Author Topic: TfL Bus Lane PCN, Lewisham High Street, Notice of Rejection not received, straight to Adjudicator???  (Read 832 times)

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So, in addition to dealing with my other PCN from Lewisham (These things always seem to come in twos!) I have been dealing with a TfL PCN since January 2024 which now has me confused as to what to do next.

I received the PCN for the contravention dated 15 January for 'being in a bus lane' A21 Lewisham HST NE-BND Ladywell Rd Writburn Rd at 15:58

They have Whitburn Road spelled incorrectly but I don't know if this matters.

I responded with my informal representation (31/01/2024) that I was trying to access a loading bay within the bus lane but abandoned my decision when I realised I only had 2 minutes left to park. The bay time finished at 4pm.  I had received a similar PCN in the past trying to access a loading bay within a bus lane which TfL promptly cancelled upon my informal representation, so I didn't think this one would drag out for almost a year.

They sent a rejection letter dated 16/02/2024.

I then rceieved the Enforcement Notice dated 15/04/2024.

I made my formal representation (07/05/2024) stating that the bay sign superseeded the bus lane sign whilst the bay was in operation and didn't contravene the bus lane order.

I was expecting a Notice of Acceptance or a Notice of Rejection but received neither.

I received a Charge Certificate dated 16/07/2024

I waited for the Order for Recovery and got it signed and posted (27/08/2024) at Bromley County Court (The second time this year!) stating I hadn't received the Notice of Rejection.

I was now for the second time awaiting the Notice of Rejection. Instead I received (07/11/2024) a huge evidence pack from TfL stating they have submitted the case to an adjudicator at the London Tribunals.

Surely they should have reverted the case back to the Notice of Rejection which should have contained a Notice of Appeal, giving me the opportunity to either pay or appeal?

It now says they are unable to deal with any queries about the case until a decision is made and that I should contact the London Tribunals for any information.

I want to seek help before contacting the London Tribunals to avoid any further problems.

PCN




Informal rejection



Enforcement Notice


Charge Certificate


Order for Recovery


Evidence Pack letter


Location
https://maps.app.goo.gl/PRPoQryXGVJEvLq78

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Quote
Instead I received (07/11/2024) a huge evidence pack from TfL stating they have submitted the case to an adjudicator at the London Tribunals.

In this huge Evidence Pack is there some sort of letter/summary where they explain what they want the Tribunal to do and why they believe the Adjudicator should do it? Wish to proceed with its enforcement is hardly adequate to describe this precisely.

https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukla/1996/9/schedule/1/enacted

Para. 10(7) of Schedule 1 applies i.e. for your SD grounds the authority is obliged to refer the matter to the adjudicator. This is not an appeal as such, the adjudicator will determine whether the matter is to be registered as an appeal and you should be notified accordingly.


I would phone the Tribunal with the PCN details. Ask for a personal hearing and I am happy to represent you.
IF YOU RECEIVE A MOVING TRAFFIC PCN PLEASE READ THIS BEFORE MAKING A REPRESENTATION:

https://www.ftla.uk/the-flame-pit/moving-traffic-pcns-missing-mandatory-information-the-london-local-authorities-a/msg102639/#msg102639


How do we get more people to fight their PCNs?

https://www.ftla.uk/the-flame-pit/how-do-we-get-more-people-to-fight-their-pcns/msg41917/#msg41917

If you do not even make a challenge, you will surely join "The Mugged Club".

I am not omniscient. cp8759 and mrmustard are true geniuses. I know my place in the hierarchy of The Three Musketeers. 😊 "The Clinician", "The Gentleman" and "The Showman"

My e mail address for councils:

J.BOND007@H.M.S.S.c/oVAUXHALLBRIDGE/LICENSEDTOEXPOSE.SCAMS.CO.UK

Last mission accomplished:

https://www.ftla.uk/the-flame-pit/southwark-to-r

Quote
In this huge Evidence Pack is there some sort of letter/summary where they explain what they want the Tribunal to do and why they believe the Adjudicator should do it? Wish to proceed with its enforcement is hardly adequate to describe this precisely.

They have included a witness statement where they say:

"We would oppose this application and request that the Adjudicator refuse the application. We would rely upon the following grounds:

a) All notices have been sent by first class post...
b) They sent a NoR on 20/05/2024...
c) Royal Mail has not indicated any problems with mail delivery..."

Basically, it seems they don't believe I didn't receive the NoR




I would phone the Tribunal with the PCN details. Ask for a personal hearing and I am happy to represent you.

That is hugely kind of you. I will phone them tomorrow and will be in touch.

They also sent the CCTV evidence on a DVD, which I'm not sure where to upload or can I email/send it to you personally?

I will phone them [Tribunal] tomorrow and will be in touch?

And ask, has the Adjudicator issued any directions in this case. If not, when might you expect to hear from the Tribunal formally in this matter?

Where is TEC's Revoking Order, you've not posted it.


As I posted, the duty on TfL is to refer the matter to the adjudicator whom the regs empower to issue directions, in practical terms without limit.
IMO, TfL's comments are improper and in the context of your submission to TEC irrelevant. The only notice at issue is the NOR. It is common ground between you and them that you received the PCN and EN, therefore banging on about all notices being posted is irrelevant. (whether these comments might have been stimulated by any back story between you and TfL we don't know).

I will phone them [Tribunal] tomorrow and will be in touch?

And ask, has the Adjudicator issued any directions in this case. If not, when might you expect to hear from the Tribunal formally in this matter?

Where is TEC's Revoking Order, you've not posted it.


As I posted, the duty on TfL is to refer the matter to the adjudicator whom the regs empower to issue directions, in practical terms without limit.
IMO, TfL's comments are improper and in the context of your submission to TEC irrelevant. The only notice at issue is the NOR. It is common ground between you and them that you received the PCN and EN, therefore banging on about all notices being posted is irrelevant. (whether these comments might have been stimulated by any back story between you and TfL we don't know).

Yes, I will phone the London Tribunal tomorrow and ask what you've instructed above.

I've attached the Revoking Order (I think this is the right document)

No, there is no back story regarding the missing NoR. There has been no communication between them and I regarding missing documents.  I simply filed the Statutory Declaration upon receiving the Order for Recovery. I just ticked the box that the NoR was not received.




They have included the Notice of Rejection in their evidence pack




Quote
I would phone the Tribunal with the PCN details. Ask for a personal hearing and I am happy to represent you. - Hippocrates

I would take up @Hippocrates on his kind offer - you will be in good hands.

Thanks John. It is a no brainer now as it has been forwarded to the adjudicator for further directions. I will PM later @CityChic with some suggestions.

We have another one pending.

https://www.ftla.uk/civil-penalty-charge-notices-(councils-tfl-and-so-on)/tfl-being-in-a-bus-lane-clapham-rd-ne-bnd-from-south-lambeth-rd/msg43616/#msg43616
« Last Edit: November 10, 2024, 07:32:02 pm by Hippocrates »
IF YOU RECEIVE A MOVING TRAFFIC PCN PLEASE READ THIS BEFORE MAKING A REPRESENTATION:

https://www.ftla.uk/the-flame-pit/moving-traffic-pcns-missing-mandatory-information-the-london-local-authorities-a/msg102639/#msg102639


How do we get more people to fight their PCNs?

https://www.ftla.uk/the-flame-pit/how-do-we-get-more-people-to-fight-their-pcns/msg41917/#msg41917

If you do not even make a challenge, you will surely join "The Mugged Club".

I am not omniscient. cp8759 and mrmustard are true geniuses. I know my place in the hierarchy of The Three Musketeers. 😊 "The Clinician", "The Gentleman" and "The Showman"

My e mail address for councils:

J.BOND007@H.M.S.S.c/oVAUXHALLBRIDGE/LICENSEDTOEXPOSE.SCAMS.CO.UK

Last mission accomplished:

https://www.ftla.uk/the-flame-pit/southwark-to-r

Quote
I would phone the Tribunal with the PCN details. Ask for a personal hearing and I am happy to represent you. - Hippocrates

I would take up @Hippocrates on his kind offer - you will be in good hands.

I appreciate the help immensely!  I had a profile on the old forum so I'm familiar with the hard work and tenacity you all provide day in day out, year in year out. It's truly admirable.


So, The London Tribunals said they have sent a letter in the post on 7th November asking me to submit my original representations. It will also have instructions on how to book a personal hearing.

I will contact Hippocrates as soon as I receive it. Thank you.

IF YOU RECEIVE A MOVING TRAFFIC PCN PLEASE READ THIS BEFORE MAKING A REPRESENTATION:

https://www.ftla.uk/the-flame-pit/moving-traffic-pcns-missing-mandatory-information-the-london-local-authorities-a/msg102639/#msg102639


How do we get more people to fight their PCNs?

https://www.ftla.uk/the-flame-pit/how-do-we-get-more-people-to-fight-their-pcns/msg41917/#msg41917

If you do not even make a challenge, you will surely join "The Mugged Club".

I am not omniscient. cp8759 and mrmustard are true geniuses. I know my place in the hierarchy of The Three Musketeers. 😊 "The Clinician", "The Gentleman" and "The Showman"

My e mail address for councils:

J.BOND007@H.M.S.S.c/oVAUXHALLBRIDGE/LICENSEDTOEXPOSE.SCAMS.CO.UK

Last mission accomplished:

https://www.ftla.uk/the-flame-pit/southwark-to-r

IF YOU RECEIVE A MOVING TRAFFIC PCN PLEASE READ THIS BEFORE MAKING A REPRESENTATION:

https://www.ftla.uk/the-flame-pit/moving-traffic-pcns-missing-mandatory-information-the-london-local-authorities-a/msg102639/#msg102639


How do we get more people to fight their PCNs?

https://www.ftla.uk/the-flame-pit/how-do-we-get-more-people-to-fight-their-pcns/msg41917/#msg41917

If you do not even make a challenge, you will surely join "The Mugged Club".

I am not omniscient. cp8759 and mrmustard are true geniuses. I know my place in the hierarchy of The Three Musketeers. 😊 "The Clinician", "The Gentleman" and "The Showman"

My e mail address for councils:

J.BOND007@H.M.S.S.c/oVAUXHALLBRIDGE/LICENSEDTOEXPOSE.SCAMS.CO.UK

Last mission accomplished:

https://www.ftla.uk/the-flame-pit/southwark-to-r