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Messages - rumple_silly

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Civil penalty charge notices (Councils, TFL and so on) / Re: Kingston Council, PCN 31J – Entering and stopping in a yellow box, Kingston Road
« on: December 21, 2025, 12:44:03 pm »
Quote from: Hippocrates on December 13, 2025, 01:32:35 pm
Quote from: rumple_silly on December 13, 2025, 12:35:04 pm
Unfortunately have received a reply from Kingston Council stating the representation has been rejected, upholding the original PCN. As for the two procedural improprieties (i) notice period, and (ii) vague locus the council's letter states that 'we are satisfied that this PCN has been issued correctly and would be upheld on this occasion.'

Now have a choice to settle for £80 or appeal to the Environment and Traffic Adjudicator within 28 days where risk if £160 is due. Does anyone have a view on the chances of being successful with the ETA?
Yes: fight it and I will assist free of charge. I'll PM you my details. Can we see the NOR? And what you wrote?

Hippo, I have DM'd you what I wrote, and a scan of the NOR. Thanks

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Civil penalty charge notices (Councils, TFL and so on) / Re: Kingston Council, PCN 31J – Entering and stopping in a yellow box, Kingston Road
« on: December 20, 2025, 04:33:31 pm »
Thanks Hippo. Will PM you the NOR later today. 

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Civil penalty charge notices (Councils, TFL and so on) / Re: Kingston Council, PCN 31J – Entering and stopping in a yellow box, Kingston Road
« on: December 13, 2025, 12:35:04 pm »
Unfortunately have received a reply from Kingston Council stating the representation has been rejected, upholding the original PCN. As for the two procedural improprieties (i) notice period, and (ii) vague locus the council's letter states that 'we are satisfied that this PCN has been issued correctly and would be upheld on this occasion.'

Now have a choice to settle for £80 or appeal to the Environment and Traffic Adjudicator within 28 days where risk if £160 is due. Does anyone have a view on the chances of being successful with the ETA?

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Civil penalty charge notices (Councils, TFL and so on) / Re: Kingston Council, PCN 31J – Entering and stopping in a yellow box, Kingston Road
« on: November 22, 2025, 02:43:26 pm »
Great, noted and thanks all. I have filed made the representation using the lack of compliance and my mitigating circumstances.

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Civil penalty charge notices (Councils, TFL and so on) / Re: Kingston Council, PCN 31J – Entering and stopping in a yellow box, Kingston Road
« on: November 22, 2025, 12:34:56 pm »
Hippo, much appreciated and all points noted - I am almost there. Always takes me time (and research) to understand the subtlety of the argument (blame the finance rather than legal or linguistic background....)

I was about to submit my appeal online but notice Kingston's online system doesn't provide a check-box for procedural impropriety as appeal grounds. See grounds below....maybe I need to write to the council via a physical letter by post




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Civil penalty charge notices (Councils, TFL and so on) / Re: Kingston Council, PCN 31J – Entering and stopping in a yellow box, Kingston Road
« on: November 21, 2025, 05:41:32 pm »
Noted :) I am going to try my luck then I guess. I note the PCN doesn't include (i) procedural errors (as noted by Hippo), or (ii) mitigating explanations in my case, just wondering if I should submit on both grounds or whether it would be stronger to point to the procedural errors only. Many thanks

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Civil penalty charge notices (Councils, TFL and so on) / Re: Kingston Council, PCN 31J – Entering and stopping in a yellow box, Kingston Road
« on: November 19, 2025, 08:55:34 pm »
Thanks for the responses. Bit noob to this so been trying to get my head round the references (including a review of underlying legislation and previous appeal)....

Hippo, in my appeal response is it enough to simply point out the locus is vague, or should I also add the other omission you noted?

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Civil penalty charge notices (Councils, TFL and so on) / Kingston Council, PCN 31J – Entering and stopping in a yellow box, Kingston Road
« on: November 15, 2025, 02:57:21 pm »
Hi all,
I’ve received a Penalty Charge Notice (PCN) from the Royal Borough of Kingston upon Thames. The details are as follows:
•PCN Number: QT11494216
•Vehicle Registration: PO64PKC
•Date of Notice: 11/11/2025
•Alleged Contravention: 31J – Entering and stopping in a box junction when prohibited (camera enforcement)
•Location: Kingston Road
•Date/Time of Contravention: 08/11/2025 at 15:59
I would appreciate advice on whether there are any grounds to challenge this PCN, or if there are any known issues with Kingston’s enforcement of box junctions at this location. I have not yet made any payment or representation.
Images of the PCN and evidence:
I have uploaded all sides of the PCN and the evidence images to imgpile.com – see links below.
• PCN




• Evidence images







Google Street View link to location:

Google Street View of location

My argument

The video file (accessible via the council’s evidence portal) is key in my view. As the video shows, as I was driving down Kingston Road the car in front started indicating right. To stop before the yellow box would have required me to break sharply, risking collison from the rear – plus my family was in the car. Hence, I took the decision to continue into the box in the expectation the car in front would clear it before I had to stop: unfortunately, the car in front stopped early and took their turn late – all meaning I spent a few seconds inside the box.


I’m keen to understand if there are any technical or procedural flaws I can use, or if there’s any advice on how best to proceed. Please let me know if you need any more information or images.
Thank you for your help!

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