3. Stopped in a restricted area outside a school - Given ticket after school closed for summer
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Re: Stopped in a restricted area outside a school - Given ticket after school closed for summer
« Reply #15 on: »
Amazing research! Thank you all. When you say OP, are you referring to me? Additionally, the car is a hire vehicle. Let me know if that changes anything?
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Re: Stopped in a restricted area outside a school - Given ticket after school closed for summer
« Reply #16 on: »
If they reject the informal challenge and you want to continue the NTO will go the hire company.

What is their policy for handling PCNs? They also often charge fees.
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Re: Stopped in a restricted area outside a school - Given ticket after school closed for summer
« Reply #17 on: »
Quote from: challenge_cheaters on July 30, 2025, 03:06:49 pm
Amazing research! Thank you all. When you say OP, are you referring to me? Additionally, the car is a hire vehicle. Let me know if that changes anything?
OP = Original Poster
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Re: Stopped in a restricted area outside a school - Given ticket after school closed for summer
« Reply #18 on: »
Is it 'hired' or is it 'leased'?

Unfortunately, the issue is fundamental, not incidental, because, as already stated, should your informal reps be rejected and the matter progress to a NTO this would be sent to the hire/lease company and then you're in their hands.

So, let's get the best informal reps as we can compiled.
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Re: Stopped in a restricted area outside a school - Given ticket after school closed for summer
« Reply #19 on: »
Quote from: H C Andersen on July 30, 2025, 07:24:14 pm
Is it 'hired' or is it 'leased'?

Unfortunately, the issue is fundamental, not incidental, because, as already stated, should your informal reps be rejected and the matter progress to a NTO this would be sent to the hire/lease company and then you're in their hands.

So, let's get the best informal reps as we can compiled.
Actually, it's a lease.
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Re: Stopped in a restricted area outside a school - Given ticket after school closed for summer
« Reply #20 on: »
This is likely to simplify matters UNLESS the lease company pays the penalty and recharges you.

As mentioned previously, if you can you need to get them to transfer liability so that you could deal with this in your own name.

If you write to them, use the term 'transfer liability', do NOT specify or suggest how.

The rationale is that they would likely use the 'we are a hire company blah blah..' grounds, but these are not lawful grounds and this would be the basis of any reps and subsequent appeal by you. A lease is NOT a 'hiring agreement'.
« Last Edit: July 30, 2025, 10:37:44 pm by H C Andersen »
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Re: Stopped in a restricted area outside a school - Given ticket after school closed for summer
« Reply #21 on: »
Sadly, Harrow rejected the appeal I wrote:

Here's their response:

The 14-day discount period will end Friday 26 September.
Please can you help.
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Re: Stopped in a restricted area outside a school - Given ticket after school closed for summer
« Reply #22 on: »
You didn't post a draft - you should have copied the school's term info and then said as the term had ended enforcement could not apply according to their order.

All you have is a template rejection.

You can write to them now spelling this out to try and head off the NTO or paying.

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Re: Stopped in a restricted area outside a school - Given ticket after school closed for summer
« Reply #23 on: »
What have you done regarding the lease company? Do you even know what their practice is on receipt of a NTO?

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Re: Stopped in a restricted area outside a school - Given ticket after school closed for summer
« Reply #24 on: »
Quote from: stamfordman on September 22, 2025, 10:13:20 am
You didn't post a draft - you should have copied the school's term info and then said as the term had ended enforcement could not apply according to their order.

All you have is a template rejection.

You can write to them now spelling this out to try and head off the NTO or paying.

Sorry, I should of explained. I posted the school terms info with proof that it closed early that day.
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Re: Stopped in a restricted area outside a school - Given ticket after school closed for summer
« Reply #25 on: »
Quote from: H C Andersen on September 22, 2025, 10:25:49 am
What have you done regarding the lease company? Do you even know what their practice is on receipt of a NTO?

The ticket was left on the car - so there was no opportunity for them to contact the Lease company. I just appealed directly on the website.
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Re: Stopped in a restricted area outside a school - Given ticket after school closed for summer
« Reply #26 on: »
Yes I saw your challenge but you posted a link, which is not a good idea.

The next stage is a notice to owner, which is posted to the registered keeper, which is why you need to find out what the keeper will do when it gets it.
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Re: Stopped in a restricted area outside a school - Given ticket after school closed for summer
« Reply #27 on: »
Hi All, thanks for your help thus far. Finally received the NTO. I believe the 28-day deadline would end 15 Jan 2026.  Please can you help. Here is my proposed challenge (which I used for the appeal previously - originally using links and not attachments, but now including attachments):

To Whom It May Concern
The driver believed the no stopping sign with specified times applied only
during term time. Their sons finished school early that day, see attached proof.  Based on the fact the term had ended, enforcement could not apply according to the order.
 
Although term time isn’t stated on the sign, it’s illogical to enforce such specific
Times year-round when school isn’t in session. Research revealed the Harrow
(Prohibition of Stopping Outside Schools) (Amendment No. 1) Traffic Order 1998,
which confirms the restriction applies during term time only (see attached).

The sign contradicts the order by implying year-round enforcement. Therefore,
The PCN should be cancelled.

If not, please provide the Traffic Management Order that supersedes the 1998 one
and explicitly authorises all-year restrictions, rather than relying on misleading
signage..














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Re: Stopped in a restricted area outside a school - Given ticket after school closed for summer
« Reply #28 on: »
Is the NTO in your name?

I would be more direct.

The contravention did not occur as the restriction only applies during time time, and term had finished earlier that day as the school confirms.

The evidence for this is...
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Re: Stopped in a restricted area outside a school - Given ticket after school closed for summer
« Reply #29 on: »
Quote from: stamfordman on January 04, 2026, 04:03:00 pm
Is the NTO in your name?

I would be more direct.

The contravention did not occur as the restriction only applies during time time, and term had finished earlier that day as the school confirms.

The evidence for this is...

Yes, in my name. Thanks for the advice. I'll give that a go.
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