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I will do so.

Hey buddy appreciate your help in this.
It looks like the notice of rejection was issued. Below is the letter that came in the post, what do you need from me?








Notice of Rejection
Thank you for your representation received regarding the above Penalty Charge Notice (PCN).
We acknowledge the comments raised in your representation stating that the bus lane is incorrect location on the PCN the location specified on the PCN is incorrect and misleading and the alleged contravention is stated to have occurred approximately 268 meters away from the actual location where the vehicle were recorded. You also add that the contravention did not occur and the embedded photograph and video evidence provided for the PCN lacks any proof of relevant signage either passed or in situ including any relevant road markers proving that this occurred on a bus lane.

We issued the PCN because your vehicle was observed travelling within a bus lane in A406 N CIRCULAR W-BND CHEQUERS WAY GREEN LANES on 15/01/2025 at 08:17. Travelling within a bus lane during its operational hours constitutes a contravention. The bus lane is clearly sign posted and marked out on the road surface. The legend 'BUS LANE' is marked on the road, and there is a solid white line running along the right-hand edge of the bus lane for its full length.

Buses, Dial-a-Ride Buses, Pedal Cycles, Taxis and Solo Motorcycles Mon - Sun At Any Time

The onus is on the driver to be aware of the bus lane and its restrictions. Drivers are not permitted to drive in a bus lane during its period of operation. We have checked and the signage and markings meet all the statutory requirements as set down in the Traffic Signs Regulations & General Direction 2016. Please note the onus is on the driver to be aware of road signs as laid out in the Highway Code, section 120: "Bus and Tram Lanes... are shown by road markings and signs. You must not drive or stop in a bus lane during its period of operation unless the signs indicate you may do so." (Law RTRA scts 5& 8).

Transport for London (TfL) has considered your representation in accordance with the requirements of the above Act but we do not accept that you have established grounds or suitable reasons for the penalty charge to be cancelled. This letter is issued as a formal Notice of Rejection of your representation.

When considering representations and appeals, we fully consider all the circumstances present including any mitigating factors and whether it would be appropriate to apply our discretion over the enforcement of a PCN. In this instance we have decided not to exercise that discretion as we do not consider the mitigating factors present give reason to cancel the PCN(s) because your vehicle was observed travelling within a bus lane in A406 N CIRCULAR W-BND CHEQUERS WAY GREEN LANES on 15/01/2025 at 08:17. It is clear the PCN has been correctly issued.

You should now make full payment for the outstanding PCN(s) within 28 days of service of this Notice. The amounts) currently due is set out below.

You may appeal to an Environment and Traffic Adjudicator at London Tribunals, an independent adjudication service, against this decision on specified grounds within 28 days of the date of service of this letter. The adjudicator will consider your appeal and make an independent decision, which Transport for London will comply with. Please do not send your appeal to us and be aware an Adjudicator can only decide an appeal on statutory grounds. Further information is available on the London Tribunals website.

If you want to appeal to an Environment and Traffic Adjudicator at London Tribunals please ensure you read the enclosed form carefully, in particular the Appeal Procedure, and then complete, sign and send the attached form within 28 days of the date of service of this letter to London Tribunals, PO Box 10598, Nottingham, NG6 6DR.

You should be aware that in prescribed circumstances, the Adjudicator may award costs against you if the appeal is considered frivolous or vexatious or that the making, pursuing or resisting of the appeal was wholly unreasonable. Equally costs may be awarded against Transport for London if the adjudicator considers that the disputed decision was wholly unreasonable.

If you do not pay the penalty charge or submit an appeal within 28 days of the date of service of this notice of rejection a Charge Certificate may be served. This increases the penalty charge by 50% of the original amount. If the increased Penalty Charge is not paid, then Transport for London will apply to the County Court to recover the charges which will incur a further charge of £10 per Penalty Charge Notice.

HOW TO PAY
a). Credit/Debit card payments may be made ONLINE at tfl.gov.uk/redroutepayments
b). Credit/Debit card payments may be made by downloading the TfL pay to drive in London app
c). Payment can be made by POST to:

Red Routes
PO Box 335
Darlington
DL1 9PU

PLEASE DO NOT SEND CASH IN THE POST. All cheques/postal orders must be made payable to Transport for London and crossed "a/c payee". Please ensure your vehicle registration and Penalty Charge Number are written clearly on the back. Post-dated cheques will not be accepted.


Quote from: Partypops on March 21, 2025, 08:34:21 am

Quote from: cp8759 on March 21, 2025, 12:12:42 am

@Partypops in all honesty, given that TFL will issue a notice of rejection no matter what you say, that will do.

Could have used some of that honesty from the start as I may have made use of the discounted cost.

You misunderstand: TFL will reject anything you say, London Tribunals will give you a fair hearing and we have won almost every bus lane appeal since 2022. Like many you seem to be labouring under the misapprehension that TFL gets to make the final decision, this is not the case. The whole point of the process is to get a notice of rejection so that you can appeal to London Tribunals. I'm sure Hippocrates would be more than happy to represent you, so you won't have to actually do anything other than give him the paperwork.

Ok thanks

I have now submitted the formal challenge online and saved the confirmation that it is submitted.

If we appeal to tribunal, how does the process actually work? Is this like the small money claims process where you wait until they take to court and then make representations? What is the worst case scenario costs? Will it still be £160 if tribunal outcome is to pay?

I will dig out my previous drafts re another member's case.

Thanks, I did manage to find this appeal below. Tweaked it abit and added point number 5. Is this valid?


Dear TFL

Ref:  PCN
      VRM

I make this initial challenge as follows:

The PCN is unenforceable because:

1. The reference to The Interpretation Act is both irrelevant and confusing as the legislation pertaining to Bus Lane enforcement refers to actions which may be taken by the authority and/or appellant from the date of the notice.

2. The statement: "Any written correspondence before the issue of the Enforcement Notice will not be treated as a formal representation." fetters discretion and is contrary to the legislation in that it clearly implies that you will send an Enforcement Notice when the legislation states "may" at 4(3)(e)

https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukla/1996/9/section/4/enacted

3. The statement: "It will not entitle you to the right of appeal." is both absurd and flies in the face of the law and natural justice. Further, the next statement about consideration seems to contradict what has been previously stated.

4. The statement: "Failure to respond or contact us within 28 days of the service date of this notice will result in the Enforcement Notice automatically being sent to you after this period." similarly fetters discretion and also misstates the time period.

5. Incorrect Location on the PCN: The location specified on the PCN is incorrect and misleading. The alleged contravention is stated to have occurred approximately 268 meters away from the actual location where the vehicle was recorded. This discrepancy in location renders the PCN defective, as it fails to provide the driver with precise information about where the alleged offence took place.

Under Regulation 8(5) of the London Local Authorities Act 1996, a PCN must state “the grounds on which the council or, as the case may be, Transport for London believe that a penalty charge is payable with respect to the vehicle.” Providing an inaccurate location does not meet this requirement, as it prevents the recipient from properly assessing the alleged contravention and preparing a fair defense.

Furthermore, the adjudicator in James Harris v Haringey (case reference 2190464396, London Tribunals) ruled that a PCN must contain a clear and correct location, as an inaccurate location could lead to unfairness and procedural impropriety. Given this, the PCN issued in this case is flawed and should be cancelled.


The alleged contravention did not occur

The embedded photograph and video evidence provided for the PCN lacks any proof of relevant signage either passed or in situ including any relevant road markers proving that this occurred on a bus lane.

Camera authorisation

I put you to strict proof that the camera used to capture the alleged contravention has the correct certification. If this is not forthcoming, this will be another ground of appeal.

In light of the above, please cancel the PCN,

Name

Addresss

@Partypops post the enforcement notice please.

Yes.

Apologies, here.

@Partypops post the enforcement notice please.

Here it is

Quote from: Partypops on February 13, 2025, 03:34:34 pm

Hey sorry if the question seems obvious here but why would I want to wait for the enforcement notice?

@Partypops informal representations are largely pointless, TFL are not required to consider them nor are they required to respond. Even if they do, they will just reject at which point the next step is to... wait for the enforcement notice and then make formal representations against the enforcement notice.

You cannot email representations to TFL, even if you have a valid email address they are only required to consider representations made in the form and manner stated on the PCN, and email is not one of them. Therefore even if you make representations by email, TFL will say that they are entitled to ignore them, which might make you think they're a bunch of so-and-sos but it's legally correct.

Therefore you might as well preserve your one and only chance to make representations online for the enforcement notice stage.

Thanks I understand now, what crooks TFL are. How is that even legal to not consider representations before discount is expired. That is really sneaky of them. I would like to use my appeal “chance” on the website at the enforcement stage so I will wait for the next stage and submit an appeal online here.

@cp8759 Okay this makes it clearer? They will reject anyway but I will draft something. Keep a record of everything.

https://www.ftla.uk/civil-penalty-charge-notices-(councils-tfl-and-so-on)/tfl-bus-lane-contravention-n-circular-rd-btw-chequers-way-green-lanes/msg30167/#msg30167

Try that. Plus draft your own additions. And report back please.

From mrmustard to me recently: cccorrespondence@tfl.gov.uk

Will wait for enforcement before submitting appeal as noted above so that representation gets through the right channel at the correct stage. Do you suggest I use that appeal for my case or could you help draft something more tailored? Such as the distance of camera etc.

@Partypops if you make representations against the PCN they will be rejected but you will also lose the opportunity to make representations online, because the button to make representations online will disappear (it only works once) which means that when you get the Enforcement Notice, you will have to make representations by post. If those get lost in the post there could be a lot of administrative hassle in resetting matters.

Personally I would recommend you wait for the Enforcement Notice and simply make a formal representation against that, if you do that via the TFL website there won't be any issues of TFL not receiving the representations, and you'll be able to take a screenshot of the confirmation page as proof that they have actually received your representations.

It's almost impossible to lose a London bus lane PCN as long as it is argued properly, so forget about paying the discount as you'd be throwing your money away for nothing.

Hey sorry if the question seems obvious here but why would I want to wait for the enforcement notice? I haven’t made have any representations yet so still have that option online and you mention it will get rejected at this stage?

You mention its better to do it on the TFL website so why not do it now as you mentioned its almost impossible to lose a appeal against bus lanes?