Author Topic: Lewisham, 12s - parked without a valid virtual permit, Lewisham Park/Chiddingstone House  (Read 522 times)

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I'll look at this later. There's no rush with an NTO - it's dated 26 May?

Yep dated 26th May so plenty of time. Thanks for your help.

OP, if you assert that you parked once only then the 'second' PCN is a shoo-in cancellation: 'penalty exceeded the amount applicable in the circumstances of the case'.

Why?

PCN 1 - not seen, but issued by CEO L601 at 11.13, it says so in the NTO;
PCN 2 - you've posted which carries the all-important 'first seen' time of 11.07.

It therefore follows that PCN2 is unlawful because a PCN had already been served at 11.13! You cannot start obs for PCN2, then issue a different PCN at 11.13 and then issue another at 11.17.

So, PCN2- the original subject of this thread is effectively dead, you just have to submit reps as above.

So, what about PCN1? I would suggest similar grounds.

Perhaps...

Dear Sir,
PCNs ********* (PCN1) and *********(PCN2)

I refer to the above issued, according to the authority, by the same CEO(L601) as follows:

PCN1 - 11.13. I did not find this on my car neither is it in evidence in the
              CEO's photos of PCN2.

PCN2 - Issued at 11.17 but first observed at 11.07.

I am making formal representations in respect of both on the grounds that the penalty exceeded the amount applicable in the circumstances of the case, circumstances which are evidenced by the authority's NTOs.

In respect of PCN2, the authority are claiming that CEO L601 observed the car     at 11.07 then at 11.13 decided to issue a different PCN(PCN1) for £130 for a separate and parallel reason(my car was parked once only) while still observing my car for PCN2 and then at 11.17 decided to issue this PCN at 11.17.

So, PCN ********* (PCN2) issued at 11.17 must be cancelled because only 4 minutes prior the CEO had issued PCN*********(PCN1) for the same contravention.

And PCN1 must be cancelled because the CEO only formed their belief that a penalty was payable at 11.17, 4 minutes after the penalty was demanded.

Perhaps the authority are able to work out what CEO L601 was doing, but as far as both PCNs are concerned and your demands for penalties from me I suggest that a veil is drawn over the events and that by return you confirm their cancellation.


Hi All,

Mixed results here.

The additionally issued PCN has been cancelled, citing a "processing error":
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1iwON7FOTut7S54Q1mPtqYsVU99NiTUtb/view?usp=sharing

The "original" PCN has been upheld, and they've just repeated the original convention:
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1C2G_XDV2jNs8WBf_mytZBrgoys0OkD44/view?usp=sharing
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1UReVQdNxkFsfALO2-Vo_dPPnpbmHYVi1/view?usp=sharing

Do you think it is worth going to the adjudicator, or has this become a lost cause? Frustratingly they don't actually say what the penalty charge now is, and they've left a highlighted placeholder for what it will increase to...

Thanks in advance.

They are demanding the full penalty so nothing to lose by going to the tribunal.

What were your reps for this PCN. They don't look as though they were considered.

They have left some blank template at the end of the letter, which can be added to the appeal.

You should ask for a telephone or Microsoft Teams heading so you can speak to the adjudicator.

The reasoning set out by HC Andersen still holds and there is also the issue that you paid just 2 mins after the PCN time given the hospital issue.




« Last Edit: July 25, 2025, 03:35:43 pm by stamfordman »

Hi, my rep was as below, and as confirmed receipt by Lewisham:

PENALTY CHARGE NOTICE ZY12707172

REGISTRATION NUMBER LX66UOJ

DATE OF CONTRAVENTION Tue , 22 Apr 2025 11:17

CURRENT AMOUNT OUTSTANDING £160.00


Dear Sir or Madam,

Online challenge for ZY12707172

On the grounds of:
The PCN exceeded the amount applicable

Further explanation :
I am requesting that PCN ZY12707172 is cancelled, on the basis that the penalty has exceed the amount
applicable in the circumstances of the case.

CEO L601 issued a different and separate PCN (ZY12707161) at 11:13, as documented in the Notice To Owner
received for that PCN.

Notable there was no evidence left for this PCN on the vehicle at the time, as is shown in
the photos taken for PCN ZY12707172.

The PCN in question (ZY12707172) has a first seen time of 11:07. It therefore follows this PCN (ZY12707172) is
unlawful because a PCN (ZY12707161) had already been served at 11.13.

The CEO cannot start observations for
PCN ZY12707172 (11:07), then issue a different PCN (ZY12707161) at 11:13, before then issuing the PCN
ZY12707172 at 11:17.

I attach copies of the Notice To Owners issues for these PCNs, with the times of issue. Again, there was no
evidence provided for the PCN first issued (ZY12707161), either on the vehicle, or digitally when viewing the
PCN

So at tribunal give the original context, the evidence that genuine attempts at payment were made, the topic of the additionally issued PCN, and the lack of clarity in the most recently supplied documents?