Free Traffic Legal Advice

You've posted Google Maps signs as I did. We are looking for current pics of signs.

As for the pedestrian zone, there is obviously an exemption for buses and during certain times for loading - but that means goods vehicles or maybe people moving bulky personal stuff. There is no exemption for driving into the zone for anything else (emergency vehicles though are probably exempted in the order). There are no disabled parking bays. We'd have to get the full traffic order though to be sure.

Do not drive into the zone. Use disabled bays nearby if you can.

Hopefully this link will show two photographs of the signs upon exiting the roundabout, plus the actual sign taken by the warden in Bath Plc. The photo of the sign on the right, it is actually facing to the right, so if coming off the roundabout to the left from the main seafront road, the sign cannot be seen, and the one on the left is probably on top of you before you even notice. I just believed it was an access only road, otherwise how do the businesses cope? There have been workmen and their lorries working there for months, deliveries regularly. There's everything from catering establishments, a gym, beauty, tanning, barbers, second hand shop, all sorts, how do they cope if nobody can use the road, it is the only way to enter Bath Plc? Not that I wish to take on everybody's issues, but I need to prepare for the future.

https://imgur.com/a/ttYapxX

Do not drive into the zone. Use disabled bays nearby if you can.

Good advice @stamfordman!

The OP needs to refresh their memory regarding the meaning of signs.

OP, in this case if the sign is as in GSV then this means:

Entry to the Pedestrian Zone restricted, in this case motor vehicles prohibited from passing the sign at all times except for loading Mon-Sat between the stated hours and buses at all times.

These signs can be configured in many different ways:

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/know-your-traffic-signs/pedestrian-zone-signs--2#:~:text=Depending%20on%20the%20extent%20of,entry%20signs%20and%20repeater%20plates.

This sign may have an additional plate which must be placed at the bottom and which creates waiting and loading restrictions and the council may dispense with yellow lines and blips within the zone.

But the council have forgotten the bottom plate and waiting and loading are NOT restricted unless yellow lines and blips are placed inside the zone.

You can guess what they'll say..there are repeater signs.

But what are they repeating? Nothing. The inclusion of a 'No Waiting' etc. plate on the PZ sign not only warns motorists of the restrictions within the zone, it also defines its limits i.e. the zone.

Even if 'Repeater signs' were considered adequate notice, what are the limits of the restriction if there aren't markings.

Contravention did not occur.
The CEO's photos show that at your location in Bath Place there aren't any waiting or loading markings. As the authority know, these may be dispensed with only if these restrictions, which should be uniform throughout the zone, are signed on the Pedestrian Zone entry signs.

As can be seen, there are no such supplementary plates on the PZ signs. Therefore, not only did your contravention not occur- because the restriction was not marked as required- but given that GSV from 1 year ago shows the same sign this means that all penalties demanded by the authority for waiting and or loading since at least then have not been valid - but perhaps leave this point until later, if necessary.

Are you the registered keeper with current DVLA details?

Thank you, yes I am the registered keeper and it does have disabled class on my V5 & I am the blue badge holder, which was in my window next to my note "delivering to no 5".

Apologies for being dense, but what is GSV please? I am trying to put what you have said above into an appeal, but I dont quite get it sorry, my brain is not functioning well at all? I wonder, because where the roundabout exits onto South St it looks like a normal road, despite the sign, it is not until you turn left into Montague St that it is "paved" as a pedestrian zone (possibly because many years ago, that part (South St) wasnt pedestrianised?), that the sign at the entrance to Montague St takes precedence over the South St entry sign? I took it from Google maps, but it is 6 years old, I could not get near enough to photograph without entering the no vehicle zone to take it in person? Should I go back and attempt that somehow, or perhaps I could ask somebody to take it for me?

Ive just realised it is Wed, I thought it was Tues, so I have to get my appeal in today? Sorry for the rush, but I do get mixed up easily. There are no disabled bays nearby and I have my support dog with me at all times, and right now she is suffering badly with arthritis and seizures, so I cannot be traipsing her around the roads, even if I were capable or not myself. I cannot leave her at home as she gets separation anxiety now, which could trigger a seizure, so I cannot leave her unattended. Interestingly the warden took a picture of her through the window too. Also, the ticket doesnt give any minutes, is that relevant, should they not observe you for 5 mins or something, or is that only for actual parking?
Sorry to ask more questions, but they dont all come to me at once?

Thank you in anticipation of your response [img width=22.99988555908203 height=22.99988555908203]https://emoji.tapatalk-cdn.com/emoji120.png[/img]

I would just send them this as an initial challenge.

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I am challenging the PCN on the grounds that the contravention did not occur. The pedestrian zone entry signs at both ends of South Street do not have waiting restriction signs, and in the absence of yellow lines, where I waited briefly in Bath Place, the waiting/loading contravention cannot have occurred. 

I see your CEO's pictures include a waiting timeplate that purports to establish a zone but it is a repeater sign that does not repeat an initial zone entry sign that must be there to establish a zone.

I trust you will cancel this PCN owing to faulty signage and look forward to early conformation.

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Wait for Mr Anderson to check this. They will no doubt reject this but this lays down a marker.
Below are some pics they took.

I would just send them this as an initial challenge.

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I am challenging the PCN on the grounds that the contravention did not occur. The pedestrian zone entry signs at both ends of South Street do not have waiting restriction signs, and in the absence of yellow lines, where I waited briefly in Bath Place, the waiting/loading contravention cannot have occurred. 

I see your CEO's pictures include a waiting timeplate that purports to establish a zone but it is a repeater sign that does not repeat an initial zone entry sign that must be there to establish a zone.

I trust you will cancel this PCN owing to faulty signage and look forward to early conformation.

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Wait for Mr Anderson to check this. They will no doubt reject this but this lays down a marker.
Below are some pics they took.

[img width=639.996826171875 height=1137.9942626953125]https://i.ibb.co/mh48MQD/w2.jpg[/img]
[img width=639.996826171875 height=1137.9942626953125]https://i.ibb.co/19x5WTp/w3.jpg[/img]
[img width=639.996826171875 height=1137.9942626953125]https://i.ibb.co/W66j4S6/w1.jpg[/img]

Thank you, I shall wait for Mr Anderson as you suggest, but thank you for spelling it out for me.

The suggested reps are fine.

OP, you really must dig out your copy of Traffic Signs from GOV.UK, or buy a copy.

A Pedestrian Zone MUST be signed at every vehicle entrance with the prescribed form of sign. I gave you this in an earlier post(Traffic Signs Manual, Chapter 3, s6. https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/782724/traffic-signs-manual-chapter-03.pdf.

It is this form of sign which MUST be present and configured as in 6.2 page 58. ONLY THIS carries the meaning: 'Entry to and waiting in ..PZ restricted'.

The council has a serious problem, you don't.