3. PCN Debt Filed at Court stage - form advice
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PCN Debt Filed at Court stage - form advice
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Hi Everyone

Thank goodness you're here (now the other place is offline)!

I heard from the court today (I phoned) that my ongoing PCN was filed in Northampton on May 10th, so they are sending me the form to complete

Unsurprisingly, Croydon Council did not/has not sent me a notice/form....but then they didn't send Formal NOR either!

So, now I need to know how to complete it - can you help me please?

HCAndersen - it's me, again! Quick recap below:

Disabled parking space opposite Town Hall / Time limit 3hrs / Disabled badge & clock displayed / time on clock set wrong (11am instead of 12pm, due to autistic panic as late for wedding because of bad traffic)
Croydon Town Hall wedding booked to start at 12 - security staff agreed to witness panicked & late arrival, also that I parked for less than 3hrs (named Council employed officer in informal reps, sent badges, and autism letter) 
Contravention code: 40 issued - not 30 (no previous observations of car recorded)
No NOR sent, copy issued later (on request, but after Charge Cert received)
You thought copy of alleged NOR sent was all wrong
Just learned about court registration - no paperwork record from Council - again!

So, here I am, asking for more help - if you would be so kind?

ThanksInAdvance
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Re: PCN Debt Filed at Court stage - form advice
« Reply #1 on: »
As I understand it you received an on-street PCN whilst parked in a disabled bay.
Did you submit Informal Representations as detailed on the PCN?

Next you should have received a Notice to Owner (NTO) which would have been sent to the Registered Keeper of the car as held by the DVLA on the date of the contravention.
Did you submit Formal Representations (challenge) against the NTO as detailed on the NTO?
And did the Council respond or was this the Notice of Rejection that you didn't receive.

If you didn't receive the NTO then tick the applicable box on the form. Only tick one box.

If you did receive the NTO and did submit a Formal Representation within the time limit but received no response, then tick the box that says you made representations but did not receive a rejection notice. Only tick the one box.

Any other scenario then please report back first.

Complete and sign the rest of the form. For the purposes of the form you are the respondent and the Council is the applicant.

Scan the document to a PDF or JPEG format. Attach the file to an email to the Traffic Enforcement Centre. The email address should be on the TE9 Witness Statement form.
« Last Edit: May 17, 2024, 12:50:48 pm by Enceladus »
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Re: PCN Debt Filed at Court stage - form advice
« Reply #2 on: »
Hi and thank you for replying.

I got the NTO (and advice - on the other place - from HCAndersen)
I sent formal reps and waited.....NOTHING...
...until Charge Certificate....

As the time-frame meant it was technically possible that an NOR was sent, I emailed the council and told them I had a charge cert, but no NOR was sent in response to my formal reps - sent by email on time.

The council then emailed me, and attached a copy of the NOR allegedly sent to me.

HCA thought that the email / NOR copy were not worded as should be, and said to wait for the next stage, checking regularly to see when it happened (as the Council would be unlikely to inform me, or send me the form, as is the case)

Meanwhile, I have plenty on my plate (I am sick, waiting for PET scan results etc) so I want this over with ASAP.

I can't afford to pay (divorced/disabled/mother/finances very tight... yada yada)

Now have form to complete - emailed to me, today, from Northampton Court (after I phoned to see if the debt was registered yet....It was on 10 May - no notification from council)

This is where I am at

ThanksInAdvance
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Re: PCN Debt Filed at Court stage - form advice
« Reply #3 on: »
Put the wording of the NoR aside for the moment. From your account the NoR  wasn't served on you when it should have been so the matter progressed through the Charge Cert stage and then to the Order for Recovery (of unpaid penalty charge), where you're now at. The OfR should be in the post from Croydon since the TEC have confirmed that the debt (penalty charge and registration fee) has been registered.

The fact is that they sent you a copy of the NoR only when you requested it and at a time when the info it contained was no longer relevant or usable.

So complete the TE9 form and tick the box that says;
"I made representations about the penalty
charge to the enforcing authority concerned
within 28 days of the service of the Notice to
Owner, but did not receive a rejection notice."
and
Email a PDF or JPEG of the form to the TEC at tec@justice.gov.uk with the subject line Witness Statement submission. And don't delay. Get it done as a priority. The TEC should email an acknowledgement receipt by return. Post back here immediately if there is no acknowledgement

The TEC will cancel and revoke the OfR and the Charge Cert. The matter should then be referred to the independent adjudicator for direction on how to proceed. So if you get anything from the London Tribunals you need to respond. Post back here when that happens.

The Adjudicator may well request a copy of the representations that you made.
« Last Edit: May 17, 2024, 01:47:50 pm by Enceladus »
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Re: PCN Debt Filed at Court stage - form advice
« Reply #4 on: »
OP, there's nothing unique about your case.

They received your reps and responded with a rejection.

You did not receive the rejection as required.

You submit a WS exactly as per previous post from Enceladus.

After the adjudicator registers the case as an appeal (which they would) then you get to the substantive issues of the case, including the NOR's non-compliance with prescribed procedure as regards its contents.

You can't short-cut the procedure I'm afraid.
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Re: PCN Debt Filed at Court stage - form advice
« Reply #5 on: »
Thank you both for your replies.

I have completed and emailed the TE9 to the TEC  as per your instructions.

I will return here for next steps advice, hopefully, in the not too distant.

Thank you for helping me - very much appreciated.

Have a wonderful weekend

ThanksInAdvance
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Re: PCN Debt Filed at Court stage - form advice
« Reply #6 on: »
Hi

Just to let you know that yesterday, out of the blue, I got a letter from Croydon Council saying they've cancelled my PCN!

Thank you for the help and advice, much appreciated.

Have a great weekend!  :D
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Re: PCN Debt Filed at Court stage - form advice
« Reply #7 on: »
That was quick. Well done!

Hang on to all the correspondence about this that you have for a couple of months.
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Re: PCN Debt Filed at Court stage - form advice
« Reply #8 on: »
Hi

Yes, I will, just in case they change their mind - and I'm only half joking!

In fact, I just checked on the Croydon Council website....The 'appeal a PCN' route still shows my case as active, whereas the 'pay a fine' route says 'case closed'....Clear as mud!
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  3. PCN Debt Filed at Court stage - form advice