Author Topic: PCN never received  (Read 462 times)

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Cathy

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PCN never received
« on: August 28, 2024, 09:45:00 pm »
Hello,
I received today a charge certificate from Croydon Council for the amount of £195 for failure to pay a 52J fine, which I never received, within 28 days. It was a shock to receive this charge as I never realised I should not have entered into that specific street.
Is there anything I can do ? I am of course willing to pay the original fine of £65.
Any advice would be most welcomed.
Many thanks.

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stamfordman

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Re: PCN never received
« Reply #1 on: August 28, 2024, 09:52:38 pm »
Post the charge certificate obscuring only name and address as per:

https://www.ftla.uk/civil-penalty-charge-notices-(councils-tfl-and-so-on)/read-this-first-before-posting-your-case!-this-section-is-for-council-tfl-dartme/

Are the name and address on the charge certificate correct?

Not getting the PCN means you can get this reset to at least £65 but let's look at it properly.

Cathy

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Re: PCN never received
« Reply #2 on: August 29, 2024, 08:55:43 am »
Thank you for your reply. The name and address on the charge certificate are correct.
Unfortunately,I have managed to download a photo of the charge certificate. I have copied it below.

PCN Number:
CR2076094A
Vehicle Registration Number: FG72GNK
Date of Contravention:
18/07/2024
Location of Contravention:
junction Clarendon Rd
Derby Rd
Date of Charge Certificate: 27/08/2024
6337 9301 9820 7609 4000 002
52J - Failing to comply with a prohibition on certain types of vehicles
DO NOT IGNORE THIS NOTICE
A Notice to Owner/PCN was sent to you on 24/07/2024 which stated that you had to pay the penalty charge or to make representations as to why you believed you did not have to pay it within 28 days beginning with the date on which the Notice was served on you.
This Charge Certificate has now been served as you have not paid the penalty charge within the appropriate period and one of the following applies:
No representations were made in response to the Notice to Owner/PCN
• We issued a Notice of Rection reRepresentation made against the Notice to Owner/PCN
and we have not been informed of an appeal having been made to the adjudicator We issued a Notice of Rejection of the Adjudicator's Recommendation
• An appeal was made to an adjudicator which was either unsuccessful or withdrawn
As a result, the penalty charge has now increased by a surcharge of 50%:
Penalty Charge:
Charge Certificate Surcharge:
Total Increased Penalty Charge:
Amount Already Paid:
Amount Now Due:
£130
£65
£195
£195
If we do not receive the amount now due before the end of the period of 14 days beginning with the date of service of this Charge Certificate, we may apply to the county court

I hope you can advise. Many thanks.

Incandescent

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Re: PCN never received
« Reply #3 on: August 29, 2024, 09:09:07 am »
The "county court" is them being disingenuous, because they must register the PCN debt at the Traffic Enforcement Centre. Once they do this, after the Charge Certificate payment period expires, you can submit a Statutory Declaration that you didn't receive the PCN. The process is then reverted back to the PCN at which point you can pay or submit representations.

There is no possibility of a CCJ, the legal process was carefully written to ensure this can never occur.

Cathy

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Re: PCN never received
« Reply #4 on: August 29, 2024, 09:28:14 am »
Thank you. So,if I understand well, I don’t do anything or pay like the £65.00 now. I just wait for the traffic enforcement centre to contact me and send me a Statutory Declaration form that I didn’t receive the PCN.
Would calling Croydon council to explain the situation be a waste of time I suppose ?



stamfordman

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Re: PCN never received
« Reply #5 on: August 29, 2024, 10:30:19 am »
You can contact Croydon as they say you can and I think they will resend the PCN but we don't usually recommend this as it is stepping out of process and things can go wrong.

This Penalty Charge Notice is now outside the timeframe to make representation to the Council. Please follow the instructions on the Charge Certificate. The addressee may still contact the Council.

The next stage is the order for recovery sent by the Traffic Enforcement Centre to which you make a statutory declaration that you don't get the PCN.

The contravention looks made out to me.




Incandescent

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Re: PCN never received
« Reply #6 on: August 29, 2024, 10:50:03 am »
The Order for Recovery is sent by the enforcing authority, not TEC.

Advice if a postal PCN was never received thus indicating a possible mail problem, is, when the CC payment period has expired, to check regularly for the debt registration, and not just wait for the OfR to arrive in the mail. Reason for this is, if it turns up very late, you've lost the opportunity to submit an in-time declaration. So check every week to see if the CC amount has gone up by £10. This is the TEC registration fee, so tells you they have registered the debt. You can download the form from TEC then, fill it in, and submit it.

Hippocrates

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Re: PCN never received
« Reply #7 on: August 29, 2024, 12:09:31 pm »
https://insidecroydon.com/2024/01/22/kerrr-ching-unsuspecting-drivers-hit-with-no-notice-190-fines/

This case reminds me of this story.

Wait for the OFR and we will advise further. Do not pay it as, when it is reset, this case will be winnable at the Tribunal because of their poor website grounds.

IF YOU HAVE RECEIVED A CHARGE CERTIFICATE DO NOT WRITE TO THE COUNCIL! SEEK ADVICE FROM US  FIRST. IF YOU WRITE TO THE COUNCIL IN RESPONSE TO A CHARGE CERTIFICATE YOU ARE PROBABLY GOING TO SHOOT YOURSELF IN THE FOOT.

This is our administrator's advice so please follow it.  Either he, I or MrMustard will offer to represent you when the time comes.
« Last Edit: August 29, 2024, 12:15:08 pm by Hippocrates »
How do we get more people to fight their PCNs?

https://www.ftla.uk/the-flame-pit/how-do-we-get-more-people-to-fight-their-pcns/msg41917/#msg41917

If you do not even make a challenge, you will surely join "The Mugged Club".

URGENT!

PLEASE SIGN MY PETITION TO EQUATE MOVING TRAFFIC LAW WITH BUS LANE LAW SO LONDON COUNCILS MUST ATTEND HEARINGS WHEN REQUIRED BY THE APPELLANT. 

https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/701491

https://www.ftla.uk/the-flame-pit/petition-to-align-the-llaa-2003-to-the-llaa-1996-(right-to-x-council-witnesses)/msg56899/#msg56899

Enceladus

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H C Andersen

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Re: PCN never received
« Reply #9 on: August 29, 2024, 01:55:14 pm »
OP, your situation is one we see regularly here. Nothing unique or even rare.

The process is simple, albeit festooned with acronyms, PCN, CC,TEC,OfR for example.

This is the enforcement process:
https://www.londontribunals.gov.uk/eat/understanding-enforcement-process/moving-traffic-pcn-enforcement-process

Now you can get a feel for what's happened, is happening and should happen!

Cathy

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Re: PCN never received
« Reply #10 on: August 29, 2024, 09:39:39 pm »
Thank you very much everyone for your very helpful replies. I will follow the advice given and will no doubt be back on this board if things get complicated.