Author Topic: Euro Car Parks PCN: No valid pay and display/permit was purchased  (Read 96 times)

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ashburton

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I am hoping someone can help as I am the registered keeper and have received a PCN from Euro Car Parks for no valid pay and display/permit was purchased. This was for the driver entering a country park owned by a local council so that a disabled person with protected characteristics needed to use the toilet facilities and the driver was unaware that the previous permit/season ticket had expired.

The season ticket was renewed and I contacted the local council and made them aware that I understood from recent direct communication with my MP and the Department for Levelling Up, Housing and Communities that the occupant in the car has protected characteristics under the Equality Act 2010 and the Disability Discriminations Act 1995. They have advised ‘Provisions in the Equality Act 2010 require providers of services to take reasonable steps to ensure disabled people are not substantially disadvantaged compared to non-disabled people, when accessing a service’. I reiterated to them that an occupant in the car at the time of the PCN has protected characteristics and I consider a Parking Charge Notice for being in the Car Park for just thirty one minutes as indicated is not considered a reasonable adjustment and is a breach of the Equality Act 2010. I also told the local council that, as the car park owner, they are jointly and severally liable if they do not rectify the actions of their agents and requested that they instruct Euro Car Parks to cancel the charge on this occasion.

However, the local council responded with "All of our Country Parks are monitored by Automatic Number Plate Recognition cameras, with clear signs informing visitors that parking charges apply and failure to purchase a pay & display ticket or hold a valid season ticket may result in a fine being issued by Euro Car Parks. If you believe the fine issued to you by Euro Car parks has been issued in error, please appeal it direct with Euro Car Parks via the appeals procedure, details of which can be found on the reverse of the fine letter."

Can anyone help with the appeal to Euro Car Parks please?
« Last Edit: August 04, 2024, 03:38:03 pm by ashburton »

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b789

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Re: Euro Car Parks PCN: No valid pay and display/permit was purchased
« Reply #1 on: August 04, 2024, 11:33:43 am »
Please show the NtK with everything EXCEPT your name, address, PCN number and VRM. Leave everything else showing otherwise what you've shown us is useless. We need to see al the dates and times and the wording of the invoice.

Can you also please show the correspondence from the council where they stay the word "fine". As the land is owned by the council, is it covered by a "Parking Order"? If it is, then it is land under statutory control. Does the NtK mention PoFA 2012? Is it PoFA compliant?

Have you identified the driver?
« Last Edit: August 04, 2024, 11:39:37 am by b789 »
Never argue with stupid people. They will drag you down to their level and then beat you with experience” - Mark Twain
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ashburton

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Re: Euro Car Parks PCN: No valid pay and display/permit was purchased
« Reply #2 on: August 04, 2024, 03:45:29 pm »
Apologies b789. I've edited the image as requested.

Here is the email correspondence from the county council with the name of the employee removed:

"Good Morning,

Thank you for your email.

Unfortunately,  it is customers responsibility to ensure that they make note of when their season ticket is due to expire and make sure that this is correct. I can confirm that as per our Terms and Conditions which are agreed to at the time of booking a season ticket, we state ‘Season tickets do not automatically renew. It is the responsibility of the holder to reapply before expiry’. I have also attached the Terms and Conditions above.


All of our Kent Country Parks are monitored by Automatic Number Plate Recognition cameras, with clear signs informing visitors that parking charges apply and failure to purchase a pay & display ticket or hold a valid season ticket may result in a fine being issued by Euro Car Parks.

If you believe the fine issued to you by Euro Car parks has been issued in error, please appeal it direct with Euro Car Parks via the appeals procedure, details of which can be found on the reverse of the fine letter.


Kind regards,


Apprentice Business Support Assistant"


I know that the county council own the land but I'm not sure if it's covered by a "Parking Order". Is that information in the public domain? If so, how can I find out? There is no mention on the front or back of the PCN of PoFA 2012? How would I know if it is PoFA compliant? The driver has not been identified.

Thank you for your assistance.

DWMB2

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Re: Euro Car Parks PCN: No valid pay and display/permit was purchased
« Reply #3 on: August 04, 2024, 03:55:35 pm »
We could do with seeing the back of the notice.

ashburton

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Re: Euro Car Parks PCN: No valid pay and display/permit was purchased
« Reply #4 on: August 04, 2024, 04:01:47 pm »
« Last Edit: August 04, 2024, 11:43:47 pm by ashburton »

ashburton

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Re: Euro Car Parks PCN: No valid pay and display/permit was purchased
« Reply #5 on: August 04, 2024, 11:44:39 pm »
EXTRACTED TEXT:

PARKING CHARGE NOTICE INFORMATION On 26/06/2024 the vehicle: xxxxxx entered Pegwell Bay Country Park Sandwich, at 09:04; :01 and departed at 09:35:30 on 26/06/2024. The vehicle was parked at Pegwell Bay Country Park- Sandwich, Sandwich Road, Ramsgate, Kent, CT12 5JB. On 26/06/2024 you were the registered keeper of the vehicle xxxxx or you have been named by the registered keeper as the driver/hirer at the time of a breach of the terms and conditions of parking as set out in the signage, the Parking Charge is now payable to Euro Car Parks (as the Creditor) We are using the cameras to capture images of vehicles entering and leaving the car park to calculate their length of stay, The signage, which is clearly displayed at the entrance and throughout the car park states that this is land owned and controlled by Kent County Council, the car park is managed by Euro Car Parks and sets out the terms and conditions of the car park by which those who park in the car park agree to be bound. The Parking Charge Notice xxxxxx has been issued as the vehicle was in breach of the terms and conditions set out in the signage and is now payable to Euro Car Parks Ltd (as the Creditor) If you were not the driver at the time the Parking Charge Notice was issued, please provide full name and address of the driver in writing and pass the notice on to the driver. If you are a vehicle hire firm and the vehicle was hired out at the time the parking took place, please let us know and provide us with a Copy of the hire agreement and a copy of a statement of liability signed by the hirer under that hire agreement. If after 28 days beginning with the day after that on which this notice is given, the Parking Charge Notice has not been paid in full, we may pursue you for any Parking Charge amount that remains unpaid Failure to make payment may result in additional costs being incurred through debt recovery and/or court action where further charges will be added Failure to respond to this notice may lead to civil court action to recover the Parking Charge Notice. Non-payment of a Court Order may adversely affect your credit rating. KEEPER DETAILS AND DATA PROCESSING Under regulations 27 of the Road Vehicles (Registration and Licensing) Regulations the DVLA may release information from its vehicle register to any person who demonstrates 'reasonable cause' to have the information available to them. Circumstances incorporated in the pursuance of the Parking Charge Notice issued to the vehicle The Parking Charge Notice has been issued for the reasons explained, therefore giving Euro Car Parks purpose tO apply to the DVLA for details of the registered keeper. For further information on how Euro Car Parks process data please visit our website: www.eurocarparks.com

WHAT HAPPENS NEXT Once payment for your Parking Charge Notice has been made successfully either online, via telephone or by post, the case will be closed All appeals, complaints and transfer of liability may only be submitted online, in writing and must be received within 28 days from the date of our initial correspondence If your appeal is successful, you will be advised in writing. Appeals received within 28 days will be held at the rate applicable, if the appeal is rejected the rate applicable will be held for a further 14 days If your appeal is rejected, you will be provided with details and a reference number for the Independent Appeals Service (POPLA). Please note that POPLA will not accept an appeal if you have not appealed to Euro Car Parks Ltd in the first instance,. Please also note that you can either pay or appeal the Parking Charge Notice. You cannot do both. If you log an appeal to POPLA, you will lose the option to pay the reduced amount.
TK.KCCO3/23

Please visit www.eurocarparks.com to appeal online or write to Appeals Department, Euro Car Parks Ltd, 30 Dorset Square, London, NW1 6QJ
« Last Edit: August 04, 2024, 11:46:46 pm by ashburton »

b789

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Re: Euro Car Parks PCN: No valid pay and display/permit was purchased
« Reply #6 on: August 05, 2024, 12:55:11 am »
Have they fully complied with all the requirements of PoFA? Is there an “invitation” or any synonym of that word for the keeper to pay the charge?

PoFA 9(2)(e)(i) has not been complied with. Partial or even substantial compliance is not sufficient.

As they have not fully complied with PoFA, they cannot transfer liability from the unknown (to them) driver to the known keeper. The keeper is under no legal obligation to identify the driver. They are not allowed to presume or infer that the keeper must also be the driver.

The burden of proof is on them to identify the driver and pursue that person for the alleged debt. As long as the keeper does not identify the driver, how do you think they could do that?

Appealing as the keeper is the way to go. They will still reject the appeal but will have to provide a POPLA code. Again, at POPLA stage, they are likely to reject that argument as they assume that “substantial” compliance is sufficient, although you may strike lucky if you are able to put the point across well.

The ultimate dispute resolution service, a county court hearing in the small claims track is where it will ultimately be decided whether you owe a debt. A judge would be the only truly independent arbiter.

Have you researched whether the council owned land is under any TRO/PRO? If it is, that would also negate them being able to rely on PoFA to transfer liability from the unknown driver to the known keeper.
« Last Edit: August 05, 2024, 12:57:31 am by b789 »
Never argue with stupid people. They will drag you down to their level and then beat you with experience” - Mark Twain

ashburton

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Re: Euro Car Parks PCN: No valid pay and display/permit was purchased
« Reply #7 on: August 05, 2024, 07:35:22 am »
Thank you for your guidance. Am I correct in thinking that since the PCN makes no mention of trying to comply with POFA it is not POFA compliant?

I've used the Kent traffic app and cannot find any TPOs for Pegwell Country Park, only the 40mph zone on the main road outside it


b789

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Re: Euro Car Parks PCN: No valid pay and display/permit was purchased
« Reply #8 on: August 05, 2024, 07:38:36 am »
There does not need to be any mention of PoFA for the notice to be compliant. Only that all the conditions of the act are fully complied with.

There is the issue of whether the land at that location is under any form of statutory control. If there is not TRO, then there is a likelyhood that it may be under some other statutory control and covered by byelaws.

Land designated as a country park and owned by a county council is usually under statutory control, primarily through the provisions of the Countryside Act 1968 and any associated regulations or byelaws the local authority enacts. The statutory framework ensures the land is managed for public benefit and environmental conservation.

It is certainly worth enquiring about this aspect.
« Last Edit: August 05, 2024, 07:45:27 am by b789 »
Never argue with stupid people. They will drag you down to their level and then beat you with experience” - Mark Twain

b789

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Re: Euro Car Parks PCN: No valid pay and display/permit was purchased
« Reply #9 on: August 05, 2024, 08:08:34 am »
As I suspected, Pegwell Bay Country Park in Kent is covered by the provisions of the Countryside Act 1968. This Act provides the legal framework under which Kent County Council can establish and manage the country park.

As with other country parks, the council has the authority to create byelaws under the Countryside Act 1968 to regulate activities within the park, maintain its facilities, and protect its environment. Pegwell Bay Country Park is also part of a larger area of environmental significance, including the Pegwell Bay National Nature Reserve and the Sandwich and Pegwell Bay Ramsar site, which are subject to additional environmental protections beyond those provided by the Countryside Act.

So, Pegwell Bay Country Park is indeed under statutory control, both through its designation as a country park under the Countryside Act 1968 and through other environmental and planning regulations that apply to the area.

Armed with the above information, when you appeal, you do so only as the keeper and decline to identify the driver. As the land is under statutory control, it is not “relevant land” for the purposes of PoFA and therefore, there can be no keeper liability.

Suggested initial appeal:

Quote
I am the registered keeper. Euro Car Parks (ECP) cannot hold a registered keeper liable for any alleged contravention on land that is under statutory control. As a matter of fact and law, ECP will be well aware that they cannot use the PoFA provisions because Pegwell Bay Country Park is not 'relevant land'.

If Kent County Council wanted to hold owners or keepers liable under the Countryside Act 1968 Byelaws, that would be within the landowner's gift and another matter entirely. However, not only is that not pleaded, it is also not legally possible because ECP is not the Pegwell Bay Country Park owner and your 'parking charge' is not and never attempts to be a penalty. It is created for ECP's own profit (as opposed to a byelaws penalty that goes to the public purse) and ECP has relied on contract law allegations of breach against the driver only.

The registered keeper cannot be presumed or inferred to have been the driver, nor pursued under some twisted interpretation of the law of agency. Your NtK can only hold the driver liable. ECP have no hope at POPLA, so you are urged to save us both a complete waste of time and cancel the PCN.
Never argue with stupid people. They will drag you down to their level and then beat you with experience” - Mark Twain
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ashburton

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Re: Euro Car Parks PCN: No valid pay and display/permit was purchased
« Reply #10 on: September 01, 2024, 09:38:14 pm »
Thank you for your assistance b789.

Unfortunately I did not see your suggested initial appeal before submitting my appeal but I'm happy to say that my appeal was successful. I highlighted the importance of the Equality Act 2010 and the Disability Discrimination Act 1995 and that reasonable adjustments should be made for disabled individuals. Also, since a season ticket had been renewed for the vehicle as the reminder email had been missed (new email account set up), Kent County Council had suffered no material losses.

I also stated that I will also be contacting the Department for Levelling Up, Housing and Communities as I am aware that they are currently implementing the Parking (Code of Practice) Act 2019 which includes the development of an independent Code of Practice for private parking companies.

I hope this helps other people!
« Last Edit: September 01, 2024, 09:40:41 pm by ashburton »

DWMB2

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Re: Euro Car Parks PCN: No valid pay and display/permit was purchased
« Reply #11 on: September 01, 2024, 09:42:50 pm »
Good result! Especially surprising to see ECP cancel upon first appeal