Free Traffic Legal Advice

But what were your reps? You didn't post them here first

So I originally used their online portal to write what you see in the first post:

I wish to challenge this notice:

Per TSRGD 2016 paragraph 11  "a person must not cause a vehicle to enter the box junction so that the vehicle has to stop within the box junction due to the presence of oncoming vehicles or other stationary vehicles beyond the box junction. "

As you can see from the photographs, there is space  beyond the junction, behind the stationary vehicle in my lane. I have measured this using google satellite view at 4.8 metres (the length of a lane marking).  My motorcycle is  only 2.1 metres long, so it did not have to stop due to the presence of the stationary vehicle beyond the box junction - there would have been space to clear the box.

(Please see also adjudicator case ref  2160252038)

but after about a few days with no response or any indication they'd received it, I sent a slightly longer version by email

Hi

I sent this through the online system last week but have not received a
response, so I am sending it again in case it got lost. Please
acknowledge receipt of one or the other, thanks.

PCN number FR63429636
VRM EX02ZDZ
Date of alleged contravention 07/09/2024 16:56

Location: Hall Lane E4 / Sinclair Road E4 (cctv)

I am challenging this PCN on the ground that there was no contravention.

Per TSRGD 2016 paragraph 11 "a person must not cause a vehicle to enter
the box junction so that the vehicle has to stop within the box junction
due to the presence of oncoming vehicles or other stationary vehicles
beyond the box junction. "

As you can see from the photographs, there is space beyond the junction,
behind the stationary vehicle in my lane. I have measured this using
Google Satellite view at 4.8 metres (the length of a lane marking).  My
motorcycle is only 2.1 metres long, so it follows that I did not have to
stop due to the presence of the stationary vehicle beyond the box
junction - there would have been space to clear the box.

I ask you therefore to cancel the PCN. I refer to your own "PCN
Cancellation Procedure & Guidelines" page 29, which states that "Camera
record shows that vehicle entered box when exit was not clear and
obstructed the vehicle path taken by other traffic movements." As is
evident in the video you have kindly provided, neither of these
conditions apply in this case.

So it probably depends on which version of the reps they're responding to (I did get an email acknowledgement of the second one)

I didn't mention in either version that I was barely in the box and only for a few seconds. Do you think it would have changed the outcome?

I came home yesterday to find a PCN for stopping with my motorbike front wheel over the edge of a box junction, which is a bit frustrating as I thought I'd stopped before it not on it and there was plenty of space for anyone to get by yadda yadda

Anyway, after close review of the video and of Google satellite images and of the relevant section of TSRGD 2016, I took the view that no offence had been committed because there was actually a space in my lane after the box that I could have moved forward into, but chose not to. So I crafted a challenge as follows, and sent it off using the council's online gateway

I wish to challenge this notice:

Per TSRGD 2016 paragraph 11  "a person must not cause a vehicle to enter the box junction so that the vehicle has to stop within the box junction due to the presence of oncoming vehicles or other stationary vehicles beyond the box junction. "

As you can see from the photographs, there is space  beyond the junction, behind the stationary vehicle in my lane. I have measured this using google satellite view at 4.8 metres (the length of a lane marking).  My motorcycle is  only 2.1 metres long, so it did not have to stop due to the presence of the stationary vehicle beyond the box junction - there would have been space to clear the box.

(Please see also adjudicator case ref  2160252038)

I didn't know this forum existed until after I'd sent the response, so if I did that bit wrong it's too late now I guess. I suppose I could also have pointed out that I was barely even in the box and only there  for 8 seconds but I thought that would just over-complicate things.

* https://imgur.com/a/MI1sKSu PCN front page and video

*

* https://maps.app.goo.gl/qEfSBQ87ttH4Fi4C8 street view

Does anyone want to fill me in on what is likely to to happen next? If LBWF reject the challenge then the fine goes from £65 to £130 so I'm reluctant to take it to appeal unless there's 90% certainty the change will be cancelled.  What do you think?