Author Topic: LB of Richmond Upon Thames, Code 622 Parked with one or more wheels on footpath, Wyndham Cres  (Read 592 times)

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Hi, thank you in advance for your help.

Today, I parked in a marked bay on the footpath (yes, over the line of the footpath) but within the length of the bay so that cars could still pass up and down the road. However, to my surprise, I received a parking ticket when I returned to my car 30 minutes later.

I have previously spoken to the traffic warden who usually monitors the road, and he mentioned that he would not issue a ticket for parking like that, as the road is quite narrow when a car is also parked on the footpath parallel to mine. This suggests he has either changed his approach or that someone else was on duty today.

Also, not sure if this makes any difference but the road is actually london borough of hounslow but I got a pcn from London borough of Richmond upon thames.

Could you please advise if I have any grounds for an appeal, and if so, what I should write?

I have attached the location & some photos I took at the time.

Thank you again.

https://imgur.com/a/KG6WuMy

https://maps.app.goo.gl/J9EFj3qYrLj89reY8
« Last Edit: March 15, 2025, 12:42:30 am by got_a_username »

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Sign allows part off-carriageway parking in marked bays, but these are very worn.

However, if that's your car in the photos, you can see bay markings at the back of it, and you are beyond these, hence the PCN.

I have looked up the postcode. It is within Richmond. Your best bet is to argue 'legitimate expectation' i.e. that you have parked this way for years without a pcn and this was ok as per a traffic warden who you had chatted to.
I help you pro bono (for free). I now ask that a £40 donation is made to the North London Hospice before I take over your case. I have an 85% success rate across 2,000 PCNs but some PCNs can't be beaten and I will tell you if your case looks hopeless before asking you to donate.

Fair enough, I guess I have to try my luck.

Thank you

I suggest you add to these informal reps something along the lines of:

As regards the detail of the contravention, you assume that this occurred because part of your car was not within the markings. Be this as it may, the markings themselves do not create the permitted parking as such, their function is to delineate areas prescribed under a resolution passed by the council under s15(4) of the GLC(General Powers) Act 1974. Therefore it is necessary for the authority to consult this in order to be satisfied that the markings comply with the resolution's provisions and that there has been a contravention. You should appreciate a copy the this provision with any rejection.

Appreicate the response! @H C Andersen

Would you add/change anything to the below appeal response?

On the day in question, I parked my car in a marked bay on the footpath. While I acknowledge that part of my car was over the line of the footpath, the car was still within the length of the bay, leaving sufficient space for other vehicles to pass freely along the road.

I was surprised to receive this PCN because I have previously discussed this specific parking arrangement with the traffic warden who regularly monitors the road. He assured me that no ticket would be issued under such circumstances, as the road is quite narrow and this form of parking ensures better access. This indicates either a change in approach or that someone else was on duty that day.

Furthermore, regarding the alleged contravention, I believe this occurred because part of my vehicle was outside the designated markings. However, it is worth noting that the markings themselves do not establish permitted parking; their purpose is to delineate areas prescribed under a resolution passed by the council, as stipulated under section 15(4) of the Greater London Council (General Powers) Act 1974.

To confirm the validity of this PCN, I respectfully request that the council consult the relevant resolution to ensure that the markings comply with its provisions and that an actual contravention has occurred. I also request a copy of this resolution be provided should my appeal be rejected.

Thank you for taking the time to review my appeal. I trust that you will carefully consider the points raised, and I am hopeful for a positive resolution.

Seems fine. There are other posters who are adept at obtaining resolutions - they're not state secrets - and so whether they supply to you or not you might make progress by other channels anyway.
« Last Edit: March 18, 2025, 05:55:43 pm by H C Andersen »

No problem, i don't really know where else to try so will have to just give it a shot.

Furthermore, regarding the alleged contravention, I believe this occurred because part of my vehicle was outside the designated markings. However, it is worth noting that the markings themselves do not establish permitted parking; their purpose is to delineate areas prescribed under a resolution passed by the council, as stipulated under section 15(4) of the Greater London Council (General Powers) Act 1974.

Not sure this is right. My understanding is the bay markings may be an invention by the council in a street where the footway ban has been disapplied by resolution. The bays are either then established by a traffic order or often as we see just paint, as I suspect here, resolution or no resolution.
« Last Edit: March 19, 2025, 01:06:07 pm by stamfordman »

IMO, a traffic order creates parking places which, in this case, would have to be signed. None is signed as required. The 'in marked bays' sign conveys a resolution to the effect that parking on the footway is limited. These are quite prevalent where there are vehicle access crossovers and where the passable part of the footway needs to be protected for pedestrians.

As far as I am aware, footway parking markings only have to be applied on the footway, they are not required on the carriageway for obvious reasons, whereas parking places created under a traffic order must be marked in full.

Yes I see what you're saying. I don't think we've seen a resolution though that applies only to marked bays. I thought resolutions were blankets for a street/area. CP would know better.

Here a tack is also how well the footway is marked for such bays.

Thank you, i will try and add that in somewhere

Post a draft here first.

This case could be useful.

----------

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1OHv5WtqKfsGDTgUuLZ906DBJZwS9TDG3/view

2190249269

Having heard the Appellant in person I entirely accept his evidence that his
vehicle had broken down. He pushed it off the carriageway in the dark and
as a result of the worn state of the bay markings did not realise that
approximately a quarter of his vehicle was outside them. Having given the
matter some thought I am unable to go so far as to say that the principle of
de minimis applies here; and the Council is correct in that the legislation
contains no exemption for broken down vehicles.
Nevertheless the combination of the circumstances clearly amounts to very
strong mitigation and I am therefore adjourning this case in the hope that
the Council will consider it appropriate to exercise its discretion. If it is not
prepared to do so it should produce a copy of the Council resolution under
s15 (4) Greater London Council (General Powers ) Act 1974 showing the
extent of the footway parking exemptions applicable in Ashton Rd in order
to demonstrate that the bay markings correctly show the exempted area.

No further evidence or communication has been received from the Council.
In the circumstances I am unable to be satisfied that the vehicle was not
parked within an exempted area and the Appeal is therefore allowed.

Thank you @stamfordman

How about this?

Dear London Borough of Richmond upon Thames,

I am writing to formally challenge the Parking Charge Notice issued to my vehicle on 14 March 2025, on Wyndham Crescent.

On the day in question, I parked my car in a marked bay on the footpath. While I acknowledge that part of my vehicle was over the line of the footpath, the car was still within the length of the bay, leaving sufficient space for other vehicles to pass freely along the road.

I was surprised to receive this PCN because I have previously discussed this specific parking arrangement with the traffic warden who regularly monitors the road. He assured me that no ticket would be issued under such circumstances, as the road is quite narrow and this form of parking ensures better access. This indicates either a change in approach or that someone else was on duty that day.

Furthermore, the alleged contravention may have occurred because part of my vehicle was outside the designated markings. However, it is worth noting that the parking bay markings on Wyndham Crescent were in an extremely worn state at the time. Due to their faded appearance, it was genuinely difficult to discern the boundaries of the bay, which inadvertently led to the positioning error.

Regarding the alleged contravention itself, I believe the markings themselves do not establish permitted parking; rather, their purpose is to delineate areas prescribed under a resolution passed by the council, as stipulated under section 15(4) of the Greater London Council (General Powers) Act 1974. To confirm the validity of this PCN, I respectfully request that the council consult the relevant resolution to ensure that the markings comply with its provisions and that an actual contravention has occurred. I also request a copy of this resolution be provided should my appeal be rejected.

I ask that you take into account the mitigating factors outlined in this appeal. I have acted in good faith in relying on the advice of the traffic warden and have made every effort to park responsibly. Additionally, the unclear state of the bay markings further complicates the situation.

Thank you for taking the time to review my appeal. I trust that you will carefully consider the points raised, and I am hopeful for a positive resolution.

I don't get this bit:

While I acknowledge that part of my vehicle was over the line of the footpath, the car was still within the length of the bay, leaving sufficient space for other vehicles to pass freely along the road.