3. Penalty Charge for being in a bus lane (camera enforcement)
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Penalty Charge for being in a bus lane (camera enforcement)
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Hi everyone, this is my first time posting here, so thank you in advance for any advice.

I recently received a notice for allegedly being in a bus lane. The contravention was recorded by camera. I was turning out of a junction at the time. It looks like my back wheel briefly touched the boundary line of the bus lane while making the turn. There was an oncoming bus in the opposite direction, which caused me to turn slightly more sharply than usual to avoid it.

I’d really appreciate any advice on whether this would be considered a contravention and if it’s worth challenging. Thanks again!

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« Last Edit: April 30, 2025, 02:12:57 pm by SN81 »
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Re: Penalty Charge for being in a bus lane (camera enforcement)
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I REGRET THAT, FOR THE PRESENT, I AM UNABLE TO TAKE ON ANY MORE CASES AS A REPRESENTATIVE AT THE LONDON TRIBUNALS. THIS IS FOR BOTH PERSONAL AND LEGAL REASONS. PLEASE DO NOT PM ME UNLESS YOU HAVE POSTED YOUR THREAD ON THE FORUM AND I WILL ATTEMPT TO GIVE ADVICE.


If you do not challenge, you join "The Mugged Club".

cp8759 and mrmustard are true geniuses. I know my place in the hierarchy of The Three Musketeers. 😊 "The Clinician", "The Gentleman" and "The Showman"

There are "known knowns" which we may never have wished to know. This applies to them. But in the field the idea that there are also "unknown unknowns" doesn't apply as they hide in the aleatoric lottery. I know this is true and need to be prepared knowing the "unknown unknowns" may well apply.

To Socrates from "Hippocrates"
Penalty Charge for being in a bus lane (camera enforcement) - Royal Borough of Greenwich Location Well Hall Road SE9
« Reply #2 on: »

PCN Number - GR23425627

Hi everyone, this is my first time posting here, so thank you in advance for any advice.

I recently received a notice for allegedly being in a bus lane. The contravention was recorded by camera. I was turning out of a junction at the time. It looks like my back wheel briefly touched the boundary line of the bus lane while making the turn. There was an oncoming bus in the opposite direction, which caused me to turn slightly more sharply than usual to avoid it.

I’d really appreciate any advice on whether this would be considered a contravention and if it’s worth challenging. Thanks again!



https://imgur.com/a/cIcT3A0

https://maps.app.goo.gl/4u5QqKUYuscBEPnd9


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Re: Penalty Charge for being in a bus lane (camera enforcement)
« Reply #3 on: »
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Re: Penalty Charge for being in a bus lane (camera enforcement)
« Reply #4 on: »
They are extrapolating the urine. No contravention according to the video. And you avoided the bus!

Was there a warning sign at the junction as you turned left? Back with a draft later.
« Last Edit: May 01, 2025, 06:10:08 pm by Hippocrates »
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I REGRET THAT, FOR THE PRESENT, I AM UNABLE TO TAKE ON ANY MORE CASES AS A REPRESENTATIVE AT THE LONDON TRIBUNALS. THIS IS FOR BOTH PERSONAL AND LEGAL REASONS. PLEASE DO NOT PM ME UNLESS YOU HAVE POSTED YOUR THREAD ON THE FORUM AND I WILL ATTEMPT TO GIVE ADVICE.


If you do not challenge, you join "The Mugged Club".

cp8759 and mrmustard are true geniuses. I know my place in the hierarchy of The Three Musketeers. 😊 "The Clinician", "The Gentleman" and "The Showman"

There are "known knowns" which we may never have wished to know. This applies to them. But in the field the idea that there are also "unknown unknowns" doesn't apply as they hide in the aleatoric lottery. I know this is true and need to be prepared knowing the "unknown unknowns" may well apply.

To Socrates from "Hippocrates"
Re: Penalty Charge for being in a bus lane (camera enforcement)
« Reply #5 on: »
Hi Hippocrates,

Thank you for your reply.

Yes!  That's what I thought...

I'm pretty sure there wasn't a warning sign but I'm going past there later so will check and update you.

I also signed your petition!
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Re: Penalty Charge for being in a bus lane (camera enforcement)
« Reply #6 on: »
Cheers. This is going to be fun.
Logged
I REGRET THAT, FOR THE PRESENT, I AM UNABLE TO TAKE ON ANY MORE CASES AS A REPRESENTATIVE AT THE LONDON TRIBUNALS. THIS IS FOR BOTH PERSONAL AND LEGAL REASONS. PLEASE DO NOT PM ME UNLESS YOU HAVE POSTED YOUR THREAD ON THE FORUM AND I WILL ATTEMPT TO GIVE ADVICE.


If you do not challenge, you join "The Mugged Club".

cp8759 and mrmustard are true geniuses. I know my place in the hierarchy of The Three Musketeers. 😊 "The Clinician", "The Gentleman" and "The Showman"

There are "known knowns" which we may never have wished to know. This applies to them. But in the field the idea that there are also "unknown unknowns" doesn't apply as they hide in the aleatoric lottery. I know this is true and need to be prepared knowing the "unknown unknowns" may well apply.

To Socrates from "Hippocrates"
Re: Penalty Charge for being in a bus lane (camera enforcement)
« Reply #7 on: »
Quote from: SN81 on April 30, 2025, 02:02:41 pm
Hi everyone, this is my first time posting here, so thank you in advance for any advice.

I recently received a notice for allegedly being in a bus lane. The contravention was recorded by camera. I was turning out of a junction at the time. It looks like my back wheel briefly touched the boundary line of the bus lane while making the turn. There was an oncoming bus in the opposite direction, which caused me to turn slightly more sharply than usual to avoid it.

I’d really appreciate any advice on whether this would be considered a contravention and if it’s worth challenging. Thanks again!
Quote from: Hippocrates on May 02, 2025, 10:39:10 am
Cheers. This is going to be fun.

Hi Hippocrates,

I checked and there's definitely no warning sign at the junction as I turned left.  Can I contest the penalty charge based on this then?  How about the fact that only my wheel touched the bus lane boundary line?

Thanks aagin.
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Re: Penalty Charge for being in a bus lane (camera enforcement)
« Reply #8 on: »
@SN81

I challenge PCN ....as follows:

1. There is no evidence of my vehicle passing an upright bus lane sign.
2. The alleged contravention is totally de minimis.
3. There is no advanced warning sign to diagram 962 placed at the junction as advised by the TSM Chapter Three. Therefore, the signage is not fit for purpose.

In light of the above, please cancel the PCN.
« Last Edit: May 03, 2025, 02:50:21 pm by Hippocrates »
Logged
I REGRET THAT, FOR THE PRESENT, I AM UNABLE TO TAKE ON ANY MORE CASES AS A REPRESENTATIVE AT THE LONDON TRIBUNALS. THIS IS FOR BOTH PERSONAL AND LEGAL REASONS. PLEASE DO NOT PM ME UNLESS YOU HAVE POSTED YOUR THREAD ON THE FORUM AND I WILL ATTEMPT TO GIVE ADVICE.


If you do not challenge, you join "The Mugged Club".

cp8759 and mrmustard are true geniuses. I know my place in the hierarchy of The Three Musketeers. 😊 "The Clinician", "The Gentleman" and "The Showman"

There are "known knowns" which we may never have wished to know. This applies to them. But in the field the idea that there are also "unknown unknowns" doesn't apply as they hide in the aleatoric lottery. I know this is true and need to be prepared knowing the "unknown unknowns" may well apply.

To Socrates from "Hippocrates"
Re: Penalty Charge for being in a bus lane (camera enforcement)
« Reply #9 on: »
Quote from: Hippocrates on May 03, 2025, 02:42:53 pm
@SN81

I challenge PCN ....as follows:

1. There is no evidence of my vehicle passing an upright bus lane sign.
2. The alleged contravention is totally de minimis.
3. There is no advanced warning sign to diagram 962 placed at the junction as advised by the TSM Chapter Three. Therefore, the signage is not fit for purpose.

In light of the above, please cancel the PCN.

Hi @Hippocrates

This is amazing, thank you so much for your assistance with this.

Hopefully I won't have any issues with this and the PCN gets cancelled!
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Re: Penalty Charge for being in a bus lane (camera enforcement)
« Reply #10 on: »
If they cancel it at this stage, I'll buy the parking manager a drink.  :P
« Last Edit: May 04, 2025, 10:29:52 am by Hippocrates »
Logged
I REGRET THAT, FOR THE PRESENT, I AM UNABLE TO TAKE ON ANY MORE CASES AS A REPRESENTATIVE AT THE LONDON TRIBUNALS. THIS IS FOR BOTH PERSONAL AND LEGAL REASONS. PLEASE DO NOT PM ME UNLESS YOU HAVE POSTED YOUR THREAD ON THE FORUM AND I WILL ATTEMPT TO GIVE ADVICE.


If you do not challenge, you join "The Mugged Club".

cp8759 and mrmustard are true geniuses. I know my place in the hierarchy of The Three Musketeers. 😊 "The Clinician", "The Gentleman" and "The Showman"

There are "known knowns" which we may never have wished to know. This applies to them. But in the field the idea that there are also "unknown unknowns" doesn't apply as they hide in the aleatoric lottery. I know this is true and need to be prepared knowing the "unknown unknowns" may well apply.

To Socrates from "Hippocrates"
Re: Penalty Charge for being in a bus lane (camera enforcement)
« Reply #11 on: »
Quote
Hopefully I won't have any issues with this and the PCN gets cancelled!
Just bear in mind that if they refuse your reps, they get to keep the money. Most people just pay when refused; is this you ?
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Re: Penalty Charge for being in a bus lane (camera enforcement)
« Reply #12 on: »
Quote from: Incandescent on May 04, 2025, 10:16:27 am
Quote
Hopefully I won't have any issues with this and the PCN gets cancelled!
Most people just pay when refused; is this you ?
I guess the answer is no.

https://www.ftla.uk/the-flame-pit/how-do-we-get-more-people-to-fight-their-pcns/msg41917/#msg41917

Be back there soon!
« Last Edit: May 04, 2025, 01:00:16 pm by Hippocrates »
Logged
I REGRET THAT, FOR THE PRESENT, I AM UNABLE TO TAKE ON ANY MORE CASES AS A REPRESENTATIVE AT THE LONDON TRIBUNALS. THIS IS FOR BOTH PERSONAL AND LEGAL REASONS. PLEASE DO NOT PM ME UNLESS YOU HAVE POSTED YOUR THREAD ON THE FORUM AND I WILL ATTEMPT TO GIVE ADVICE.


If you do not challenge, you join "The Mugged Club".

cp8759 and mrmustard are true geniuses. I know my place in the hierarchy of The Three Musketeers. 😊 "The Clinician", "The Gentleman" and "The Showman"

There are "known knowns" which we may never have wished to know. This applies to them. But in the field the idea that there are also "unknown unknowns" doesn't apply as they hide in the aleatoric lottery. I know this is true and need to be prepared knowing the "unknown unknowns" may well apply.

To Socrates from "Hippocrates"
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