3. Richmond PCN
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Richmond PCN
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Hi re-posting from PepiPoo

Hi,
1. I received a parking ticket for alleged parking contravention: 19U. This took place on 6th August 2023 at 12:20 and was issued my London Borough of Richmond upon Thames. Vehicle observed between 12:19 and 12:20.

2. I was standing next to my car after it's parking had expired waiting for my family to join me. The enforcement officer hadn't noticed me when he entered the ticket into his machine. I challenged him and he said he would cancel the ticket. He didn't place the ticket on the car and also therefore couldn't take a photo of the car with a ticket on it, also he didn't hand the ticket to me, he kept the ticket and said he would cancel. I wanted to understand my rights here. Clearly the car was parked in the bay but had he noticed me he would't have give me a ticket. Without a photo what proof does the council have that I was actually there? Am I able to challenge on the basis that I don't recognize the ticket or had moved on from my space or was in control of the car? I'm just wondering what my options might be?

My parking ticket expired at 12:01 so I'm not within 10 minutes of end of the parking session but hence why I was standing next to the car waiting for my family to arrive. I was only observed for committing an offense for a matter of seconds before the ticket was issued and give no chance to move the vehicle.

Location: https://goo.gl/maps/W76SeKBoQmpvdxwD8

Many thanks for any advice.



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Re: Richmond PCN
« Reply #1 on: »
We need to see some documents All of what you received and also all of the council photos If the CEO could have served a PCN by attaching to vehicle or by handing to you they must and a postal PCN would not be valid in that case
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Re: Richmond PCN
« Reply #2 on: »
The original attached PDF letter has the only photo they supplied to me which is one of the lamppost. This is the only document I have so far
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Re: Richmond PCN
« Reply #3 on: »
Please check Richmond's site for any more photos.
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Re: Richmond PCN
« Reply #4 on: »
I have checked their site and there is only one photo as displayed on the pdf.
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Re: Richmond PCN
« Reply #5 on: »
If you have no documents how do you know you have a PCN
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Re: Richmond PCN
« Reply #6 on: »
@ PMB - It's the NtO in the opening post.
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Re: Richmond PCN
« Reply #7 on: »
NTO:











Parking payment:

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I practice law in the Traffic Penalty Tribunal, London Tribunals, the First-tier tribunal for Scotland, and the Traffic Penalty Tribunal for Northern Ireland, but I am not a solicitor or a barrister. Notwithstanding this, I voluntarily apply the cab rank rule. I am a member of the Society of Professional McKenzie Friends, my membership number is FM193 and I abide by the SPMF service standards.

Quote from: 'Gumph' date='Thu, 19 Jan 2023 - 10:23'
cp8759 is, indeed, a Wizard of the First Order
Re: Richmond PCN
« Reply #8 on: »
There's only one photo on the council website:



I know a trick to get the CEO's notes and here they are:



This all seems rather dodgy: the CEO took no photos of the car, and usually when a PCN is handed to the driver they will take a photo showing the PCN in the driver's hand. I suspect the CEO just made up the notes and lied to you in order to avoid confrontation (to be fair I'm sure they get plenty of abuse from people who think that colourful language is remotely helpful).

I would therefore just stick to what happened:

Dear London Borough of Richmond upon Thames,

I challenge liability for PCN RT40731652 on the basis of a procedural impropriety.  At the time when the PCN was issued, I was standing next to my car after it's parking had expired as I was waiting for my family to join me. The enforcement officer hadn't noticed me when he entered the ticket into his machine and I challenged him when I realised what he was doing.

The enforcement officer then said that he would cancel the ticket. He did not place the PCN on the car and he didn't hand it to me either, he kept hold of the PCN and said he would cancel it. I note there are no photos anywhere showing either my car or the PCN, the only photo shows a sign.

A notice to owner can only be served if service of a regulation 9 PCN has taken place, in the absence of a PCN being served the council has no authority to issue a notice to owner, therefore service of the notice to owner is a procedural impropriety.

Furthermore, the facts stated at (link) are untrue and did not happen. If the CEO has body worn video, I request that a copy be provided as I am confident they will confirm a PCN was not served.

Yours faithfully,


You probably won't have space to paste all that into the council website, so put it in a PDF and upload it as an attachment.

I will send you a PM with a link to the CEO's notes, that link has click counting enabled so I can track how many times it is clicked. If they don't bother to look, the click count will be zero and we'll then have another procedural impropriety as they will have failed to consider the representations and the supporting evidence, and we will then have another procedural impropriety to use at the tribunal.

Because of this, do not click on the link I will send you, it is imperative that the click count remain at zero.
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I practice law in the Traffic Penalty Tribunal, London Tribunals, the First-tier tribunal for Scotland, and the Traffic Penalty Tribunal for Northern Ireland, but I am not a solicitor or a barrister. Notwithstanding this, I voluntarily apply the cab rank rule. I am a member of the Society of Professional McKenzie Friends, my membership number is FM193 and I abide by the SPMF service standards.

Quote from: 'Gumph' date='Thu, 19 Jan 2023 - 10:23'
cp8759 is, indeed, a Wizard of the First Order
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