Author Topic: TfL, Parking Contravention 21: Parked wholly or partly in a suspended bay or space, NORTH KERB CAZENOVE ROAD N16  (Read 332 times)

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Hi,

PCN:
https://drive.google.com/drive/u/0/folders/1Mh6eKKiNt_vfPteAUGp4l4nUG4L2R_3Z

Google Street View:
https://maps.app.goo.gl/iFa9AMS43m9kT5SJ6

Pictures:
https://drive.google.com/drive/u/0/folders/1QkEFiKjBZ2KkxkMSOO-DoQNQsQRoAmvp

PCN Number: GX32935487
VRN: EN59FCC

Pictures on TfL site, PCN Number & VRN in the link below:
https://tfl.gov.uk/modes/driving/view-a-pcn

NOTES:
- No details regarding parking suspension in PCN, either suspension ID or prohibited dates & hours
- ⁠No information to be found on TFL or Hackney council’s website regarding parking suspension
- ⁠PCN issued by CCTV which doesn’t show any details regarding parking suspension⁠, and grounds for appeal due to issuing PCN from CCTV
- ⁠under FOI request video footage and suspension details
- ⁠When was the sign put up there? Check how many days they have to put up the sign legally before suspension begins
- ⁠Similar fine issued to my son by TFL via CCTV in 2018 with PCN GT70807245, where he appealed and his appeal was rejected. He then took the case to London Tribunals and the PCN was cancelled 2 days before the court hearing, due to an ‘administrative error’ with case reference 218008308A. I am in a similar situation here where I believe an incorrect PCN was issued via CCTV without the absence of a traffic parking warden


Please advice and I appreciate any help.
Thank you
« Last Edit: February 06, 2026, 12:38:54 am by cp8759 »

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It seemed you parked right by a suspension sign - what did it say?

Is it still there?

It seemed you parked right by a suspension sign - what did it say?

Is it still there?
+1
The suspension sign can be seen in the second of your posted pictures. It is about 3 feet from the rear of your car and is on the pole that the sign for the parking bay is also mounted on. So, to be frank, your case does not seem strong at all. Any reason for ignoring the sign ?

It seemed you parked right by a suspension sign - what did it say?

Is it still there?

It is not there, we checked on the day we received the PCN

It seemed you parked right by a suspension sign - what did it say?

Is it still there?
+1
The suspension sign can be seen in the second of your posted pictures. It is about 3 feet from the rear of your car and is on the pole that the sign for the parking bay is also mounted on. So, to be frank, your case does not seem strong at all. Any reason for ignoring the sign ?

It didn't catch my eye, as it was towards the rear. The sign is not there, we checked on the day we received the Notice. I'm not sure if they put the suspension sign. Normally would they not put TMO details?

« Last Edit: February 06, 2026, 12:39:08 am by cp8759 »

TFL can't issue code 21 PCNs because there are no parking places on a red route, so there's nothing to suspend.
I practice law in the Traffic Penalty Tribunal, London Tribunals, the First-tier tribunal for Scotland, and the Traffic Penalty Tribunal for Northern Ireland, but I am not a solicitor or a barrister. Notwithstanding this, I voluntarily apply the cab rank rule. I am a member of the Society of Professional McKenzie Friends, my membership number is FM193 and I abide by the SPMF service standards.

Quote from: 'Gumph' date='Thu, 19 Jan 2023 - 10:23'
cp8759 is, indeed, a Wizard of the First Order

TFL can't issue code 21 PCNs because there are no parking places on a red route, so there's nothing to suspend.

this wasn't a red route though, it was a bay

A bay on a red route is part of a red route, see Transport for London, R (on the application of) v London Tribunals (Environment and Traffic Adjudicators) [2023] EWHC 2889 (Admin). If it wasn't part of a red route, they wouldn't be able to use CCTV cameras to issue PCNs.
I practice law in the Traffic Penalty Tribunal, London Tribunals, the First-tier tribunal for Scotland, and the Traffic Penalty Tribunal for Northern Ireland, but I am not a solicitor or a barrister. Notwithstanding this, I voluntarily apply the cab rank rule. I am a member of the Society of Professional McKenzie Friends, my membership number is FM193 and I abide by the SPMF service standards.

Quote from: 'Gumph' date='Thu, 19 Jan 2023 - 10:23'
cp8759 is, indeed, a Wizard of the First Order

A bay on a red route is part of a red route, see Transport for London, R (on the application of) v London Tribunals (Environment and Traffic Adjudicators) [2023] EWHC 2889 (Admin). If it wasn't part of a red route, they wouldn't be able to use CCTV cameras to issue PCNs.

could you please clarify "TFL can't issue code 21 PCNs because there are no parking places on a red route, so there's nothing to suspend." On the document you sent does it not say that there is? Also I saw another thread that CCTV can't be used to issue postal PCNs, but wasn't it overturned by the High Court: The panel's narrow interpretation of "red route" was wrong.
Parking bays on red routes do qualify as part of a red route for CCTV/postal enforcement purposes under Regulation 11(2).
TfL can lawfully use CCTV to issue postal PCNs for parking contraventions in those bays (including restrictions like suspensions).

According to TfL's own map
https://tfl.maps.arcgis.com/apps/webappviewer/index.html?id=99bc8bbbe8c94af291f5a5bfc77a00dd

Cazenove Road is not part of the red route network.

According to Hackney's map
https://hackney.gov.uk/parking-zones

it falls under the L.B.Hackney.

Hackney's traffic order may stops where the red route bay is - almost all side roads off TFL red routes have short extensions to the red route enforcement.

Water this is legal - I think in some cases jurisdiction has been found wanting.

As for the contravention, TFL does issue contraventions such as footway parking - I'm out of the loop with where we are on what it can and can't do.


According to TfL's own map
https://tfl.maps.arcgis.com/apps/webappviewer/index.html?id=99bc8bbbe8c94af291f5a5bfc77a00dd

Cazenove Road is not part of the red route network.

According to Hackney's map
https://hackney.gov.uk/parking-zones

it falls under the L.B.Hackney.

Although Cazenove Road itself isn't in the red route, could TfL not have jurisdiction over the side road orders extension?

https://foi.tfl.gov.uk/FOI-1799-2425/GLA_2016_0234%20-%20Order_Redacted.pdf

11) The car was parked between 2 Stamford Hill and 3 Cazenove Road so it's within jurdisdiction according to this

However, I couldn't find a valid TTRO:
https://haveyoursay.tfl.gov.uk/tro/widgets/89917/documents

TfL can lawfully use CCTV to issue postal PCNs for parking contraventions in those bays (including restrictions like suspensions).
For a parking place to be suspended, there has to be a parking place. There are no parking places on red routes, the whole road is subject to a no stopping restriction and where there is a bay there is an exception to the no stopping rule, that doesn't make it a designated parking place. This is why, for instance, the 10-minute grace period that applies to parking places does not apply to red route, because there are no parking places at all. You will never find a TMO for a red route that says that such an such a place is thereby designated as a parking place.
I practice law in the Traffic Penalty Tribunal, London Tribunals, the First-tier tribunal for Scotland, and the Traffic Penalty Tribunal for Northern Ireland, but I am not a solicitor or a barrister. Notwithstanding this, I voluntarily apply the cab rank rule. I am a member of the Society of Professional McKenzie Friends, my membership number is FM193 and I abide by the SPMF service standards.

Quote from: 'Gumph' date='Thu, 19 Jan 2023 - 10:23'
cp8759 is, indeed, a Wizard of the First Order

TfL can lawfully use CCTV to issue postal PCNs for parking contraventions in those bays (including restrictions like suspensions).
For a parking place to be suspended, there has to be a parking place. There are no parking places on red routes, the whole road is subject to a no stopping restriction and where there is a bay there is an exception to the no stopping rule, that doesn't make it a designated parking place. This is why, for instance, the 10-minute grace period that applies to parking places does not apply to red route, because there are no parking places at all. You will never find a TMO for a red route that says that such an such a place is thereby designated as a parking place.

Doesn't the link you sent earlier state that it is parking bay in para 7, 8, & 21?

https://www.bailii.org/ew/cases/EWHC/Admin/2023/2889.pdf