Author Topic: Redbridge council parking ticket  (Read 7796 times)

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Re: Redbridge council parking ticket
« Reply #15 on: »
Hi HC Andersen ,

I didn’t understand what you have said.
Please could you kindly advise .
Did you want me to call the number ? I didn’t get that. I thought you were asking full 020 number 😊 sorry if I misunderstood.

My argument is “No where was it mentioned to pay via Ringo app.

We live out of London and we’re visiting this place . We wouldn’t know if it’s not mentioned . “
That’s my argument. “And fact that I already paid for parking using that location number.”

I felt that info displayed is misguiding.   
If you think this is legally not acceptable please advise. If you say I can give a go then,
I need a formal format to appeal please . Can you kindly help ?

Thank you in advance.


Re: Redbridge council parking ticket
« Reply #16 on: »
Hi Andersen ,
I called that number just now , it’s asking the caller to pay Bia Ringo app using same location number.

Re: Redbridge council parking ticket
« Reply #17 on: »
The facts are:

- Two main providers are used by London boroughs for virtual payment, RingGo and PayByPhone
- Signs tend to just say Pay by phone, with a number and location code, but it's understood by many now that the location code can be selected either manually or auto-filled by geo location on the appropriate app for RingGo or PayByPhone
- The information about which provider is operational at the location is often given on separate post signs and/or on pay machines, but machines are being phased out
- Because of the confusion about Pay by phone and the PayByPhone app, there are a significant number of adjudications that find for an appellant who should have used RingGo but there was no obvious signage to tell them so
- Further, one can move a few metres from one street to another and see the same type of sign but choose the wrong provider as you crossed a borough boundary (eg here Redbridge = RingGo but neighbouring Waltham Forest is PayByPhone)
- Absent other signage you'd have to spot that the telephone number on the sign is different, a number you probably never called if using apps
- The PayByPhone home screen actually has the name in all lower case - paybyphone.

In Redbridge we also have the one hour free in all pay bays but not relevant here I think.
« Last Edit: May 31, 2025, 07:49:03 pm by stamfordman »

Re: Redbridge council parking ticket
« Reply #18 on: »
Whether 'it's understood' (by whom?) or not would not IMO cut any ice with an adjudicator.

OP, you did not comply with what was conveyed by the sign, this is an objective fact. IMO, the burden then falls to you as regards why you did not. 

See Item 7, Part 4: https://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2016/362/schedule/4

(h) “Pay by phone” and a telephone number and “quoting location” and a location number

Is the prescribed variant for this sign.


Re: Redbridge council parking ticket
« Reply #19 on: »
I take the point about signage. In the absence of anything else you seem to be saying there is no provision for any other payment mechanism than direct calling the number, a point you've made before. But traffic orders make a broader definition of 'telephone payment system,'.

The traffic order for this location in Redbridge says:

Payment Parking Places
18. At all times during which a vehicle is left in a Payment Parking Place, or a shared use Payment Parking
Place, during the Permitted Hours identified in the Map Schedule, there shall be displayed in a conspicuous
manner on the said vehicle a Valid Parking Ticket, an Essential User Permit and disc or a Valid Parking
Dispensation, or in respect of which there has been granted a Valid Virtual Essential User Permit or Virtual
Parking Dispensationw n i e n exempts them from displaying an Essential User Permit or Parking
Dispensation, issued in accordance with Articles 11(1)-11(5) or 11(7)-11(10) of this Order.

19. Where a vehicle has been left in a Payment Parking Place without displaying any of the indications in Article 18, an indication that payment of the Parking Charge has been made using the Telephone Payment Parking System shall appear on a Hand-held Device.


Definition:

"Telephone Payment Parking System" means a system to facilitate and monitor the payment of the
Parking Charge using the telephone or internet enabled device via communication with the service
provider, in accordance with instructions indicated on signs located at or in the vicinity of each
Parking Place.

Re: Redbridge council parking ticket
« Reply #20 on: »
This definition “
"Telephone Payment Parking System" means a system to facilitate and monitor the payment of the
Parking Charge using the telephone or internet enabled device via communication with the service
provider, in accordance with instructions indicated on signs located at or in the vicinity of each
Parking Place.“  specifies ‘internet enabled device’ in which case the signage is not very clear to motorists, hence could be understood wrongly? The single Need to specify “RINGO app“ somewhere .
Is this argument CORRECT from a user standpoint please ?
« Last Edit: June 03, 2025, 03:56:35 am by Brighthorizon »

Re: Redbridge council parking ticket
« Reply #21 on: »
A motorist does not know the contents of the Order when they park. The essential elements are conveyed by traffic signs which are of either a standard(prescribed) form specified in the Traffic Signs etc. Regs or as authorised by the Secretary of State.

In this case, the motorist would have a defence if they complied with the sign.

Telephone Payment Parking System" means a system to facilitate and monitor the payment of the
Parking Charge using the telephone or internet enabled device via communication with the service
provider, in accordance with instructions indicated on signs located at or in the vicinity of each Parking Place.“


As the OP has demonstrated, the tel. no. instructs 'the caller to pay via Ringo app using same location number.'

But they didn't.

The OP must make up their own mind as to how far to take this matter as regards the contravention itself.




Re: Redbridge council parking ticket
« Reply #22 on: »
There are appeals allowed for the pay by phone app assumption. Another one below.

Plus one where the appeal was refused in line with Mr Andersen's intervention.

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Case Details
Case reference   2240397035
Appellant   Athinoulla Antoniou
Authority   London Borough of Redbridge
VRM   EA71HKT
   
PCN Detailsfree
PCN   AF07531492
Contravention date   14 Jun 2024
Contravention time   11:20:00
Contravention location   The Shrubberies
Penalty amount   GBP 80.00
Contravention   Parked without payment of the parking charge
   
Referral date   -
   
Decision Date   16 Nov 2024
Adjudicator   Belinda Pearce
Appeal decision   Appeal allowed
Direction   cancel the Penalty Charge Notice and the Notice to Owner.
Reasons   A Telephone Appeal Hearing was scheduled for 9.30 a.m. today, 16th November 2024; I spoke with the Appellant on the contact number provided.
1. The Enforcement Authority assert the whereabouts of the said vehicle, at the relevant time on the material date, to be at a location subject to a restriction requiring the purchase of time to park and facilitating the purchase of parking time by telephone payment.
The Enforcement Authority assert the absence of payment in respect of the said vehicle.
2. The Appellant denies liability for the ensuing Penalty Charge Notice on the basis of the prevailing circumstances and challenge as stated in her written representations, supported by screen-shots and photographic capture, which she reiterated and comprehensively detailed during the Telephone Hearing.
3. The Enforcement Authority who assert that the said vehicle was so parked contrary to an operative restriction is obliged to adduce evidence to the requisite standard to substantiate that assertion:-
The evidence upon which the Enforcement Authority rely comprises copy Penalty Charge Notice and contemporaneous notes attributable to the Civil Enforcement Officer together with contemporaneous photographic evidence: images showing the said vehicle in situ, unoccupied and unattended, and the applicable signage notifying motorists of the restriction.
The Civil Enforcement Officer confirms the absence of payment receipt by the telephone service provider at the at the point of enquiries.
The Enforcement Authority also adduce:
i) Inactive links to governing Traffic Management Order provisions which, as I have expressed in other Appeals, I find unsatisfactory.
ii) A map/plan of RingGo locations plotting the location in question; this is of limited, if any, evidential value.
iii) sample images of an out-of-use voucher-dispensing machine, charges information and conditions of use; this too is of limited evidential value.
No contemporaneous photographic evidence is adduced to demonstrate the presence, position and visibility of any voucher-dispensing machine in the vicinity of the said vehicle.
4. The evidence adduced by the Enforcement Authority was examined to evaluate the allegation in conjunction with the Appellant's representations.
The image of the sign at the location, as submitted by the Civil Enforcement Officer, is at such angle that the capitalisation in the legend, despite zoom enhancement, cannot be clearly discerned; the 'P' of ''Pay' can be seen as capitalised.
The image submitted by the Appellant, of the sign consulted by the Appellant, clearly demonstrates the capitalisation of both words 'Pay' and 'Phone.'
Neither sign references the telephone service provider upon whom the Enforcement Authority rely for operation of the telephone payment facility.
5. The Appellant described the sequence of events on the date in question, and emphasised that she had diligently complied with the parking regime; she was surprised to receive the Penalty Charge Notice and is of the opinion that the fault lies with the Enforcement Authority for lack of clarity regarding the need to use only the RingGo service.
I had the opportunity to assess and question the Appellant during the Hearing, I found the Appellant's evidence to be cogent and credible, and I accepted it in its entirety.
The Appellant interpreted the legend on the sign to indicate the 'Pay by Phone' service with which she was acquainted and had the App; she duly utilised that service.
Being unfamiliar with the area the Appellant interpreted the reference 'Eight Bells' to be a local landmark; the name of the council was also of no consequence to the Appellant.
6. In light of the fact that a telephone payment service exists bearing the name 'Pay by Phone' which mirrors the pay by phone words on the sign, and that motorists having 'apps' no longer need to make telephone connections nor attend voucher-dispensing machines, it would be prudent of an Enforcement Authority to ensure that signage unambiguously specifies which system is to be used on the sign so as to avoid such situations.
I find the incorporation of the words 'pay by phone' to cause ambiguity and thereby render the sign inadequate.
Whilst it is incumbent upon a motorist to consult signage and comply with restrictions, it is incumbent upon an enforcement authority to ensure the signage implementing the terms of a Traffic Management Order is adequate to communicate the nature of the restriction to motorists.
I do not find that to be the case in this instance.
The legend on the sign lacks clarity and is open to ambiguity.

Evidentially I am not satisfied that the contravention occurred, accordingly I allow this Appeal.


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Case Details
Case reference   2240435553
Appellant   Khadijha Rahman
Authority   London Borough of Redbridge
VRM   GU15BYR
   
PCN Details
PCN   AF07525911
Contravention date   11 Jun 2024
Contravention time   11:52:00
Contravention location   Eastwood Road
Penalty amount   GBP 80.00
Contravention   Parked without payment of the parking charge
   
Referral date   -
   
Decision Date   28 Oct 2024
Adjudicator   Herjinder Mann
Appeal decision   Appeal refused
Direction   Full penalty charge notice amount stated to be paid within 28 days.
Reasons   1. This was a personal appeal via the telephone.
2. The Appellant states that she made a payment via the PaybyPhone system. The confirmation that she received did not display the location details. She now understands that payment should have been via RingGo. She says that there is a lack of clarity and the sign does not state that payment must be via RingGo.
3. The Enforcement Authority submit that the Appellant’s vehicle was parked without a valid parking ticket or payment registered on the Ring Go system on the 11th June 2024 in Eastwood Road, Goodmayes. The civil enforcement officer states that they checked the RingGo system three times. They submit that the appellant paid by the PayByPhone company which is not the permitted method at this location. They say that the sign provides a phone number by which payments are to be made. They have provided a photograph of the signage at the location.
4. I have seen photographic evidence of the road sign indicating the methods of payment. The sign gives the times of operation and states “Pay by phone” followed with a telephone number. I find that the method of payment is clearly specified.
5. I find that the sign is clear in relation to the method of payment by making a payment by calling a phone number. There is no reference to using the PayByPhone company.
6. I accept that the Appellant did make a payment via the Pay By Phone app and she did intend to pay for the parking. The circumstances that the Appellant found herself in and her assumption amount to mitigation which I am unable to take into account. Although the Appellant did make a payment for parking, she did not pay via the telephone number provided. The Pay by Phone app is not used by the enforcement authority at this location.
7. As the payment was not made in the manner prescribed, I find that there has been a contravention. It is the driver’s responsibility to ensure that they follow the instructions on the road sign. It is not for the Appellant to choose the app by which to pay and in these circumstances the payment was not made to the Enforcement Authority.
8. I therefore refuse this appeal and determine that the penalty charge is payable by the Appellant.

Re: Redbridge council parking ticket
« Reply #23 on: »
Hello stamfordman , HC Andersen

Today I’m thinking to appeal using the facts below.

Could you advise please if I do using the letter I received ? Is there a formal process ? please could you kindly sugggest . Many thanks . 🙏🏼

Re: Redbridge council parking ticket
« Reply #24 on: »
Hello Stamfordman and HC Andersen, I have made a representation to Redbridge council and received a rejection letter which I have uploaded here.
I would like to give myself one more chance and go ahead with appeal. I need help with writing a nice appeal please. Could you kindly advice please. Thank you in advance . Regards .

Re: Redbridge council parking ticket
« Reply #25 on: »
Can't see the NOR.

Re: Redbridge council parking ticket
« Reply #26 on: »
Sure Andersen , I’ll upload again

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Re: Redbridge council parking ticket
« Reply #27 on: »
The information to appeal

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Re: Redbridge council parking ticket
« Reply #28 on: »
No discount on offer so you should register an appeal with the tribunal.

There seems to have been confusion with the representations - only the owner/presumed keeper could make reps unless handed to someone else in writing.

They are obviously trying to prepare for the tribunal by saying you should have noticed the actual location (a rugby club in Newbury) you paid for, and say you should have called the number to determine the provider as RingGo but I think they've shot themselves in the foot as this looks like they admit there was no RingGo signage and it's now common ground among some adjudicators that people go to apps to pay for parking.

I'll help you with the appeal.

Meanwhile here are two more.

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Case reference   2250065869
Appellant   Asma Esmail
Authority   London Borough of Redbridge
VRM   YD13XSC
   
PCN Details
PCN   AF08244703
Contravention date   13 Nov 2024
Contravention time   10:46:00
Contravention location   IIFORD LANE
Penalty amount   GBP 80.00
Contravention   Parked without payment of the parking charge
   
Referral date   -
   
Decision Date   17 Apr 2025
Adjudicator   Henry Michael Greenslade
Appeal decision   Appeal allowed
Direction   cancel the Penalty Charge Notice and the Notice to Owner.
Reasons   At this scheduled person hearing the Appellant appeared in person, assisted by Mr Arshad Msallam, via MS Teams.
The Enforcement Authority did not attend and was not represented, either in vision, by telephone, or in person.
A contravention can occur if a vehicle is parked in an on-street payment parking bay during controlled hours, without payment of the parking charge.
There appears to be no dispute that the vehicle was parked in this bay, or that the Penalty Charge Notice was issued to it, as shown in the photographs/digital images produced by the Enforcement Authority.
The Appellant’s case is that she arrived at the bay and saw the sign advising ‘pay by phone’ and did so using the PayByPhone mobile phone application, of which she produced proof. Payment appears clearly to have been made.
The Enforcement Authority’s case is that the provider is actually RingGo and no payment was made using that surface.
This is not an unknown occurrence and the Enforcement Authority can usually by reference to a nearby sign, for example on the timeplate post, which provider should be used.
In this case there is no such evidence produced by the Enforcement Authority and although the civil enforcement officer’s images are of poor quality I have looked at them closely and can see no sign or notice as to which provider should be used.

It does remain the responsibility of the motorist to check carefully on each occasion before leaving their vehicle, so as to ensure that they do so only as permitted and that this will remain the position for as long as the vehicle will be there. This includes making sure that they comply with all restrictions and prohibitions indicated by the signs. However, it is also the responsibility of the Enforcement Authority to ensure that restrictions and prohibitions are clearly signed so as adequately to inform the motorist of the requirements.
The Adjudicator is only able to decide an appeal by making findings of fact on the basis of the evidence actually produced by the parties and applying relevant law.
Considering carefully all the evidence before me I cannot find as a fact that, on this particular occasion, a contravention did occur.
Accordingly, this appeal must be allowed.

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Case reference   2250059924
Appellant   Kim Stallard
Authority   London Borough of Redbridge
VRM   K5 AHE
   
PCN Details
PCN   AF08279424
Contravention date   20 Nov 2024
Contravention time   12:41:00
Contravention location   Ilford Lane
Penalty amount   GBP 80.00
Contravention   Parked without payment of the parking charge
   
Referral date   -
   
Decision Date   06 May 2025
Adjudicator   Andrew Harman
Appeal decision   Appeal allowed
Direction   cancel the Penalty Charge Notice and the Notice to Owner.
Reasons   The contravention alleged in these proceedings is that this vehicle was parked without payment of the parking charge.
This council uses RingGo to process its parking payments.
There is no dispute that the appellant purchased a parking session via his payphone app, he explaining the reasons why he did so.
I accept the council's submission that the 'pay by phone' instruction given on the bay sign is not an instruction to make payment by a different service provided, paybyphone, and I note all of the other points it makes in support of its case. There is however no evidence before me to support the council's claim that the RingGo payment option was clearly stated on signage on a machine, (the appellant saying that the machine had been removed), and I am not accordingly satified that the requirement to purchase the parking charge via RingGo was clearly communicated to the appellant. The contravention has not therefore been proved and I allow the appeal.


Re: Redbridge council parking ticket
« Reply #29 on: »
Hello Stamfordman ,

Registered keeper is my husband. We both drive this car. On the day , I was driving and I have paid the parking , hence I assumed I need to make representation.

Sure , I will get in writing to hand this over to me.

I’m very grateful you are helping me with the appeal.

What are the next steps ? How should I proceed please 🙏🏼

The two cases you have posted are exactly shows dot to dot relevance. I’m very hopeful this PCN will be cancelled.

Could we start the appeal representation process please ?

Many Thanks 🙏🏼