3. PCN - Bus Lane - Harrow, Northolt Rd jct Alexandra Ave
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Author Topic: PCN - Bus Lane - Harrow, Northolt Rd jct Alexandra Ave  (Read 8661 times)

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Re: PCN - Bus Lane - Harrow, Northolt Rd jct Alexandra Ave
« Reply #15 on: »
The alleged contravention did not occur.
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I practice law in the Traffic Penalty Tribunal, London Tribunals, the First-tier tribunal for Scotland, and the Traffic Penalty Tribunal for Northern Ireland, but I am not a solicitor or a barrister. Notwithstanding this, I voluntarily apply the cab rank rule. I am a member of the Society of Professional McKenzie Friends, my membership number is FM193 and I abide by the SPMF service standards.

Quote from: 'Gumph' date='Thu, 19 Jan 2023 - 10:23'
cp8759 is, indeed, a Wizard of the First Order
Re: PCN - Bus Lane - Harrow, Northolt Rd jct Alexandra Ave
« Reply #16 on: »
The appeal is in, just waiting for response now...
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Re: PCN - Bus Lane - Harrow, Northolt Rd jct Alexandra Ave
« Reply #17 on: »
The camera is a ZenGrab LaneWatch Mk2.
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I practice law in the Traffic Penalty Tribunal, London Tribunals, the First-tier tribunal for Scotland, and the Traffic Penalty Tribunal for Northern Ireland, but I am not a solicitor or a barrister. Notwithstanding this, I voluntarily apply the cab rank rule. I am a member of the Society of Professional McKenzie Friends, my membership number is FM193 and I abide by the SPMF service standards.

Quote from: 'Gumph' date='Thu, 19 Jan 2023 - 10:23'
cp8759 is, indeed, a Wizard of the First Order
Re: PCN - Bus Lane - Harrow, Northolt Rd jct Alexandra Ave
« Reply #18 on: »
As predicted, in the post today, I received a 'thanks, but no' letter - as in, they are not cancelling it.

They state that there is an advance warning sign clearly stating the impending restriction - this is complete rubbish.  As I said in my dispute wording, the Bus Lane operates within specific hours along the main road, then stops and reverts to all traffic and as you go into the junction there is a 24/7 Bus Lane with a sign at the beginning of the lane.  And its very short, the road reverts to all traffic very shortly afterwards.

I have the option of paying the discounted charge or formally challenging the PCN.

Thoughts?

@cp8759 - thanks for posting the camera details.  Does the camera type help or hinder an appeal?
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Re: PCN - Bus Lane - Harrow, Northolt Rd jct Alexandra Ave
« Reply #19 on: »
Quote from: Mercdriver on November 01, 2023, 04:43:50 pm
@cp8759 - thanks for posting the camera details.  Does the camera type help or hinder an appeal?
It closes off one possible ground of appeal, but there are many other avenues. The easiest way to win this is to require the council to attend the hearing, if they don't they lose and they don't like turning up so they hardly ever do.
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I practice law in the Traffic Penalty Tribunal, London Tribunals, the First-tier tribunal for Scotland, and the Traffic Penalty Tribunal for Northern Ireland, but I am not a solicitor or a barrister. Notwithstanding this, I voluntarily apply the cab rank rule. I am a member of the Society of Professional McKenzie Friends, my membership number is FM193 and I abide by the SPMF service standards.

Quote from: 'Gumph' date='Thu, 19 Jan 2023 - 10:23'
cp8759 is, indeed, a Wizard of the First Order
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Re: PCN - Bus Lane - Harrow, Northolt Rd jct Alexandra Ave
« Reply #20 on: »
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I practice law in the Traffic Penalty Tribunal, London Tribunals, the First-tier tribunal for Scotland, and the Traffic Penalty Tribunal for Northern Ireland, but I am not a solicitor or a barrister. Notwithstanding this, I voluntarily apply the cab rank rule. I am a member of the Society of Professional McKenzie Friends, my membership number is FM193 and I abide by the SPMF service standards.

Quote from: 'Gumph' date='Thu, 19 Jan 2023 - 10:23'
cp8759 is, indeed, a Wizard of the First Order
Re: PCN - Bus Lane - Harrow, Northolt Rd jct Alexandra Ave
« Reply #21 on: »
What's my next step here then?

Thanks
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Re: PCN - Bus Lane - Harrow, Northolt Rd jct Alexandra Ave
« Reply #22 on: »
Show us the thanks/no thanks letter.  When we see it, the usual advice is to wait for the Enforcement Notice.

The signage appears to be the main issue in dispute.  I assume you have pictures?
« Last Edit: November 03, 2023, 10:45:30 am by Hippocrates »
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@Incandescent!

I AM ABLE TO TAKE ON MORE CASES AS A REPRESENTATIVE AT THE LONDON TRIBUNALS. I HATE RETIREMENT.


If you do not challenge, you join "The Mugged Club".

cp8759 and mrmustard are true geniuses. I know my place in the hierarchy of The Three Musketeers. 😊 "The Clinician", "The Gentleman" and "The Showman"

There are "known knowns" which we may never have wished to know. This applies to them. But in the field the idea that there are also "unknown unknowns" doesn't apply as they hide in the aleatoric lottery. I know this is true and need to be prepared knowing the "unknown unknowns" may well apply.

To Socrates from "Hippocrates"
Re: PCN - Bus Lane - Harrow, Northolt Rd jct Alexandra Ave
« Reply #23 on: »
Quote from: cp8759 on November 01, 2023, 06:42:17 pm
Quote from: Mercdriver on November 01, 2023, 04:43:50 pm
@cp8759 - thanks for posting the camera details.  Does the camera type help or hinder an appeal?
It closes off one possible ground of appeal, but there are many other avenues. The easiest way to win this is to require the council to attend the hearing, if they don't they lose and they don't like turning up so they hardly ever do.
They didn't in the case I did a few months ago;  but, they did write bunkum in response to the costs application, which they also lost.
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@Incandescent!

I AM ABLE TO TAKE ON MORE CASES AS A REPRESENTATIVE AT THE LONDON TRIBUNALS. I HATE RETIREMENT.


If you do not challenge, you join "The Mugged Club".

cp8759 and mrmustard are true geniuses. I know my place in the hierarchy of The Three Musketeers. 😊 "The Clinician", "The Gentleman" and "The Showman"

There are "known knowns" which we may never have wished to know. This applies to them. But in the field the idea that there are also "unknown unknowns" doesn't apply as they hide in the aleatoric lottery. I know this is true and need to be prepared knowing the "unknown unknowns" may well apply.

To Socrates from "Hippocrates"
Re: PCN - Bus Lane - Harrow, Northolt Rd jct Alexandra Ave
« Reply #24 on: »
Quote from: Mercdriver on October 06, 2023, 12:06:52 pm
Hi again

What is the best option to pick from this list?

Thanks



There are extra irrelevant grounds which is also another ground of appeal.  One of them is even poorly expressed.
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@Incandescent!

I AM ABLE TO TAKE ON MORE CASES AS A REPRESENTATIVE AT THE LONDON TRIBUNALS. I HATE RETIREMENT.


If you do not challenge, you join "The Mugged Club".

cp8759 and mrmustard are true geniuses. I know my place in the hierarchy of The Three Musketeers. 😊 "The Clinician", "The Gentleman" and "The Showman"

There are "known knowns" which we may never have wished to know. This applies to them. But in the field the idea that there are also "unknown unknowns" doesn't apply as they hide in the aleatoric lottery. I know this is true and need to be prepared knowing the "unknown unknowns" may well apply.

To Socrates from "Hippocrates"
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Re: PCN - Bus Lane - Harrow, Northolt Rd jct Alexandra Ave
« Reply #25 on: »
Quote from: Hippocrates on November 03, 2023, 09:29:31 am
Show us the thanks/no thanks letter.  When we see it, the usual advice is to wait for the Enforcement Notice.

The signage appears to be the main issue in dispute.  I assume you have pictures?

Hi

Here is the letter, just redacted name and address.

I don't have pictures yet, but I will get some.  I used Google Maps to see what signage there was/is along the road initially.

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Re: PCN - Bus Lane - Harrow, Northolt Rd jct Alexandra Ave
« Reply #26 on: »
Another hole dug:  automatically receive the Enforcement Notice flies in the face of the law.

The law states "may" serve an EN.

4.3(e): 
London Local Authorities Act 1996
legislation.gov.uk


I am happy to take care of this one if it goes to the Tribunal.

Is that all the letter?  I advise waiting for the Enforcement Notice and then a substantial representation can be made.
« Last Edit: November 04, 2023, 11:44:54 am by Hippocrates »
Logged
@Incandescent!

I AM ABLE TO TAKE ON MORE CASES AS A REPRESENTATIVE AT THE LONDON TRIBUNALS. I HATE RETIREMENT.


If you do not challenge, you join "The Mugged Club".

cp8759 and mrmustard are true geniuses. I know my place in the hierarchy of The Three Musketeers. 😊 "The Clinician", "The Gentleman" and "The Showman"

There are "known knowns" which we may never have wished to know. This applies to them. But in the field the idea that there are also "unknown unknowns" doesn't apply as they hide in the aleatoric lottery. I know this is true and need to be prepared knowing the "unknown unknowns" may well apply.

To Socrates from "Hippocrates"
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Re: PCN - Bus Lane - Harrow, Northolt Rd jct Alexandra Ave
« Reply #27 on: »
I highly doubt the council has considered any evidence, they just have a templated letter that says all the signs are as they should be. Definitely wait for the enforcement notice.
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I practice law in the Traffic Penalty Tribunal, London Tribunals, the First-tier tribunal for Scotland, and the Traffic Penalty Tribunal for Northern Ireland, but I am not a solicitor or a barrister. Notwithstanding this, I voluntarily apply the cab rank rule. I am a member of the Society of Professional McKenzie Friends, my membership number is FM193 and I abide by the SPMF service standards.

Quote from: 'Gumph' date='Thu, 19 Jan 2023 - 10:23'
cp8759 is, indeed, a Wizard of the First Order
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Re: PCN - Bus Lane - Harrow, Northolt Rd jct Alexandra Ave
« Reply #28 on: »
PCN date:  28th September.

Rejection letter date:  30th October.

This states:  "You can pay £130 within 28 days of the date shown on your PCN".

In view of this, perhaps Harrow would accept a payment from Doctor Who?  ::)

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@Incandescent!

I AM ABLE TO TAKE ON MORE CASES AS A REPRESENTATIVE AT THE LONDON TRIBUNALS. I HATE RETIREMENT.


If you do not challenge, you join "The Mugged Club".

cp8759 and mrmustard are true geniuses. I know my place in the hierarchy of The Three Musketeers. 😊 "The Clinician", "The Gentleman" and "The Showman"

There are "known knowns" which we may never have wished to know. This applies to them. But in the field the idea that there are also "unknown unknowns" doesn't apply as they hide in the aleatoric lottery. I know this is true and need to be prepared knowing the "unknown unknowns" may well apply.

To Socrates from "Hippocrates"
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Re: PCN - Bus Lane - Harrow, Northolt Rd jct Alexandra Ave
« Reply #29 on: »
Quote from: cp8759 on November 01, 2023, 06:42:17 pm
Quote from: Mercdriver on November 01, 2023, 04:43:50 pm
@cp8759 - thanks for posting the camera details.  Does the camera type help or hinder an appeal?
It closes off one possible ground of appeal, but there are many other avenues. The easiest way to win this is to require the council to attend the hearing, if they don't they lose and they don't like turning up so they hardly ever do.

Or they will adduce as evidence ca. 5 certificates, some to do with parking law!
Logged
@Incandescent!

I AM ABLE TO TAKE ON MORE CASES AS A REPRESENTATIVE AT THE LONDON TRIBUNALS. I HATE RETIREMENT.


If you do not challenge, you join "The Mugged Club".

cp8759 and mrmustard are true geniuses. I know my place in the hierarchy of The Three Musketeers. 😊 "The Clinician", "The Gentleman" and "The Showman"

There are "known knowns" which we may never have wished to know. This applies to them. But in the field the idea that there are also "unknown unknowns" doesn't apply as they hide in the aleatoric lottery. I know this is true and need to be prepared knowing the "unknown unknowns" may well apply.

To Socrates from "Hippocrates"
Like Like x 1 View List
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  3. PCN - Bus Lane - Harrow, Northolt Rd jct Alexandra Ave