Author Topic: PCN, City of Westminster, code 12r, 9 Cabbell Street 9 Cabbell St, London NW1 5BA  (Read 1592 times)

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That sounds like something we can use as mitigating evidence, as per the strategy of last resort. If we can get a failure to consider on top of the previously make unlawful threat of increasing the penalty to £195 before the permitted time, you'll have a pretty solid appeal to pursue at the tribunal.

It might be easier if I submit the representations on your behalf, if you'd like me to do that please send me a PM and we can arrange this.
I practice law in the Traffic Penalty Tribunal, London Tribunals, the First-tier tribunal for Scotland, and the Traffic Penalty Tribunal for Northern Ireland, but I am not a solicitor or a barrister. Notwithstanding this, I voluntarily apply the cab rank rule. I am a member of the Society of Professional McKenzie Friends, my membership number is FM193 and I abide by the SPMF service standards.

Quote from: 'Gumph' date='Thu, 19 Jan 2023 - 10:23'
cp8759 is, indeed, a Wizard of the First Order

@runninghorse I replied to your PM asking you to email me, but I've not seen an email from you?
I practice law in the Traffic Penalty Tribunal, London Tribunals, the First-tier tribunal for Scotland, and the Traffic Penalty Tribunal for Northern Ireland, but I am not a solicitor or a barrister. Notwithstanding this, I voluntarily apply the cab rank rule. I am a member of the Society of Professional McKenzie Friends, my membership number is FM193 and I abide by the SPMF service standards.

Quote from: 'Gumph' date='Thu, 19 Jan 2023 - 10:23'
cp8759 is, indeed, a Wizard of the First Order

This thread raises interesting issues of propriety because the driver made reps so promptly and the authority responded similarly.

OP, at no point in these proceedings could you, as driver,ever be liable.

Whether you are the registered keeper is legally irrelevant prior to an NTO being issued.

A PCN of this type is NOT a demand for payment, it's information contained in a notice. This info notifies the driver that the OWNER is liable but that if the penalty is paid - by anyone, not just you - then the matter would be closed, otherwise the authority would demand payment of the regular penalty from the OWNER. Very similar to, but the upside down version of, private parking cases where a Notice to Keeper is sent to the keeper to tell them that the driver is liable!

Anyway, the website is totally misleading when it refers to penalties owed by the keeper who cannot be assumed at this stage i.e. prior to a NTO, to know anything about matters. It's total c**p.

It is totally at variance with propriety for the council to pass info to the person who is NOT liable threatening them with higher penalties than permitted which would in any case be owed by the OWNER. Until a NTO is served then the OWNER could not access the site for want of the magic formula: the PCN number.

The authority really need to get someone in to take a look at their procedures and the assumptions which they make regarding the status of who might be viewing.

How could the actions or inaction of the recipient of a PCN give rise to any action or threat of action by the authority against the liable party who prior to a NTO being issued could have no knowledge and has even less liability?

It's procedural nonsense IMO.

Thank you both very much for your sharing your knowledge on the process, I would never been able to see this myself.

I practice law in the Traffic Penalty Tribunal, London Tribunals, the First-tier tribunal for Scotland, and the Traffic Penalty Tribunal for Northern Ireland, but I am not a solicitor or a barrister. Notwithstanding this, I voluntarily apply the cab rank rule. I am a member of the Society of Professional McKenzie Friends, my membership number is FM193 and I abide by the SPMF service standards.

Quote from: 'Gumph' date='Thu, 19 Jan 2023 - 10:23'
cp8759 is, indeed, a Wizard of the First Order