Free Traffic Legal Advice
Live cases legal advice => Speeding and other criminal offences => Topic started by: 8vaibhav on August 10, 2024, 10:31:48 pm
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not sure why police asks for the details the 2nd time to assign points
Because the legislation says they have to.
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...but is there a way to be 100% sure my license details have reached the police?
How about ringing them to ask them?
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How long does it take for the penalty points to show up online at gov.uk ? (Mine still shows that I have no penalty points)
I have paid £100 fixed penalty as instructed and also replied in writing with my details again (not sure why police asks for the details the 2nd time to assign points).
It's been two weeks, I do have proof of posting but is there a way to be 100% sure my license details have reached the police?
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Are you asking us to tell you what the bit you posted says?
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there has been time enough for them to send next communication,
Well there has, but that would actually be a fast turnaround, 2-3 weeks is more normal.
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I did respond by mailing the physical form.
Was just thinking since 22nd there has been time enough for them to send next communication, seems it will come soon. Thanks.
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Hello all, I see the following in my ndors account activity (after having identified myself as the driver for the said speeding incident). Can someone kindly advise what would be the next steps?
Should I lookout for a letter or an email (neither has come till now) for the £100 fixed penalty + 3 points, or is there another possible outcome here?
Activity Date/Time:
22/08/2024 05:13
Actor:
METROPOLITAN POLICE
Activity:
Police Force METROPOLITAN POLICE undertook an eligibility check for course National Speed Awareness Course with outcome not eligible for course offer (reference number xxxxxxxxxxxxxx).
You said above "I will respond to the notice online", and were the advised that you should not.
If you did, the 'next steps' would probably be court action for failure to identify the driver, in about six months time.
If you responded in writing within the time limit as required, then the next step would normally be a fixed penalty offer.
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It means they checked and found out you aren't eligible for another course, exactly as it says.
So you can now expect an offer of a fixed penalty.
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Hello all, I see the following in my ndors account activity (after having identified myself as the driver for the said speeding incident). Can someone kindly advise what would be the next steps?
Should I lookout for a letter or an email (neither has come till now) for the £100 fixed penalty + 3 points, or is there another possible outcome here?
Activity Date/Time:
22/08/2024 05:13
Actor:
METROPOLITAN POLICE
Activity:
Police Force METROPOLITAN POLICE undertook an eligibility check for course National Speed Awareness Course with outcome not eligible for course offer (reference number xxxxxxxxxxxxxx).
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If you do that, The camera is assumed to be reliable unless it is proved otherwise and that proof will have to come from you. That is considerably more than a "hassle".
Before you get all 'conspiracy theory' the same is held true for all mechanical devices and even software (the Post Office lobbied for software to be included in a review in the early noughties - thus deeming Horizon accurate unless the contrary was proven conveniently) and has been for a long time. So the evidence of a measurement using a 12" rule is accurate unless proven otherwise.
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But even assuming you somehow have sure shot evidence of camera's faultiness, hassle of court proceedings is severe deterrent I would think. In my case the camera certificate seemed to have very recent dates, so I doubt I can argue it was faulty.
At no time during this thread have you suggested the speed alleged was incorrect. So why are you exploring the idea that the camera may have been faulty? Surely, before you do that, the first question to ask yourself (and answer) is "what speed was I doing?" If you believe you were doing 24mph or thereabouts it would seem to suggest the camera is quite accurate and so the question of its reliability becomes somewhat irrelevant.
You cannot simply "put the prosecution to proof" by asking them to prove your guilt. If you do that, the camera is assumed to be reliable unless it is proved otherwise and that proof will have to come from you. That is considerably more than a "hassle".
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Thanks, I will respond to the notice online.
It seems even if there was a compelling reason to appeal (faulty camera for example), the hassle of going to court would rarely be worth it, unless too many points already on licence.
A faulty camera would be an excellent reason to plead NG in court.
The difficulty is demonstrating it it faulty. The defence needs to do that.
But even assuming you somehow have sure shot evidence of camera's faultiness, hassle of court proceedings is severe deterrent I would think. In my case the camera certificate seemed to have very recent dates, so I doubt I can argue it was faulty.
(modification) Just Read the other thread here and know best not to bother thinking about challenging at all. Thanks all.
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Thanks, I will respond to the notice online.
It seems even if there was a compelling reason to appeal (faulty camera for example), the hassle of going to court would rarely be worth it, unless too many points already on licence.
A faulty camera would be an excellent reason to plead NG in court.
The difficulty is demonstrating it it faulty. The defence needs to do that.
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Thanks, I will respond to the notice online.
It says: "Please return the filled in and signed document to the address above."
You can only respond online if you were not the driver.
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Enforcement starts at +10% +2mph, noting that as speed cameras round down, that means no enforcement up to 23.99mph.
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Thanks, I will respond to the notice online.
It seems even if there was a compelling reason to appeal (faulty camera for example), the hassle of going to court would rarely be worth it, unless too many points already on licence.
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Many thanks, out of curiosity what can be a good defence? Faulty speed camera/medical emergency?
I suppose even then if would require going to court, so just not worth it, even if that.
Also, is there any grace allowed over 20mph?
There are lots of possible good defences, but as we don’t make thinks up you can tell us of the scenario.
Technical defences would be a defective Traffic Regulation Order (that sets the limit) or signage (that tells you of that limit).
Most speed cameras are very accurate, I’m not sure what type is fitted on VE.
Yes,as in all limits grace is +10%+2mph so 24 in a 20, you were caught at the lowest detected speed they enforce.
??
Grace is 10% + 1 and enforcement from 10% + 2?
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Many thanks, out of curiosity what can be a good defence? Faulty speed camera/medical emergency?
I suppose even then if would require going to court, so just not worth it, even if that.
Also, is there any grace allowed over 20mph?
There are lots of possible good defences, but as we don’t make thinks up you can tell us of the scenario.
Technical defences would be a defective Traffic Regulation Order (that sets the limit) or signage (that tells you of that limit).
Most speed cameras are very accurate, I’m not sure what type is fitted on VE.
Yes,as in all limits grace is +10%+2mph so 24 in a 20, you were caught at the lowest detected speed they enforce.
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Unless you have a good defence (which you haven't mentioned) you will be found guilty, at a cost nearer £1,000.
Many thanks, out of curiosity what can be a good defence? Faulty speed camera/medical emergency?
I suppose even then if would require going to court, so just not worth it, even if that.
Also, is there any grace allowed over 20mph?
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No taking the course the day before makes no odds.
Thanks
How on earth would this show on NDORS as you’ve not only not taken a course for it but you haven’t even yet been identified as the driver!
I knew that, was just highlighting the obvious that I haven't acted on the letter yet.
You’ll get a conditional offer of a fixed penalty once you confirm you were driving, read the instructions on sending licence details carefully!
So basically, I should simply fill the form and send back like last time?
I suppose not worth challenging this, pay £100 and live with 3 points on my license for now?
You can't "challenge" it.
You either accept the FP (£100) or not. If not, you will be referred to court, where you can plead not guilty. Unless you have a good defence (which you haven't mentioned) you will be found guilty, at a cost nearer £1,000.
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No taking the course the day before makes no odds.
Thanks
How on earth would this show on NDORS as you’ve not only not taken a course for it but you haven’t even yet been identified as the driver!
I knew that, was just highlighting the obvious that I haven't acted on the letter yet.
You’ll get a conditional offer of a fixed penalty once you confirm you were driving, read the instructions on sending licence details carefully!
So basically, I should simply fill the form and send back like last time?
I suppose not worth challenging this, pay £100 and live with 3 points on my license for now?
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No taking the course the day before makes no odds.
How on earth would this show on NDORS as you’ve not only not taken a course for it but you haven’t even yet been identified as the driver!
You’ll get a conditional offer of a fixed penalty once you confirm you were driving, read the instructions on sending licence details carefully!
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Hello good samaritans,
I have recieved an NIP today, please see below:
Front:
(https://i.imgur.com/FRPhOOz.jpg)
Back:
(https://i.imgur.com/D6XAXt2.jpg)
Bit of background:
1. I drive a leased vehicle and my details must have been shared by keeper.
2. I got a previous speeding notice (caught by camera on 30th April, completed speed awarenss course on 8th July, 2024).
It's interesting that this fresh alleged on the same vehicle occured just 1 day BEFORE I completed the speed awareness course. I don't know if this is relevant but thought I should share. I had got a similar letter last time where I filled the form and subsequently logged into ndors.org
I can still access my account on ndors.org, it doens't YET show this new offense. I wasn't aware of this forum when I got the letter last time but thought to post here before doing anything at all this time. Please advise what's my best course of action here.