Author Topic: Double dip with ECP for second time - would ideally like to sue them in return or cause them some other trouble / costs  (Read 109 times)

0 Members and 77 Guests are viewing this topic.

So for the second time in a year or two a driver has had a notice from ECP for overstaying the local supermarket car park when actually the driver made 2 visits (morning and evening). They've got good proof (cctv and receipts) that the driver / car was not there for the 7 or 8 hours they allege.

The driver could go into the shop again and complain to the manager and get it cancelled but I wonder if its possible to cause them some trouble. Since the driver is completely provably innocent of this can they just let them take the driver / keeper to court and present the evidence there?

Or should the driver notify them of something within the 28 day period (which incidentally ends today - they've been really busy).

Rather than explain all the details here in public, to keep any powder dry we prefer to ask first - in case the experts here suggest keeping things low key and over personal messages for now.

The driver is prepared to go the full distance if it causes them strife. About 14 years ago this company towed the driver / keeper when the signs were not in place, the ECP agent being aggressive and all the while the driver had a premature new born in hospital so was too busy and distracted to take the matter up properly. The driver / keeper has waited 14 years for some kind of redress so far and does intend some day to get it so I hope this explains why they want to take the action we have explained. They don't mind if they lose money as long as they ECP significantly more.

I've gleaned some possibilities from googles AI bot which seems to think the driver can take various actions like suing them for obtaining details when they are innocent, threatening to drag the supermarket into it (which we would like to do only to encourage them that ECP are not worth the trouble and lost custom). But whether this AI bot is talking sense I don't know and don't trust hence coming here.

Kind regards

Share on Bluesky Share on Facebook


Courts would take a dim view of deliberately taking a case to court when it could have been avoided.
Writing to tell them you’re not paying and why is evidence to back up your case that you didn’t do this.
Using the courts out of vindictiveness does not seem like a good strategy to me. You’re better spending your effort complaining to their employers - the supermarket - and threatening to withdraw your custom unless they do something about it.

Thanks for the quick reply.

Can the driver just advise them that it would be unwise to take them to court as they have evidence that they did not overstay then - they will subsequently not believe it from what I've heard and proceed to take the driver to court though? Is it really down to the driver to prove this and go to extraordinary lengths to prevent ECP bringing it to court? Surely at some point it becomes harassment. Taken to an extreme it seems that ECP could have no duty to ensure they are competent and just issue notices willy nilly and harass many motorists into paying even when innocent?

And when you say the court would take a dim view, how can this affect the driver? It seems unlikely that an innocent person could face consequences for not assisting a company who is taken them to court wrongly. I can accept that they might not award any damages or anything to the driver but surely they can't find the driver guilty in such a situation and even contempt or something like that - is that really possible? For refusing to assist this company that has failed to ensure the effectiveness of their equipment and made repeated errors?

Thank you again for your comments btw.

Your frustration is understandable, but going into a case with the primary objective of causing the other party 'pain' is generally unwise. Consider 2 scenarios...

Scenario 1
You receive a parking charge notice as a result of a 'double dip'. Confident that the charge has been incorrectly issued, you respond to ECP by way of an appeal, briefly setting out your evidence and explaining that the charge is not owed. They either accept this and cancel, or reject. If they reject, you appeal to POPLA, setting out the same evidence and explaining that the charge is not owed. POPLA either accept this and cancel, or reject. If they reject, ECP may then proceed to court. At this point, you submit a defence and Witness Statement, setting out your evidence, and also drawing attention to the repeated attempts you have made to resolve the matter, and drawing attention to ECP ignoring your compelling evidence and ploughing on with a hopeless case.

Scenario 2
You receive a parking charge notice as a result of a 'double dip'. Wanting to inflict pain on ECP, you do not engage with the matter, with the hope that they will take you to court. When they eventually do, you suddenly produce evidence you have previously not shared, showing that you do not owe the money. Up until this point, ECP are unaware of the technical error that has occurred.

Which of the 2 scenarios do you think would yield the best chance of you convincing a court to award you costs on the basis that ECP have behaved unreasonably?

If you appeal, and show them clear evidence that you don't owe the money, and they still take you to court, you'd have a fair argument that they have behaved unreasonably and should pay costs. If you don't engage, ECP could argue that a not insignificant part of the reason it has ended up in court is because you took no steps to resolve the matter prior to it going to court.

Quote
And when you say the court would take a dim view, how can this affect the driver?
If a judge takes the view that a party to litigation has behaved unreasonably, he can award costs to be paid by the party that has behaved unreasonably. In theory, a party can 'win' their case and still be deemed to have behaved unreasonably. It's quite a high bar, but why take the risk?

You could also look into misuse of personal data and making a claim for this, although this would be somewhat out of the remit of this forum. Again here though, in my view any such claim would be made stronger by showing that you had taken steps to inform them that they should not have accessed and now be continuing to process your data.

Yes OK thank you for that detailed answer.

I've been told that one can request copies of the data - images in this situation obviously - and I wonder if one can request copies of the entire days data (or between rough time periods) so that they can show ECPs images of the driver leaving? Of course it was suggested that this causes the parking company cost which I see as a plus. It will be difficult and expensive for the driver to obtain copies of the cctv that shows them at a different place between the alleged arrival and leaving times in the car park, and it seems that the driver should not have to front that cost when ECP's own video is available. The reason is that its on an old antiquated system, it can't just have a USB stick plugged in and copied. And the visit to a company during this period to return some professional equipment does not currently have a paper trail but is on their computer system (as equipment was logged back into their system). The driver probably won't be able to obtain a paper copy of that easily. I imagine though that at a push in court with the 'backing' of the court it could be supplied.

How does the driver navigate these aspects?

Incidentally the driver is less bothered about being awarded costs or any payment, more interested in costing ECP as much as is possible (in time and solicitors fees etc). Maybe they are so streamlined that its not possible to do that I dont know.

How do you know that they have recorded continuous CCTV coverage?

I think it’s more likely they have ANPR cameras which recognise a car number plate and record it along with a time stamp and a snapshot picture. Or, in your case, don’t.

In which case you’d be asking for something they don’t have.

Can you find others in a similar situation so you can jointly petition the supermarket?
« Last Edit: June 19, 2026, 03:28:23 pm by jfollows »

I wonder if one can request copies of the entire days data (or between rough time periods) so that they can show ECPs images of the driver leaving?
You can request it, but there's no obligation for them to provide it. A Subject Access Request compels them to provide any and all personal data of yours that they hold. Data/images of others people's vehicles would not constitute your data.

Your posts are contradicting each other slightly here. You started off by saying you have good proof, but are now saying that you would still need to obtain evidence, and that this would be "difficult and expensive". If you have the receipts you mentioned, that and a compelling Witness Statement would hopefully tip the balance of probabilities in your favour.

more interested in costing ECP as much as is possible (in time and solicitors fees etc).
Beware the risk of cutting off your nose to spite your face. Everyone involved in your case on ECP's side is being paid for their time dealing with your case, you are not. Last financial year ECP issued an average of 170,938 parking charges every month (based on DVLA request data). Even if only 50% pay up at the £60 rate (I'd estimate it's far far more) then that's £5m a month in revenue. They'll not notice spending a few £100s on a solicitor.

If it were me, I'd be appealing, and if you want to make the point, filing complaints with ECP, British Parking Association, the supermarket, and DVLA.

Well with the supermarket its the usual situation. The manager is probably about as annoyed with ECP as we are, and last time we went in was apologetic, saying how frustrated she was with the situation which happens daily but was powerless to do anything about it. Clearly head office need pressure but maybe this is a country wide thing.

At the minimum ECP need to upgrade their equipment - this really is harassment now, when I open a letter and its one of these, it genuinely causes me distress, elevation of BP and stress and it stays that way until I realise its incorrect. At that point it turns into some degree of 'displeasure' with ECP. Since this is a reoccurring theme I would like it to stop and for ECP to cease and desist harassing us for spending money in this supermarket. I must add, its our sole supermarket and as a family with teenagers who eat a lot we spend something like £6-7k a year there. I don't expect to be treated like this at this establishment.

So whats my best course of action? I am fairly sure that you guys on this forum are sympathetic to my complaint, from previous experience on the older forum. I'm fairly sure you understand my desire to vex the operation of ECP both for long previous and current insults. We were planning on following through fully, going to court etc but if you advise this is not the best course of action, what is - not to make this go away asap, quite the opposite, to drag it out and make ECP spend as much administrative time on it as possible. Even at fair cost to ourselves.

Thanks once again for your comments.


Your posts are contradicting each other slightly here. You started off by saying you have good proof, but are now saying that you would still need to obtain evidence, and that this would be "difficult and expensive". If you have the receipts you mentioned, that and a compelling Witness Statement would hopefully tip the balance of probabilities in your favour.
I have seen the video, and disconnected the disk. But plugging it into a computer does not yield any data. Putting it back on the DVR the video is still there. So its a format that my PC does not recognise. I would probably send it to a expert to extract the video but I don't imagine that would be cheap - I am not sure what point I should do that at. I would hope its not expected that I risk a few hundred pounds expert IT people fees at this point, I would want to know that I had a very good chance of getting it back ideally before doing that (IE I am going to court).

Beware the risk of cutting off your nose to spite your face. Everyone involved in your case on ECP's side is being paid for their time dealing with your case, you are not. Last financial year ECP issued an average of 170,938 parking charges every month (based on DVLA request data). Even if only 50% pay up at the £60 rate (I'd estimate it's far far more) then that's £5m a month in revenue. They'll not notice spending a few £100s on a solicitor.

If it were me, I'd be appealing, and if you want to make the point, filing complaints with ECP, British Parking Association, the supermarket, and DVLA.

Yes, its absolutely true that this is cutting my nose off despite my face. Although OTOH, I am also hoping to kick up a stink with the supermarket in question. I feel that if it did go to court I would have more to rant about on social media etc. 'Supermarket took me to court' type stuff. It has more punch than 'Appeal granted for parking fine error' IMO.

I am done with filing complaints BTW, I don't believe it has any effect whatsoever. Maybe I'm wrong but I think supermarkets are likely to look at the balance of PR vs revenue from these parking operators and it does not take much bad PR when customers spend thousands a year in your supermarket to make a dent IMO - how much ECP are paying for the rights to this car park I don't know but surely its not much. Profit mainly comes from parking fine I imagine.

supermarkets are likely to look at the balance of PR vs revenue from these parking operators
In our anecdotal experience supermarkets are often some of the most responsive in terms of getting parking charges cancelled for genuine customers. Contacting them is always the best starting point.

I am done with filing complaints BTW, I don't believe it has any effect whatsoever.
Single complaints, perhaps, volumes of complaints add up. It is those motorists making a noise (in part through complaints) that kicked the government into action with their much delayed Private Parking bill.

In our anecdotal experience supermarkets are often some of the most responsive in terms of getting parking charges cancelled for genuine customers. Contacting them is always the best starting point.

Yes its absolutely true that the staff at the supermarket cancel it without question. But the shared frustration that both they and we have at these incidents, is the matter to me. Why should we have to face this - essentially bullying or predatory behaviour. It genuinely causes stress. We have done nothing wrong but have to defend ourselves - if we miss the letter (which in this case nearly did happen as it was tucked into a pile of the usual junk that goes directly to recycling) - we suffer the consequences outlined above, with a court taking a dim view (granted maybe if you plead that you missed the letter, they take that into account - or do they even? And why should we need to worry about such things?).

Of course I don't want to preach to the converted but surely it should be the other way around - if they are that confident of their position we should be able to leave it and just respond to the court letters with our evidence? That way there is a cost imposed at least on ECP? Because without that sort of situation I don't really see why ECP should, from a business perspective, make any effort to improve their technical accuracy etc. I would not, given that regulatory environment. In fact it would be of benefit to make mistakes like this as many will either not have a record of their times of attendance or would be intimidated into just paying up, which surely is a very poor state of affairs.

If this is indeed the situation then thank you for letting me know certainly. Its worse than I realised and does make me reassess whether I even want to stick my neck out. But if its not quite this bad and there are other options open to me other than going to the supermarket to cancel it (which if I'm honest feels like, basically, pleading), then please do say, as I would prefer virtually anything other than this option. Other than actually paying ECP that is.


The purpose of this part of the forum is to advise people who wish to challenge parking charges they have received. Our advice is focused on the steps a motorist can take within the system as it stands to get their charge cancelled as quickly and cheaply (both in terms of money and time) as possible. The quickest way to do that is to get the supermarket to cancel it. The second quickest way is to appeal. If you provide good evidence, you have a good chance of getting it cancelled long before court.

If people want to take up the good fight and push for change, that's their call, and I applaud them for doing so. If you want to change the system such that there is stronger regulation of the industry, you should encourage your MP to do what they can to progress the introduction of the Private Parking Bill, preferably not watered down.

Them spending £35 initiating a court claim they inevitably discontinue won't make them change. The government properly regulating the industry just might.

They were clamping vehicles until government outlawed it.


Them spending £35 initiating a court claim they inevitably discontinue won't make them change. The government properly regulating the industry just might.

Yes I see.

The purpose of this part of the forum is to advise people who wish to challenge parking charges they have received. Our advice is focused on the steps a motorist can take within the system as it stands to get their charge cancelled as quickly and cheaply (both in terms of money and time) as possible. The quickest way to do that is to get the supermarket to cancel it. The second quickest way is to appeal. If you provide good evidence, you have a good chance of getting it cancelled long before court.

Understand that too. The members here have previously helped me in that regard (or those on the last forum but I believe its many of the same) and so thanks for that. Its basically not your remit to advise on what I'm asking about though right? I hear your suggestion re writing to my MP and I'll do that for sure.

Re our current situation is there anywhere I can get advice on 'the good fight'? Its small fry as you say, but I wonder whether the hourly rate they pay for their admin is quite as low as you suggest, once everything is taken into account. And I would also hope that if there was a good route to tying them in administrative knots when one is clearly in the right, others would also copy it, so it does feel like something other than a one off route to costing them a few quid and ourselves many hours of effort. But maybe not.

Regarding avoiding getting into trouble with the court, would advising them today that their equipment has made a mistake and that the driver left the car park between their first registered and last registered ANPR records be sufficient? And then leave it in their hands to decide how to proceed? Or does a formal 'appeal' need to be made? Because we would really prefer not to follow their appeal process. It seems that advising them of the facts should be sufficient to cover ourselves with the court surely.




In my view, the priority with individual cases should always be to get the charge cancelled. Once that's done you can pick up the 'good fight'.

In my view, the way to fight the good fight is as I've already said. Lobby your MP, file complaints, build up your knowledge and become a regular on here - I've made far more of a dent in the coffers of private parking companies by offering advice on here (and PePiPoo before this) than I ever have handling my own parking charges.

I don't mean to sound defeatist, but with individual cases there's probably not much that will tie them in knots. When you're issuing 5,000 charges per day, you conduct your business using templates. The best way to fight them is long term, trying to force change to the industry.

As I noted at the start, you could try and sue for misuse of data. That's your choice to make and is not risk free. It would essentially be a GDPR/Data Protection claim, which isn't in my immediate sphere of knowledge.

If it helps the parking company will not give a monkeys about you or your campaign to cause them grief. They see it every day and it's just businessas usual, you do not matter to them and they won't care.

It's not deliberate on their behalf, they will have missed two of the images, when you're seeing millions of vehicle movements a week as  ECP will, even a tiny percentage of double dips will result in a sizeable number of double dips. Double dips can result from dirty plates, tailgating and non compliant plates that have spacing changed or inappropriate screw cap colours as well as poor camera positioning. Mix that up with the fact a lot of PPCs don't even know if their cameras are working yet alone whether they are working well and double dips just become a fact of life they are happy to live with.

If you really want to kick off annoy Tesco (which I assume is the supermarket in question) as they might change provider but seeing as they recently went to tender and stuck with ECP I don't think they will care either.

Get it cancelled and get on with your life.