PCN 52M (Hammersmith & Fulham) Notice of Rejection (Bagley lane NWbnd nos 2a-12)

PCN 52M (Hammersmith & Fulham) Notice of Rejection (Bagley lane NWbnd nos 2a-12)
Posted by Anca.Antohi on 08 Jul, 2025 16:48
Dear All,

This is my second post with a second PCN receive in same day in the span of less then 2h from the H&F London Borough.

I have have had made an appeal as for the first one (HZ91718699 posted on a different topic) and at this time have not managed to get any results this one either.

As I have mentioned the first time I was not expecting any restrictions and was rather under pressure to deliver all packages on time (as deadline for this block was 11AM) and this fine was issued at 10:12AM however would I have known to take an alternative route to deliver this parcel I would have.

I was not expecting to encounter such major road restrictions as they were not previously announced, I do understand the sign, however I am referring prior to this.

It would reckless and hazardous to stop in the middle of the road to check signage of an area nowhere to be found other than London and then backway if not allowed, I fear this might also be a contravention in itself and illegal ?

Please see attached Notice of rejection along with my appeal towards the case. Should they not have considered any of their previous decisions as to show lenience as a precedent has been established, should they have not considered as cancelled my PCNs as well ?

Does anybody know what chances would I have if I take this to London Tribunals for an adjudicator to have a second look ? Am I just wasting my time ?

I would still do it since I don't have the money to pay them and this would grant me about to 2 months at best case scenario before they send in the bailiffs to collect ? Problem is I would then pay £160 each for a total of £320 ....

Attached my appeal and their response to my appeal as well some evidence I have had to submit at the time. For some reason the time stamp on the block summitted as evidence was wrong however now showing right (it was suppose to be 7AM not 9AM).

Please leave your opinion or advice below if anyone encountered this before ?

What do you reckon is the best course of action ?

Thanks in advance to anybody reading this.

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#1 Reply
Posted by Incandescent on 08 Jul, 2025 18:34
See my response to your other thread. If the circumstances and location are the same, it might be better to combine your threads into one.

#2 Reply
Posted by Anca.Antohi on 11 Jul, 2025 14:06
They are the same contravention however in a different location. Circumstances slightly different.

Question still remains: Are they not obligated to respect a precedent ? in same circumstances why is this different ?

Just to make it easier:

PCN: HZ91637553
REG: YC09OWH

Do I have any chances running with my defense via quoting a previous situation (as I know they are called precedents)

I think I found around 2-3 cases similar on this site when I made my appeal.

Also please have a look below, on the links below to see more on this matter, if you might want to see about their initiative, and if its about clean air or getting millions of PCNs out.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2024/03/30/hammersmith-fulham-council-ltn-pcn-fines-one-million-month/

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-13258791/Motorists-stung-1million-fines-hated-Low-Traffic-Neighbourhood-Hammersmith-Fulham-blamed-causing-problems-elsewhere.html

Please let me know if you have any idea on the precedent situation.

Just as reminder the case I used in my initial appeal was:

Rinat Bikatov v London Borough of
Waltham Forest Case no. 2120030405

#3 Reply
Posted by John U.K. on 11 Jul, 2025 16:22
As per yr earlier thread, we need to see
all sides of the PCN (redact only yr name & address - leave all else in),
a copy of yr reps to the Council'
and
a copy of their Notice of Rejection (only redact yr name & address).

#4 Reply
Posted by Incandescent on 11 Jul, 2025 22:57
Quote
Question still remains: Are they not obligated to respect a precedent ?
No, and neither is there any obligation at London Tribunals to respect precedents.

#5 Reply
Posted by H C Andersen on 12 Jul, 2025 11:04
I would still do it since I don't have the money to pay them and this would grant me about to 2 months at best case scenario before they send in the bailiffs to collect ? Problem is I would then pay £160 each for a total of £320 ...

Think again.

If bailiffs arrived at your door they'd be demanding (£160+£80+£10+£75+£235+£160+80+£10+£75) = £885.

£160 - the standard penalty;
£80 - the surcharge of 50%;
£10 - court registration fee;
£75 - bailiff compliance fee;
£235 - bailiff enforcement fee.

#6 Reply
Posted by Anca.Antohi on 15 Jul, 2025 15:10
Quote from: H C Andersen on 12 Jul, 2025 11:04
I would still do it since I don't have the money to pay them and this would grant me about to 2 months at best case scenario before they send in the bailiffs to collect ? Problem is I would then pay £160 each for a total of £320 ...

Think again.

If bailiffs arrived at your door they'd be demanding (£160+£80+£10+£75+£235+£160+80+£10+£75) = £885.

£160 - the standard penalty;
£80 - the surcharge of 50%;
£10 - court registration fee;
£75 - bailiff compliance fee;
£235 - bailiff enforcement fee.

Hi,

Yes I was looking at only getting 2 months extra, not looking at bailiff procedures, however not being paid like some at Croydon council with £726/ph it just piles on my poor situation making it even harder to pay, raising my stress levels and having just another bit to deal with. But having been in contact directly with someone dealing in the field (from this website) Mr Ivan (ivanleo@gmail.com) with these and chances to win are silm 50-50 at best from what I gather and that is if they make a technical error and pull out something called a wrong traffic order ...

After the fee, if we win (and it's a big if) plus all the effort and fact I might need to waste some more time in the tribunal to testify and whatever else legal procedures, it makes more sense to just pay them.

It's not fair, it's discriminating, however life's not fair. I might just have to add another minus to my almost finishing overdraft and pay the £160 (for the pair).

I was just looking forward to a couple of questions, if precedent is being applied, answer being no, my defense is about 0. And as for height of the sign, that would only apply to one of them. Losing one and winning another leads to same results....

I'll give it until Thursday see if anybody comes with any ideas for how I can appeal and win, if not will just add another minus on top of all the minuses on the card.

Thanks for your input.

#7 Reply
Posted by Anca.Antohi on 15 Jul, 2025 15:33
Quote from: John U.K. on 11 Jul, 2025 16:22
As per yr earlier thread, we need to see
all sides of the PCN (redact only yr name & address - leave all else in),
a copy of yr reps to the Council'
and
a copy of their Notice of Rejection (only redact yr name & address).

Dear Sir,

I have mentioned that I have attached the a copy of the notice of rejection to this thread. Please download it's already available, also inside this notice of rejection you will find.

- My appeal or legal representation of what case I made for myself to get this dismissed
- Their decision (the council's) Response from their rep rejecting my appeal.

This is a PDF file as was received via email from themselves. The file name is P0010700673. It made more sense of attaching as a PDF rather then take a photo of each page, at it's 6 pages long (this site has a limit of 4 documents, and there is also a loss in quality, easier to read and also full search capabilities within the document.

This document is more comprehensive then the PCN itself, however since you are requiring this I will also attach the document.

So please see it attached here.

I did not censor the document as really if someone steals my identity or tries to break or steal my car they will be really disappointed, not to mention our data is being sold daily (as per the huge amount of emails and scam calls everyone is receiving).

I mean by all accounts people are constantly missing the fact all details have already been shared asking for PCN number and vehicle reg, when they have been shared since the very beginning, I think I might be safe on this forum.

Let me know if you have any viable idea on how I might structure a defense that works.

Thanks in advance. Let me know if there is anything else you might require.

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#8 Reply
Posted by Anca.Antohi on 15 Jul, 2025 16:17
Quote from: Anca.Antohi on 15 Jul, 2025 15:33
Quote from: John U.K. on 11 Jul, 2025 16:22
As per yr earlier thread, we need to see
all sides of the PCN (redact only yr name & address - leave all else in),
a copy of yr reps to the Council'
and
a copy of their Notice of Rejection (only redact yr name & address).

Sorry,

Missed one page. Please see it here.

Thanks in advance.

(Attachment Link)