3. London Congestion Charge - Unpaid
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London Congestion Charge - Unpaid
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This is a duplicate of a post on Pepipoo: http://forums.pepipoo.com/index.php?showtopic=152134
I have actually already sent TFL an informal message based on the response on Pepipoo from Incandescent
Summary (Short Version): I did not update my Autopay details with new van registration, so have received a PCN.
Full Version: I am a sameday courier. I generally avoid going into London, but sometimes do. I have Autopay set up for the London Congestion Charge Zone. In July my Timing Chain failed (less than 114k miles on the clock, and only 20 months old - no Warranty, no goodwill support from Vauxhall - it's a write off) - but that's a different story! I have been off the road/work for 3 months and am now back on the road. On 10th November 2023 I went into Central London to make a delivery. I believed I had updated my Autopay details, but hadn't (I vaguely remember trying to do it, but the autopay site didn't recognise the new vehicle registration details, so I was unable to proceed - I intended to go back to it). Inevitably I have now (correctly) received a PCN.
I believe that for a first offence, TFL are quite generous/accomodating? In that case, my best option is to contact TFL, explain my story, and hope for clemency? How would I go about that, submit a formal representation, or approach them more informally? None of the options for representation match the reason I wish to appeal.
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Re: London Congestion Charge - Unpaid
« Reply #1 on: »
Call TFL tomorrow on 0343 222 3333 and ask for the video, they will send you a DVD in the post and put the penalty on hold while you wait.

In the meantime, please tell us exactly where you believe you entered the zone.

If it was here, then the next step is to go back and check if the sign is still in place, and you want to check this advance warning sign on the left.
« Last Edit: November 21, 2023, 10:11:40 pm by cp8759 »
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I practice law in the Traffic Penalty Tribunal, London Tribunals, the First-tier tribunal for Scotland, and the Traffic Penalty Tribunal for Northern Ireland, but I am not a solicitor or a barrister. Notwithstanding this, I voluntarily apply the cab rank rule. I am a member of the Society of Professional McKenzie Friends, my membership number is FM193 and I abide by the SPMF service standards.

Quote from: 'Gumph' date='Thu, 19 Jan 2023 - 10:23'
cp8759 is, indeed, a Wizard of the First Order
Re: London Congestion Charge - Unpaid
« Reply #2 on: »
Thankyou.

I will phone TFL tomorrow.

You are correct in your identification of where I entered the Congestion Zone. I'm not sure when I will be anywhere near there again, but if I am, I'll make sure to check it out (and get some photos).
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Re: London Congestion Charge - Unpaid
« Reply #3 on: »
I phoned them today - a bit later than planned! (partially it's difficult to find the time to call them during working hours and partially it slipped my mind when I had a few minutes!)

They told me that there is no video available of the PCN. My understanding was that they were implying that there is never video available for Congestion Charge. (actually I notice I called a different number to that which you quoted - 0343 222 2222 - don't know if that is significant or if I ended up in the same place)
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Re: London Congestion Charge - Unpaid
« Reply #4 on: »
Call the number I gave you please. We've never had a case where someone has simple been unable to get the video, I suspect you just got through to the wrong people. We've got a congestion charge video in the past 2 or 3 months with no fuss at all.
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I practice law in the Traffic Penalty Tribunal, London Tribunals, the First-tier tribunal for Scotland, and the Traffic Penalty Tribunal for Northern Ireland, but I am not a solicitor or a barrister. Notwithstanding this, I voluntarily apply the cab rank rule. I am a member of the Society of Professional McKenzie Friends, my membership number is FM193 and I abide by the SPMF service standards.

Quote from: 'Gumph' date='Thu, 19 Jan 2023 - 10:23'
cp8759 is, indeed, a Wizard of the First Order
Re: London Congestion Charge - Unpaid
« Reply #5 on: »
Understood. Will do.
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Re: London Congestion Charge - Unpaid
« Reply #6 on: »
I have just called them using the xxx3333 number. I'm pretty sure I got through to the same department as yesterday. They told me that there is no video footage available for entry into the Congestion Charge Zone. So there has been consistency in what they said to me yesterday and today.

Maybe a new policy since last 2/3 months when video was last successfully requested?
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Re: London Congestion Charge - Unpaid
« Reply #7 on: »
You might have to ask for the footage as part of the representations then. That is of course dependant on the signage situation.
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I practice law in the Traffic Penalty Tribunal, London Tribunals, the First-tier tribunal for Scotland, and the Traffic Penalty Tribunal for Northern Ireland, but I am not a solicitor or a barrister. Notwithstanding this, I voluntarily apply the cab rank rule. I am a member of the Society of Professional McKenzie Friends, my membership number is FM193 and I abide by the SPMF service standards.

Quote from: 'Gumph' date='Thu, 19 Jan 2023 - 10:23'
cp8759 is, indeed, a Wizard of the First Order
Re: London Congestion Charge - Unpaid
« Reply #8 on: »
It is highly improbable that I will get up to London before 4th December.

Should I call them (today) and explain the situation and ask for clemency if I pay the £15 given I have an autopay account? (or is that a no hoper) Failing that, should I pay the discounted amount?
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Re: London Congestion Charge - Unpaid
« Reply #9 on: »
They won't accept a plea for clemency, and they certainly won't accept it over the phone.

However if you make a plea for discretion in a formal representation, that should see the discount extended by several weeks, which hopefully gives you enough time to check the signage.
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I practice law in the Traffic Penalty Tribunal, London Tribunals, the First-tier tribunal for Scotland, and the Traffic Penalty Tribunal for Northern Ireland, but I am not a solicitor or a barrister. Notwithstanding this, I voluntarily apply the cab rank rule. I am a member of the Society of Professional McKenzie Friends, my membership number is FM193 and I abide by the SPMF service standards.

Quote from: 'Gumph' date='Thu, 19 Jan 2023 - 10:23'
cp8759 is, indeed, a Wizard of the First Order
Re: London Congestion Charge - Unpaid
« Reply #10 on: »
Thanks, I'll submit a representation.

I simply want to lay it out as I've laid it out here?

i.e. I have an autopay account, was set up for my old van which died on me, had 3 months off the road, got back on the road in a new van, thought I had updated the autopay account with my new reg but only found out I hadn't when the PCN arrived.
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Re: London Congestion Charge - Unpaid
« Reply #11 on: »
One would expect autopay account holders to be treated better, as having an account shows committment to paying and not trying to avoid payment. How long have you been an account holder ? If a long time, it's worth mentioning this in your reps. 

PS : I hope you succeed !
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Re: London Congestion Charge - Unpaid
« Reply #12 on: »
Thanks. My Account is nearly 2 years old.
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Re: London Congestion Charge - Unpaid
« Reply #13 on: »
Quote from: HoundDog on November 30, 2023, 06:17:01 am
Thanks. My Account is nearly 2 years old.
Well worth putting this in your reps, also mentioning that this is the first time in the two years you have held the Autopay account that there have been any problem with your account, (I assume this is true),  and ask that on this ocasion they cancel the PCN.
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Re: London Congestion Charge - Unpaid
« Reply #14 on: »
Yes, I believe that is true, however wouldn't bet my house on it! (I have an atrocious memory!!!)

A little bit of a development today. As I mentioned in the opening post, I had sent them an "informal message". It seems that they have taken that as a formal representation and I received the response today.

In brief, it seems to be asking why I have still not added that vehicle to my autopay account. Apparently I have added it to the "quick manage list" but not the "autopay" part. I genuinely didn't understand that distinction and had believed I had added it (after the original PCN). Narrow escape as I do not believe I have been into the Zone since the PCN. I have now added it to the autopay list.

Reading between the lines of their request, I am hopeful that they will be sympathetic for a first offence where the vehicle is now on the account!

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