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Messages - LividFromE17

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The conflation argument does not run anymore.  Last positive outcome was October 2022.  2220655455. I was the representative.

Thanks Hippocrates, that's good to know and explains why it's no longer in the spreadsheet of known flaws.

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Hi all,

I posted this on Pepipoo initially but as it's defunkt I'm reposting here for reference.

I appealed the PCN here on several grounds:

Representations to Adjudicator


It was allowed due to the placement of the CCTV not showing the signage at the time of the contravention.

Appeal Allowed

I hope this helps others, and maybe it can go onto the known flaws document?  Although it is only this specific camera.

Ash

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@LividFromE17, have you received the NOR letter yet? First thing to check is whether the wording relating to the sign positions has been updated.

Aha! Yes I have! How very timely as I am at this very moment posting the NoR and considering my next move.
It does indeed have the same wording, so I shall detail this in my appeal to Adjudicator, and I am very grateful to you for your time in following this up.

NoR p1
NoR p2
NoR p3

nb - as well as this error - this is also the NoR template which has the omission flaw referred to on the spreadsheet: Shelley Sinclair v London Borough of Lewisham (218033612A, 26 September 2018), not advising of the Tribunal's power to accept a late appeal.

...and the PCNs for both conflate of periods of allowance: 

Quote
“If you fail to pay the penalty charge or make representations before the end of the
period of 28 days beginning with the date of service of this notice, a charge certificate
may be issued to you increasing the penalty charge payable to...”

This is also true of another appeal I made in February that came into the list on 12 June 2024, for which I'm still waiting the decision on (how long does is it supposed to take?).

So - my question now is, should I appeal to the Adjudicator on all three points?

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@timoteus at this point it would be really helpful if you could make a subject access request to WF council to find out exactly why they DNC'ed your appeal

I've submitted an SAR - it's stated that a response may take up to 1 month to be received

Thanks for doing that @timoteus, it's appreciated.

5
Please post up what you wrote.

Here is my appeal - submitted via their online system.

I wish to appeal against this PCN as I do not think the signage is adequate.

There is no signage at the entrance to the road saying there is no through road, or that it is one-way.  I approached from the south travelling northbound on Blackhorse Lane E17 and took a right turn into the road. I am not familiar with this road at all, but once safely turned into the road I proceeded down it scanning for a parking spot.

The fact I hadn't seen it supports that it's in an unusual spot, some 30m or further from the entrance to the road. It's not at the entrance to the road or at any natural junction, at a point where the road is lined with parked cars, and not at all anywhere a driver would expect. There are no other visual clues, such as planters or chicanes which you would usually find for such modal filters.  Hence I had no idea and was busily looking for parking spots. Any driver who has driven to this point would then - if they'd seen these signs - have to make a u-turn.

Furthermore, the "No Entry" markings on the road itself are confusing in conjunction with the signs, as they contradict the right of cyclists and those using non-motorised forms of transport to proceed - they are more appropriate to one way streets, which this one clearly isn’t.

I request that the PCN be cancelled due to inadequate, unexpected and confusing signage.

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Indeed, thank you for your reply.  I have made the informal challenge so let's see what they come back with. I am not expecting a cancellation though.  Will update once I receive the reply.
Sorry to be pedantic, but this is a postal PCN. There is no informal challenge stage, you've submitted formal representations. The next stage is an appeal to the Adjudicator if your representations are not accepted.

That said it's likely they will re-offer the discount if they reject your representations.

Not all all! Thanks for correcting me, I see the difference and yes they do say they hold at the discount rate if appealed within 14 days of the date of the notice.

7
Indeed, thank you for your reply.  I have made the informal challenge so let's see what they come back with. I am not expecting a cancellation though.  Will update once I receive the reply.

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Hi all,

I just referred to another post by @timoteus with exactly the same PCN curcumstances on the adjacent road here that was uncontested by WF:

https://www.ftla.uk/civil-penalty-charge-notices-(councils-tfl-and-so-on)/waltham-forest-code-52m-failure-to-comply-with-a-prohibition-on-certain-types-of/

Same circumstances - I entered from south going northbound, and drove along the road looking beyond for parking spaces. I am really cross with myself as I completely missed these signs so on the CCTV I look bang to rights. I was completely oblivious, probably due to scanning beyond them for a parking spot.

I was about to pay up but did a little search first and found WF had not contested the PCN, but I can't see why?

Anyone have any insight - could it have been an issue like staffing, or because of the conflicting no exit sign at the entrance that they failed to remove, or simply good fortune for the recipient? Should I quote Timoteus' one?  Not sure whether it sets a precedent or not.

Many thanks in advance.

PCN Page 1
PCN Page 2
PCN Page 3
PCN Page 4

9
 :o

Interesting. But good for you!

I wonder why they didn't contest this as I can't see anything immediately obvious. Could it have been some other issue like staffing?

I'm checking this post as I received one on the next road - Tavistock Avenue where the modal filter is exactly the same. I'm really cross with myself as they seem crystal clear on the CCTV, but when driving I was completely oblivious, probably due to scanning beyond them for a parking spot.

It's often worth a shot appealing a PCN, but not sure my 'didn't see them' would cut it!  Yet here we are - an uncontested win!

Anyone have any insight as to why they didn't contest, was this just good fortune for the recipient?  Should I quote this one?  Not sure it sets a precedent or not.

I will post mine own on another thread so we can compare outcomes.

Many thanks in advance.



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