Author Topic: Penalty Charge Notice; CDER debt collection letter; Moved address. ?Possibly ballif stage.  (Read 877 times)

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I don't know the exact amounts for a judge review, but it's around £115 for a papers-based review, and circa £460 for an interview with the judge "in chambers". Without some hard information on when your V5 was updated, it is difficult to see any OOTs succeeding. You can get a "second opinion" here: -
www.baillifadviceonline.co.uk

At the moment, the amounts are at their minimum, with the amount owing the council, plus the bailiff £75 fee for each PCN. If bailiffs visit, you get another £235 added on to the amount for each PCN.

In a situation like this, it is best to pay the amount demanded to prevent it going up even more. Paying has no effect on whether an OOT will succeed or not, so I think you need to consider your next step very carefully. TEC are taking ages to process OOTs at the moment, and what you don't want is the bailiffs sneaking in and adding £235 x 3 to the amount demanded. I'm afraid that cases like yours that we frequently see on this forum, rarely turn out well, sorry to have to say it.

The enforcement agent (bailiff) can only load £235 once onto the charges owing, no matter how many Notices of Enforcement (one for each PCN) are being enforced.

The fee for a review by a district judge is £119 for a hearing on the papers only. And £303 for a hearing in person. One fee payable for each application for a review, one review per PCN. The fees are not refundable and cannot normally be claimed as costs even if your appeals to the Adjudicator are ultimately successful. The only exception is if your are entitled to an EX160 fee remission.

The advice to pay up now and then submit Out of Time Statutory Declarations at a later date is not without risks. This advice only came in during Covid and post Covid as there are long delays with the TEC informing the Enforcement Authorities that an Out of Time application has been submitted. This leaves you unprotected from the bailiff duing the delay.

Pre Covid the TEC would inform the EA electronically each day of any such applications received before 4pm on a working day. The EA was then compelled to call of bailiff enforcement immediately until the TEC had issued a decision. Leave it too long between payamnt and OOT and the Enforcement Authority will object on the grounds that you closed the case.
Thanks for correcting my amounts for a review. So now, hopefully, the OP can do some arithmetic to see the cheapest option !

Thanks all for the responses.

I will see if I can find out when we updated the V5C with the DVLA.

So, it seems I understand that it would be best to:
1. Submit an OOT to the council.

2. If success, great - pay initial PCN *3.

3. If no success before the 16/09/2024, pay the £279*3 fees.

4. Then, in this case either the OOT success may happen after 16/09/2024 and all fees are refunded.

OR/

It is unsuccessful and the council pass on to the TEC and there is another decision. If success at this point, again we pay the PCNs, all fees refunded.

But, if still no success, we decide whether we proceed to a judge review, in which case 119*3 is non recoverable, plus potentially the 279*3. Or 119*3 plus the price of the original PCNs.

The consensus seems to be the V5C date is important.

Questions
I) Is the above correct as you understand it?

2. If we find out the V5C was updated a long time after moving in (as I say, I think this is unlikely but I really can't be sure), do we still have a case for appeal or does this fall on us?

3. What if I can't find the info from the DVLA?

4. The council have asked for the appeal form to be sent to them - I'm not sure if it's PE2 or PE3? It's within 36 days of these CDER letters, but obviously a lot longer than that from the initial PCNs?

Statutory Declarations and Witness Statement whether in or out-of-time are submitted to the Traffic Enforcement Centre not the council. They are court documents. Details of those that are out-of-time are passed on by TEC to the council who can object to them. In time submissions are automatically accepted by TEC, (assuming the form has been filled in correctly !).

The V5C update date is very important, indeed your case hinges around it. We see so many cases where the OP didn't update the V5C for several months, ( or even years; yes, really !!), or reported address change to driving licence thinking it updated the V5C as well.
« Last Edit: September 03, 2024, 10:20:35 pm by Incandescent »

Yes, there are three addresses (I.e. the car was registered to a previous address before we moved in December 2022, and then we moved again in November 2023).

1. I don't know when we updated the log book address as I don't have a record of it unfortunately.
2. Yes there is a chance it was registered at the previous address (but I'd have thought unlikely as I would have expected us to have to update it in December 2022 to get the council parking permit in the first place).

Either way we didn't receive the letters at the time.


Quote
Either way we didn't receive the letters at the time.

See if this applies to you: https://www.nationalbailiffadvice.uk/moved-bailiffs-left-a-document-at-old-address.html



Do not lose sight of the deadline of 16 Sept. given in the NoEs.
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