This sounds like you were banned in NI not rest of UK?
There are motorists who have been scammed and those who are yet to be scammed!

NewJudge

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 280
  • Karma: +11/-0
    • View Profile
Re: Disqualified in NI on a GB Licence.
« Reply #3 on: August 23, 2024, 12:19:42 pm »
This sounds like you were banned in NI not rest of UK?
I think NI and GB operate "mutual recognition" for driving bans.

I think the issue is more of the requirement for a re-test. I'm only guessing because I really don't know, but in the same way as a driving ban imposed in NI will apply in GB, I would think the requirement for a re-test also applies. Otherwise the driver would be in the position, once his ban had ended, of being able to drive as a qualified driver in GB, but only as a provisional licence holder in NI. That seems a bit daft.

andy_foster

  • Global Moderator
  • *****
  • Posts: 576
  • Karma: +12/-4
  • Location: Reading
    • View Profile
Re: Disqualified in NI on a GB Licence.
« Reply #4 on: August 23, 2024, 12:19:52 pm »
In the subject heading, the OP states that he was Disqualified in NI, and in the body of the OP states that he received a "12 month ban with resit requirement".

Having recently been burned by taking an OP's statements at face value, I am wary of being "fooled twice", but NJ's research does appear to tally with the OP being disqualified by an NI court, with a requirement to pass his test before re-becoming a qualified driver.

Perhaps the OP can clarify which court (NI or GB) disqualified him, and that the disqualification was explicitly "until test passed", before others that ought to know better wade in to advise on the basis of reasonable implication from the words used.

AIUI, under English law, if he had been driving other than in accordance with a provisional licence, in England while subject to such a disqualification from an English court, he would be guilty of driving whilst disqualified, regardless of what other licence he might have held - the disqualification applies until the test(s) is passed, with the exception of being able to drive in accordance with a provisional once the fixed period of the disqualification had expired.

I would be very surprised if the same did not apply to driving in NI while subject to a disqualification until test passed.

Ordinarily, one might have scant sympathy for a driver who had been told that he must not drive until passing his test but did so anyway - but for the DVLA's uncharacteristic* intransigence.

*Noting that sarcasm is not always well conveyed without inflections of the voice, facial expression, or being familiar with the context of the DVLA acting as they are a law unto themselves.
I am responsible for the accuracy of the information I post, not your ability to comprehend it.

NewJudge

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 280
  • Karma: +11/-0
    • View Profile
Re: Disqualified in NI on a GB Licence.
« Reply #5 on: August 23, 2024, 01:14:54 pm »
Quote
AIUI, under English law, if he had been driving other than in accordance with a provisional licence, in England while subject to such a disqualification from an English court, he would be guilty of driving whilst disqualified, regardless of what other licence he might have held - the disqualification applies until the test(s) is passed, with the exception of being able to drive in accordance with a provisional once the fixed period of the disqualification had expired.

Yes Andy, that is correct.