3. Speeding, Failure to ID advice
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Re: Speeding, Failure to ID advice
« Reply #15 on: »
Quote from: reeceg03 on July 26, 2024, 10:01:46 am
I understand he’s thrown me under the bus here, and i can’t really say he’s done that as he will get done for much worse. But i was hoping there would be an option where i can nominate him as the driver in court and get him to plead guilty for speeding for that charge, and they drop the Failure to ID charge.
Simply not feasible, while 'possible' (outside of the legal framework and so highly irregular and no more than 1% chance of success anyway) it would involve the risk of him having to admit the possible perverting offence and would be rather a high risk strategy.
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Re: Speeding, Failure to ID advice
« Reply #16 on: »
Are the bank statements or work emails insured to drive the car?

You understand that it's now too late to prosecute you Dad for speeding, but you're still asking if they'll let you off for not naming the driver if you do so 8+ months after the offence?
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Re: Speeding, Failure to ID advice
« Reply #17 on: »
I understand, it’s too late to ID the driver. But surely they wouldn’t have even started the charge for speeding if it was 6 months ago?

Does the same Failure to ID charge not have to be prosecuted within 6 months also?

considering the offence was 26/11/2023, and i only received the single justice procedure on 22/06/2024 is that not too late also? But they have 100% took us to court for both offences which surely both should be timed out?
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Re: Speeding, Failure to ID advice
« Reply #18 on: »
Just for clarity and to get round this use of 'we' for all what has happened.

The first NIP was issued in your dad's name and he responded naming you as the driver?
Did you receive your own form to complete?

You cannot do the deal to accept the speeding charge. To do so would on the surface look like an attempt to PCOJ. So as it stands you could attempt to defend the FTF charge on the basis of all due diligence exercised at the time failed to reveal the driver. However eventually naming a driver 2 months later who had previously named you doesn't look good.
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Re: Speeding, Failure to ID advice
« Reply #19 on: »
Proceedings have to be instigated within 6 months of the commission of the offence. They are instigated when a Written Charge and SJPN are issued.

You initially claimed to have received the NIP on 26/11/2023. Now that is the date of the speeding offence. The s. 172 offence would have been committed 27 days after the date of service of the NIP.
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Re: Speeding, Failure to ID advice
« Reply #20 on: »
Quote from: BertB on July 26, 2024, 10:31:30 am
Just for clarity and to get round this use of 'we' for all what has happened.

The first NIP was issued in your dad's name and he responded naming you as the driver?
Did you receive your own form to complete?

You cannot do the deal to accept the speeding charge. To do so would on the surface look like an attempt to PCOJ. So as it stands you could attempt to defend the FTF charge on the basis of all due diligence exercised at the time failed to reveal the driver. However eventually naming a driver 2 months later who had previously named you doesn't look good.

The car is registered in my name, i received the NIP.
Although all letters are sent from my Dad on my behalf, and i myself never responded even though i am the registered keeper. He was going back and forth with the police at the time. I understand i should have replied and i left it to him which is irresponsible but i thought he would handle it.
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Re: Speeding, Failure to ID advice
« Reply #21 on: »
Quote from: andy_foster on July 26, 2024, 10:36:30 am
Proceedings have to be instigated within 6 months of the commission of the offence. They are instigated when a Written Charge and SJPN are issued.

You initially claimed to have received the NIP on 26/11/2023. Now that is the date of the speeding offence. The s. 172 offence would have been committed 27 days after the date of service of the NIP.

But considering the offence was 26/11/2023, 28 days later would still be in december. The SJPN issue date is 22/06/2024 which is longer than 6 months, so surely based on that both charges have timed out?
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Re: Speeding, Failure to ID advice
« Reply #22 on: »
Quote from: reeceg03 on July 26, 2024, 10:52:16 am

But considering the offence was 26/11/2023, 28 days later would still be in december. The SJPN issue date is 22/06/2024 which is longer than 6 months, so surely based on that both charges have timed out?
The S172 offence is committed after a driver is not named within the 28 days of the service of the S172 request.  The date of the alleged speeding event is irrelevant.

So what is the date on the NIP served first on you?  Noting that for a hire/lease car that can easily be 6 weeks after the alleged speeding event.

You now suggest a lot of backwards and forwards between your father and the police which would suggest making any possible perverting charge easier to succeed with, I really don't think you want to rock the boat here.
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Re: Speeding, Failure to ID advice
« Reply #23 on: »
Quote
But considering the offence was 26/11/2023, 28 days later would still be in december. The SJPN issue date is 22/06/2024 which is longer than 6 months, so surely based on that both charges have timed out?

The Failure to Provide Driver's details offence occurred 27 days after you received the request, so on 23rd December. So the police had until 23rd June to bring proceedings which they managed to do.

The speeding charge is raised against you, not your father. You could argue that it was raised out of time but since you were not driving that offence is of no concern to you. There is no possibility that the police will raise a speeding charge against your father now. It is well out of time and they still have no evidence he was driving anyway.
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Re: Speeding, Failure to ID advice
« Reply #24 on: »
Quote from: reeceg03 on July 25, 2024, 07:07:35 pm
21/06/2024, i have now got another letter - single justice procedure asking to plead guilty or not guilty to both charges, which i plead not guilty to, seems like they didn’t receive my letter of admitting it was my dad, but i had heard nothing for months so assumed it was dealt with.

Quote
The SJPN issue date is 22/06/2024 which is longer than 6 months, so surely based on that both charges have timed out?

So, you received the SJPN the day before it was issued? And 22/06/2024 is more than 6 months after 24/12/2023 (not that 28 days after 26/11/2023 is relevant to anything)?

We are not qualified to give you the help you need.
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  3. Speeding, Failure to ID advice