3. Newham 26, parked more than 50cm and not within designated space - Gallions Road, London E16 2QN
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Newham 26, parked more than 50cm and not within designated space - Gallions Road, London E16 2QN
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Hello Everyone,

I'm writing in regards a PENALTY CHARGE NOTICE I received on my windscreen for "Parking in a special enforcement area more than 50cm from the edge of the carriageway and not within a designated parking place".

I will begin with the fact that I'm very late with my actions. The PCN was issued on 14/01/2024 then on 15/04/2024 I received a letter giving me 14 days to pay before further action is taken by the County Court. I haven't responded or actioned at all to anything.

If it's not too late, I believe I have ground to appeal because there was fencing next to the curb so it was physically impossible to park less than 50cm from the edge of the carriageway. As well as that, there were no designated parking spaces marked, nor any signage at all.

Please see below, the PCN, the 14 day letter, the photos the CEO took and the photos I took.

REG NUMBER: DX16 UDN

PCN: PCN

14-Day Letter: 14-Day LETTER

CEO Photos: CEO Photos

My Photos: My Photos


Location is here: LOCATION

I'll be very grateful for any advice.

Kind Regards,
raddic
« Last Edit: April 30, 2024, 09:10:10 pm by raddic »
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Re: Newham 26, parked more than 50cm and not within designated space - Gallions Road, London E16 2QN
« Reply #1 on: »
As I understand your narrative, you have totally ignored the PCN, and also the Notice to Owner which would have been sent to the name and address on the V5 Registration Certificate for the vehicle, plus you have ignored the Charge Certificate as well, which puts the penalty at £195. True ?

YOU haven't mentioned the Notice to Owner, or the Charge Certificate documents. Did you receive these ?

If true you now have no option to submit any representations at all, only the payment option. This is because there are fixed periods on the PCN, and also on the Notice to Owner, to submit representations, but you haven't submitted anything.   Any particular reason you have ignored all their documents ?

Their letter you have posted is not an enforcement document within the legal enforcement process, (Parliamentary Act, plus regulations). It is an unofficial document inviting you to pay the £195 before they register the debt at the Traffic Enforcement Centre. This adds £9 to the amount, making it £204. They will then issue an Order for Recovery which can be paid, but there is then a back-stop process to cover cases like PCN/Owner not received. However this doesn't seem to fit your circumstances.

Really, if you can tell us why you have done nothing to either pay or submit representations it would help us to see if there is anything that could get the process reverted.
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Re: Newham 26, parked more than 50cm and not within designated space - Gallions Road, London E16 2QN
« Reply #2 on: »
Hi Incandescent,

Thank you for your thorough reply.

I haven't received a Notice to Owner nor a Charge Certificate!

I haven't been able to take any action on this penalty because of serious health troubles that hit me around that time, requiring me to seek expensive treatment abroad. Simply said, I didn't have the mental nor physical strength to challenge the PCN up until now.

I am better now, recovering well so thought I'd see if there's anything at all that can be done. If not, then I'll just pay up.

Many thanks
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Re: Newham 26, parked more than 50cm and not within designated space - Gallions Road, London E16 2QN
« Reply #3 on: »
Well, if you can get this reverted to a point in the process where you can appeal, then I think there's a strong argument to be made that the edge of the carriageway was (at the time) the metal barriers and you were within 50cm of them, but you've missed all the opportunities the legal process gives you to make that argument.

Giving us a timeline of ALL the documents you have received (with scans) would be a good start.
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Re: Newham 26, parked more than 50cm and not within designated space - Gallions Road, London E16 2QN
« Reply #4 on: »
Quote from: Grant Urismo on April 30, 2024, 10:03:30 pm
Well, if you can get this reverted to a point in the process where you can appeal, then I think there's a strong argument to be made that the edge of the carriageway was (at the time) the metal barriers and you were within 50cm of them, but you've missed all the opportunities the legal process gives you to make that argument.

Giving us a timeline of ALL the documents you have received (with scans) would be a good start.

Hi GRant Urisimo, thanks for the reply.

I only have the PCN(from my windshield) and The Letter, both of which I've uploaded and can be found in my original post above.
The PCN was issued on 14/01/24 05:00
The letter is dated 15/04/24

Thanks
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Re: Newham 26, parked more than 50cm and not within designated space - Gallions Road, London E16 2QN
« Reply #5 on: »
So, from your narrative, it seems that having received the PCN, you then suffered severe ill health, necessitating a prolonged absence from the UK, and a period afterwards of convalescence, with your recovery only complete after <date> when you became aware of the forgotten PCN.

When you returned to the UK, was it to a new address ?

Reason to ask is that the Notice to Owner, and the Charge Certificate, are sent to the name and address on the V5 Registration Certificate for the vehicle. Can you say what has happened in this regard. Do you still have the vehicle ?
Based on your ill-health, which I would hope you are able to confirm with some documentation, I think there is a good chance you will be able to revert the matter back to the PCN stage, at which point you can pay or submit representations.

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Re: Newham 26, parked more than 50cm and not within designated space - Gallions Road, London E16 2QN
« Reply #6 on: »
Well this is a truly ridiculous PCN which we can easily beat on appeal, but first we need to get things procedurally back on track.

@raddic please read the guide at https://www.ftla.uk/announcements/charge-certificate-cases-under-the-traffic-management-act-2004-no-original-pcn/ and confirm whether everything you need to do is clear. It doesn't matter where in the world you are as long as you have access to the internet, the process can be completed from anywhere.

Once that part is done and the PCN has reverted to £130 on the council website we'll know it's an the NTO stage again, at that point you can give me a letter of authority and I can sort out the representations on your behalf.
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I practice law in the Traffic Penalty Tribunal, London Tribunals, the First-tier tribunal for Scotland, and the Traffic Penalty Tribunal for Northern Ireland, but I am not a solicitor or a barrister. Notwithstanding this, I voluntarily apply the cab rank rule. I am a member of the Society of Professional McKenzie Friends, my membership number is FM193 and I abide by the SPMF service standards.

Quote from: 'Gumph' date='Thu, 19 Jan 2023 - 10:23'
cp8759 is, indeed, a Wizard of the First Order
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Re: Newham 26, parked more than 50cm and not within designated space - Gallions Road, London E16 2QN
« Reply #7 on: »
Quote from: cp8759 on May 01, 2024, 10:23:45 am
Well this is a truly ridiculous PCN which we can easily beat on appeal, but first we need to get things procedurally back on track.

@raddic please read the guide at https://www.ftla.uk/announcements/charge-certificate-cases-under-the-traffic-management-act-2004-no-original-pcn/ and confirm whether everything you need to do is clear. It doesn't matter where in the world you are as long as you have access to the internet, the process can be completed from anywhere.

Once that part is done and the PCN has reverted to £130 on the council website we'll know it's an the NTO stage again, at that point you can give me a letter of authority and I can sort out the representations on your behalf.

Wow! Thank you!

You just made things very simple for me and I can't thank you enough.

I read through the guide and everything is clear. I only have a couple of doubts, the guide says I am not the 'Applicant', does that mean I should leave the Applicant field blank or enter the name of the Enforcement Authority there? As far as I understand it's the latter.

My other doubt is with the waiting a week after the 14 day period and making sure the debt has been registered with TEC, and that's only because you didn't mention it in your post. The 14 days have passed a few days ago, on the 29th of April.
Do I need to wait a week or am I good to proceed with the form?

Many thanks for the straightforward answer!
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Re: Newham 26, parked more than 50cm and not within designated space - Gallions Road, London E16 2QN
« Reply #8 on: »
OP, IMO, two questions at the centre of this:

1. Did 'You did.. receive the postal Penalty Charge Notice or Notice to Owner in question? '

2. Do the construction barriers form the 'edge of the carriageway' for the purposes of s85 TMA.

1. This is your decision.
2. A legal question IMO.
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Re: Newham 26, parked more than 50cm and not within designated space - Gallions Road, London E16 2QN
« Reply #9 on: »
Quote from: raddic on May 01, 2024, 05:58:33 pm
Quote from: cp8759 on May 01, 2024, 10:23:45 am
Well this is a truly ridiculous PCN which we can easily beat on appeal, but first we need to get things procedurally back on track.

@raddic please read the guide at https://www.ftla.uk/announcements/charge-certificate-cases-under-the-traffic-management-act-2004-no-original-pcn/ and confirm whether everything you need to do is clear. It doesn't matter where in the world you are as long as you have access to the internet, the process can be completed from anywhere.

Once that part is done and the PCN has reverted to £130 on the council website we'll know it's an the NTO stage again, at that point you can give me a letter of authority and I can sort out the representations on your behalf.

Wow! Thank you!

You just made things very simple for me and I can't thank you enough.

I read through the guide and everything is clear. I only have a couple of doubts, the guide says I am not the 'Applicant', does that mean I should leave the Applicant field blank or enter the name of the Enforcement Authority there? As far as I understand it's the latter.

My other doubt is with the waiting a week after the 14 day period and making sure the debt has been registered with TEC, and that's only because you didn't mention it in your post. The 14 days have passed a few days ago, on the 29th of April.
Do I need to wait a week or am I good to proceed with the form?

Many thanks for the straightforward answer!
You are not good to proceed with submission of your WS until they have registered the debt at the Traffic Enforcement Centre. When they do this, the amount owing increases to £195 + £9 = £204.  The £9 is the TEC registration fee. They also then send out an Order for Recovery, but as cp8759 says, you don't need to receive this, you just need to know when the debt is registered and that is known when the amount owing reaches £204.
They may not register the debt immediately on the expiry of the 14 days stated in their letter, and if you submit the WS too early, (before debt registration), TEC will reject it.

As to who is the "Applicant" on the form, it is the enforcing authority, so you enter "Newham Council".  You are the Respondent.
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Re: Newham 26, parked more than 50cm and not within designated space - Gallions Road, London E16 2QN
« Reply #10 on: »
Quote from: Incandescent on May 01, 2024, 08:11:50 pm
Quote from: raddic on May 01, 2024, 05:58:33 pm
Quote from: cp8759 on May 01, 2024, 10:23:45 am
Well this is a truly ridiculous PCN which we can easily beat on appeal, but first we need to get things procedurally back on track.

@raddic please read the guide at https://www.ftla.uk/announcements/charge-certificate-cases-under-the-traffic-management-act-2004-no-original-pcn/ and confirm whether everything you need to do is clear. It doesn't matter where in the world you are as long as you have access to the internet, the process can be completed from anywhere.

Once that part is done and the PCN has reverted to £130 on the council website we'll know it's an the NTO stage again, at that point you can give me a letter of authority and I can sort out the representations on your behalf.

Wow! Thank you!

You just made things very simple for me and I can't thank you enough.

I read through the guide and everything is clear. I only have a couple of doubts, the guide says I am not the 'Applicant', does that mean I should leave the Applicant field blank or enter the name of the Enforcement Authority there? As far as I understand it's the latter.

My other doubt is with the waiting a week after the 14 day period and making sure the debt has been registered with TEC, and that's only because you didn't mention it in your post. The 14 days have passed a few days ago, on the 29th of April.
Do I need to wait a week or am I good to proceed with the form?

Many thanks for the straightforward answer!
You are not good to proceed with submission of your WS until they have registered the debt at the Traffic Enforcement Centre. When they do this, the amount owing increases to £195 + £9 = £204.  The £9 is the TEC registration fee. They also then send out an Order for Recovery, but as cp8759 says, you don't need to receive this, you just need to know when the debt is registered and that is known when the amount owing reaches £204.
They may not register the debt immediately on the expiry of the 14 days stated in their letter, and if you submit the WS too early, (before debt registration), TEC will reject it.

As to who is the "Applicant" on the form, it is the enforcing authority, so you enter "Newham Council".  You are the Respondent.


Thank you for explaining! All is clear now.

I'll be checking regularly with TEC to find out when it's been registered.

Many thanks to all that replied and helped!
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Re: Newham 26, parked more than 50cm and not within designated space - Gallions Road, London E16 2QN
« Reply #11 on: »
@raddic please note I have been informed the debt registration fee has now increased to £10, so when the debt is registered the amount due will go up to £205 rather than £204.

Also when the debt is registered please could you check the amount due on the council website? If it turns out that this is correctly shown on the Newham website I will update the guide accordingly.
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I practice law in the Traffic Penalty Tribunal, London Tribunals, the First-tier tribunal for Scotland, and the Traffic Penalty Tribunal for Northern Ireland, but I am not a solicitor or a barrister. Notwithstanding this, I voluntarily apply the cab rank rule. I am a member of the Society of Professional McKenzie Friends, my membership number is FM193 and I abide by the SPMF service standards.

Quote from: 'Gumph' date='Thu, 19 Jan 2023 - 10:23'
cp8759 is, indeed, a Wizard of the First Order
Re: Newham 26, parked more than 50cm and not within designated space - Gallions Road, London E16 2QN
« Reply #12 on: »
@cp8759

Thanks for the heads-up!

I am checking the Newham Council website as well.

Will update this thread with all my observations.


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Re: Newham 26, parked more than 50cm and not within designated space - Gallions Road, London E16 2QN
« Reply #13 on: »
Quote from: cp8759 on May 03, 2024, 12:06:56 am
@raddic please note I have been informed the debt registration fee has now increased to £10, so when the debt is registered the amount due will go up to £205 rather than £204.

Also when the debt is registered please could you check the amount due on the council website? If it turns out that this is correctly shown on the Newham website I will update the guide accordingly.

Hi @cp8759 I just spoke with TEC on the phone, the debt has been registered. I also checked the Newham Council website and it is correctly shown there too.

I filled out the form and emailed it. Now waiting for the automated reply.

Many thanks for your help!
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Re: Newham 26, parked more than 50cm and not within designated space - Gallions Road, London E16 2QN
« Reply #14 on: »
You should have had an automated acknowledgment within a minutes or so, if you haven't got it you might want to send it again.
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I practice law in the Traffic Penalty Tribunal, London Tribunals, the First-tier tribunal for Scotland, and the Traffic Penalty Tribunal for Northern Ireland, but I am not a solicitor or a barrister. Notwithstanding this, I voluntarily apply the cab rank rule. I am a member of the Society of Professional McKenzie Friends, my membership number is FM193 and I abide by the SPMF service standards.

Quote from: 'Gumph' date='Thu, 19 Jan 2023 - 10:23'
cp8759 is, indeed, a Wizard of the First Order
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