Author Topic: Parked on double yellow but drove away before being served Pcn on windscreen  (Read 1766 times)

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Hi all

I remember on the 03/07/25 partially parked on kerb on double yellow lines. I was with a disabled passenger so he used his badge and said it’s ok to park like this (my fault really being the driver).

Upon returning to vehicle CEO officer was writing up a Pcn however ceo said I would have been fine with the blue badge on yellows but because I parked with two wheels over the kerb that was the contravention. I personally don’t use a blue badge so I didn’t know. He signalled me to drive off so I did.

Today I received this Pcn via post. I logged online with the details to view evidence there is only 2 pictures and shows no contravention and it’s not clear to see registration. I’ve attached the letter and the 2 pictures.

Do I have a good chance of winning challenge? Can someone help me with drafting please. Also I noted when online in the council Pcn portal it shows informal challenge for windscreen Pcn with the discount offer reapplied if rejected and representation for Pcn served via post but no mention of discount offer reapplied if rejected. This is of course if challenged within the 14 days.

Thanks all.

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Pictures aren't needed for parking PCNs.

The key fact is, did you prevent the PCN from being served on the car or given to you and it seems not if the CEO indicated you could leave.

Can you recall the exact exchange of words?

We know Scotland has introduced a footway parking ban - is t now in force in Wales or maybe just some cities?

You would have been OK if you'd kept on the carriageway and displayed BB and parking clock.
« Last Edit: July 16, 2025, 04:10:21 pm by stamfordman »

I did read ban is not effective in wales yet.

Exact exchange of words was after ceo telling me I would have been just fine on the yellows with blue badge, there was no need to partially park on pavement. I said there is no ticket on my vehicle at the moment can I just drive off right now and he nodded yes with his head and thumbs up with his hand. I thought he was being so nice letting me get off the hook totally.

I should have just stayed on the carriageway I pulled up onto the pavement to make it easy for a lorry or big truck to pass. I can’t believe karma I was helping a friend that day who has health complications. Oh well it’s what it is.

I have a draft ready as follows below but would appreciate any edits, further input and advice. Thanks in advance.

Dear Cardiff Council Parking Services,

I am writing to challenge PCN [insert PCN number] issued to vehicle [your registration].

I have reviewed the evidence provided via your online portal. The two photographs do not show my registration plate at all – it is completely illegible due to glare and image quality. As a result, there is no evidence linking my vehicle to the alleged contravention.

Furthermore, the images do not demonstrate any contravention, as there is no unique identifier to confirm that my vehicle was parked in breach of the restrictions. The Traffic Management Act 2004 and statutory guidance require that a postal PCN is supported by clear evidence. In this case, the evidence is not sufficient to identify the vehicle or support enforcement.

For these reasons, I request that this PCN be cancelled immediately.

Kind regards,
[Your Name]
[Your Address]
[Your Vehicle Registration]

Penalty charge notices – service by post
10.—(1) An enforcement authority may serve a penalty charge notice by post where—

....

(c)a civil enforcement officer had begun to prepare a penalty charge notice for service in accordance with regulation 9, but the vehicle concerned was driven away from the place in which it was stationary before the civil enforcement officer had finished preparing the penalty charge notice or had served it in accordance with regulation 9,

Evidence of contravention
6.—(1) In respect of a parking contravention, a penalty charge must not be imposed except on the basis of—

.... or

(b)information given by a civil enforcement officer as to conduct observed by that officer.


So forget the blurred images etc. etc. arguments. At face value the CEO information is obviously that they observed conduct etc. and began to prepare a PCN.

Your only defence on this point is that a PCN wasn't being prepared for service and this would be consistent with your claim that the CEO effectively forgave the contravention (by engaging in conversation and waving you off) and did not prepare a PCN.



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A trial footway parking ban zone was set up in City Road in 2021 - I presume it's been made permanent.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-57156585

“Your only defence on this point is that a PCN wasn't being prepared for service and this would be consistent with your claim that the CEO effectively forgave the contravention (by engaging in conversation and waving you off) and did not prepare a PCN.”

This makes sense and in turn invalidation of Pcn served via post.

I wonder what the ceo’s notes says on their system, not sure if I can view before challenging?

I know for fact the ceo was genuinely kind to me at that moment. I’m assuming he blurred the picture somehow to help me even tho that doesn’t matter now. Also my car on the road seems 15-20meters ahead of where I actually parked. I think he was trying to cover his own back since he started this Pcn.

Should I just pay the Pcn since I’m trapped and my argument is weak.

Let's face it, the CEO was being mendacious. As far as one can tell from your narrative, you had a conversation with him who appeared to be preparing a PCN, but did not serve it, and said you could drive off. So you drive off with the expectation that the CEO had decided not to serve a PCN, yet one turns up in the post.

The Traffic Management Act 2004 introduced the process for dealing with "driveaways" when a CEO had started to prepare a PCN but the driver drove off, preventing service.  Here, service was not prevented, you spoke to the CEO who had ample opportunity to serve a PCN,  so service of the postal PCN was unlawful. You should therefore submit representations on that basis, namely the CEO was not prevented from serving the PCN, as you drove off when the CEO said you could.
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Yes I’m starting to believe ceo was mendacious unless he was new on the job or something.

I really do want to submit representations as you and Anderson mention ceo was not prevented from serving Pcn and this is my only option of defence alresdy mentioned by Anderson.

I’m guessing there is no way to view ceo notes unless representations are submitted ?

The Letter Tells the CEO’s Account it says:
“The Civil Enforcement Officer observed your vehicle parked in contravention, began preparing a penalty charge notice, but before it could be served you drove away. As a result, the PCN is being served by post under Regulation 10…” This means the CEO’s notes almost certainly say exactly that.
(The letter is basically quoting from the CEO’s official log or pro-forma notes.)

It all comes down to the fact that the law is written so that the CEO’s word is enough unless you can prove otherwise. Am I correct to assume If I challenge this Pcn, my ONLY procedural defence will be the ceo bodycam? I don’t have any evidence. Body cam evidence is obviously going to be deleted since ceo allowed me to go? I mean a mendacious person will do this naturally.


1.CEO didn’t start PCN (no proof/just your word) Very low success. Council/adjudicator will believe CEO’s notes

2.CEO notes are vague/inconsistent,
Moderate success. Only if you spot an error or contradiction

3.PCN Photographs blurry/no evidence, Very low success. Not required, CEO evidence alone is enough

4.Mitigation/discretion. Very low success.
Only for emergencies or exceptional reasons

I appreciate everyone’s time in reading and helping me on this, thank you so much guys. Im finding it difficult to decide based on the above summary and my only option is 1.

Still got some time so will be wise to think more.

You are over-thinking this. Just draft a polite, short challenge putting your side of what happened, and saying there there are no grounds to serve the postal PCN as service of a PCN was not prevented.

I do have a draft already to be edited accordingly before I submit it as below:

Dear Cardiff Council,

I challenge PCN [number] issued to [vehicle reg] on [date]. Regulation 10 allows a PCN by post only if the CEO had begun preparing the notice and was prevented from serving it because the vehicle drove away.

In my case, the CEO had not started preparing a PCN. I spoke directly to the CEO and asked if I could leave; the CEO agreed, with no warning or indication that a notice was being prepared. This does not satisfy Regulation 10, and the postal PCN is not valid.

Please provide a copy of the CEO’s notes and any body-worn video.

Yours sincerely,
[Your Name]

I’m just using up the allowed time to see if there is any other possibilities of input. What do you think even if I submit the above representation compared to summary 1?
CEO didn’t start PCN (no proof/just your word) Very low success. Council/adjudicator will believe CEO’s notes

I would change the second paragraph to:

In my case, the CEO had ample opportunity to serve a PCN on the car or hand it to me. Indeed, I spoke to the CEO and asked if I could leave; the CEO agreed, and even pointed out that parking fully on the carriageway with a blue badge is allowed there. He gave no indication that a notice was being prepared. This does not satisfy Regulation 10, and the postal PCN is not valid.

And leave out the bit about notes and video. If they reject and you go to the tribunal you can speak to the adjudicator and they will usually find for you if they can tell you are honest and truthful.
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Hi all,

I have received a reply from the council and my above challenge was rejected. Copy pasted below:

NOTICE OF REJECTION OF REPRESENTATIONS
The Traffic Management Act 2004
Date of Notice: 19 August 2025
Vehicle Registration: ……….
PCN Number: ………..Issued on: 15 July 2025
Contravention: Parked with one or more wheels on or over a footway or any part of a
road other than a carriageway
Date of Contravention: 03 July 2025 Time of Contravention: 20:35
Location: City Road
I have considered your representations received in respect of the above Penalty Charge
Notice. On this occasion I am satisfied that there are insufficient reasons to cancel the
Penalty Charge. This letter explains the details of the penalty issued, my reasons for
rejecting your representations and your options.
Take a moment to carefully read through ALL the sections in this letter (listed
below) before you decide what to do next.
Under the Traffic Management Act 2004 the above vehicle was served with a Penalty
Charge Notice for being parked with one or more wheels on or over a footway or any part
of a road other than a carriageway.
I am satisfied that at this location there are regulatory signs at the start and end of the
restriction, and that there were clear double yellow lines present on the section of
carriageway over which you left your vehicle. The onus remains firmly with the motorist to
comply with any restrictions in place and to park with consideration to other motorists and
pedestrians.
I have noted your comments and can advise that those dropping off or picking up blue
badge holders are permitted to park over a double yellow line restrictions, as long as no
accompanying loading restrictions are also in force and the blue badge and time clock set
at the time of arrival are clearly displayed. However at the time the contravention was
observed your vehicle was also parked partially over the pedestrian footway and this is not
permitted.
Footway parking is not only inconvenient and dangerous for pedestrians, in particular
wheelchair users, those pushing prams, and/or walking with children, but also causes
structural damage to the pavement and underlying infrastructure. Therefore parking on the
pavement is not permitted at any time, and this includes those displaying a valid blue
badge.
The booklet which accompanies the badge advises ‘ Do not park on footways(pavements)
that cause obstruction to pedestrians.’ And also ‘Do not park on a pavement unless signs
permit it.’ I am satisfied that signage at this location indicated that pavement parking was
not permitted, and consequently that this Penalty Charge Notice was issued correctly.
I have also noted the details of the conversation you state took place with the issuing
Officer. I am however satisfied that the case notes indicate the vehicle was first observed
in this position at 20.35hrs, and the PCN was initiated at this same time. The driver then
returned to the vehicle, refused the PCN and drove away. I am therefore satisfied that
there has been no procedural impropriety in this instance.
In view of the above, the decision has been made not to cancel the Penalty Charge Notice.
The amount of £35.00 will be accepted only if payment is made within 21 days from the
date of service of this letter. Once this period has expired the full Penalty Charge of £70.00
will then be due.
The date of service will be two working days after the date of issue of this letter, unless
proven otherwise.
Please note that a copy of this decision notice has been emailed to you at the address that
was provided by you, when you submitted your initial appeal to the Council.

It seems to me they are avoiding the fact of an invalid postal pcn under regulation 10? I’m not comfortable with tpt appeal they are so bad as a whole they rejected a previous appeal of mine based solely on the fact that a contravention did occur.

Thanks in advance for any thoughts of advice at this point ?

This part is pure cows muck “The driver then returned to the vehicle, refused the PCN and drove away. I am therefore satisfied that
there has been no procedural impropriety in this instance.”

I clearly asked him if I could drive off since no ticket on my vehicle and he nodded yes with thumbs up. I said ok thanks and drove off. This will ONLY be visible on the bodycam if it was recording. Quite possible his thumbs up would show in it.