3. Westminster Council - parked in restricted street during prescribed hours
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iispartan

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Westminster Council - parked in restricted street during prescribed hours
« on: December 06, 2024, 08:36:12 am »
Hi all, my brother received a PCN at 1.48am on Brewer Street and my guess is he assumed that after these hours he could park here. I’ll get the details as to why etc later but looking at the council images I can’t see any signage to say he could park.

I do see DYL in the images however.

I would appreciate if I can get an initial view of whether there is scope to challenge this based on any fatal errors on the PCN or based on no signage being taken of the restrictions - appreciate any help.

Pictures of PCN and evidence here - https://imgur.com/a/iuEJcTF
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John U.K.

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Re: Westminster Council - parked in restricted street during prescribed hours
« Reply #1 on: December 06, 2024, 10:00:31 am »
I suspect you need to get your brother a copy of the Highway Code and point him at the section of Double Yellow Lines...... :(

DYLs operate 24/7 and need no signage.

That said, please post a GSV link to the location.
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Incandescent

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Re: Westminster Council - parked in restricted street during prescribed hours
« Reply #2 on: December 06, 2024, 11:51:12 am »
Why did your brother park there ? There are two exemptions from yellow lines, loading and also boarding/alighting passengers.
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iispartan

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Re: Westminster Council - parked in restricted street during prescribed hours
« Reply #3 on: December 06, 2024, 12:39:23 pm »
All fair questions probably assumed after hours was okay to stop there. Probably accepting that this is bang to rights but still worth a shot ..

Nevertheless, GSV link here: https://maps.app.goo.gl/kzvVFYwk97LgFDcU7?g_st=ic
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Incandescent

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Re: Westminster Council - parked in restricted street during prescribed hours
« Reply #4 on: December 06, 2024, 06:01:26 pm »
Quote from: iispartan on December 06, 2024, 12:39:23 pm
All fair questions probably assumed after hours was okay to stop there. Probably accepting that this is bang to rights but still worth a shot ..

Nevertheless, GSV link here: https://maps.app.goo.gl/kzvVFYwk97LgFDcU7?g_st=ic
If neither of the exempt activities was being undertaken, then the contravention is made out. HOwever, there may be a 'technical' appeal based on poor council management of the enforcement process, so wait a bit for others to comment before making a decision to pay or submit representations.
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H C Andersen

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Re: Westminster Council - parked in restricted street during prescribed hours
« Reply #5 on: December 06, 2024, 06:20:29 pm »
OP, luckily for you Westminster will re-offer the discount even if unsuccessful reps are made provided these are made no later than 19th, so nothing's to be lost by making simple 'I'm sorry, honestly didn't think my short stop at this hour would warrant a penalty....' reps, or whatever other form he wants to make.
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iispartan

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Re: Westminster Council - parked in restricted street during prescribed hours
« Reply #6 on: January 01, 2025, 01:30:19 pm »
Happy New Year all - I’ve just received response from council. I basically made a quick appeal on the lines of “apologies…I didn’t realise my short stay would warrant such penalty etc..”

Let me know if any grounds for appeal, otherwise I think I’ll just take the discount..

https://imgur.com/a/oFCTudP

Thanks
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cp8759

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Re: Westminster Council - parked in restricted street during prescribed hours
« Reply #7 on: January 02, 2025, 11:53:06 pm »
@iispartan that's only an informal rejection, if you wait for the Notice to Owner and make a further challenge within 14 days, Westminster will normally reoffer the discount anyway, so there's limited risk in giving it a go.

One simple route to success is that Westminster has recently been neglecting to provide any traffic orders in its parking cases, in which case it's an easy win. Quite a few of their traffic orders are wrong, if you're happy to wait for the NTO I'll check if the restrictions are properly enforceable.
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I practice law in the Traffic Penalty Tribunal, London Tribunals, the First-tier tribunal for Scotland, and the Traffic Penalty Tribunal for Northern Ireland, but I am not a solicitor nor a barrister. Notwithstanding this, I voluntarily apply the cab rank rule. I am a member of the Society of Professional McKenzie Friends, my membership number is FM193.

Quote from: 'Gumph' date='Thu, 19 Jan 2023 - 10:23'
cp8759 is, indeed, a Wizard of the First Order

iispartan

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Re: Westminster Council - parked in restricted street during prescribed hours
« Reply #8 on: January 05, 2025, 11:40:13 am »
@cp8759 If you’re positive they’ll re-offer the discount then I’m happy to wait for NTO and challenge
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H C Andersen

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Re: Westminster Council - parked in restricted street during prescribed hours
« Reply #9 on: January 05, 2025, 12:07:34 pm »
my brother received a PCN

I basically made a quick appeal

I’m happy to wait for NTO and challenge

Can we sort out who's who pl?

Your brother was driving.
Who is the registered keeper(RK) and are their DVLA keeper details current(the NTO would be sent to the RK)
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iispartan

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Re: Westminster Council - parked in restricted street during prescribed hours
« Reply #10 on: January 05, 2025, 01:01:11 pm »
I’m registered keeper, but my brother was driving. Yes details are up to date
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cp8759

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Re: Westminster Council - parked in restricted street during prescribed hours
« Reply #11 on: January 05, 2025, 02:07:42 pm »
@iispartan so far Westminster have always reoffered the discount if the NTO is challenged promptly. Let me know when the NTO has arrived and I'll draft a formal representation for you.
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I practice law in the Traffic Penalty Tribunal, London Tribunals, the First-tier tribunal for Scotland, and the Traffic Penalty Tribunal for Northern Ireland, but I am not a solicitor nor a barrister. Notwithstanding this, I voluntarily apply the cab rank rule. I am a member of the Society of Professional McKenzie Friends, my membership number is FM193.

Quote from: 'Gumph' date='Thu, 19 Jan 2023 - 10:23'
cp8759 is, indeed, a Wizard of the First Order
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