3. How can I appeal PCN with strong evidence, but no reason for out of time.
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How can I appeal PCN with strong evidence, but no reason for out of time.
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My situation:

- I received PCN over 1 year ago, but my car was cloned and I have STRONG evidence that it was not me (in picture its different model, mine was facelift)
- Initially I either ignored it or I did not receive it or I was on holiday, I cannot recall anymore.
- I tried to apply to TEC for out of time with "I did not receive PCN" without proof it was rejected, I remember I appealed when I was on holiday, after receiving call, but I still may have ignored first letter.
- I cannot reapply for out of time
- I contacted TEC and they told me all I can do is N244 form which will cost about £150 in fees, but how I understand it this form is for reappealing out of time which I probably don't have good reason, I don't remember its been over 1 year.

it states in the form: Please note: The District Judge/legal advisor will only consider the application to file the witness statement/Statutory Declaration out of time NOT to hear the case of the alleged traffic contravention.

- So despite having proof its completely different vehicle which I only noticed today (the resolution is so low, and its only facelift so its still similar) I think the only option I have is to pay £400 for PCN.
« Last Edit: July 02, 2024, 04:04:19 pm by deropke »
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Re: How can I appeal PCN with strong evidence, but no reason for out of time.
« Reply #1 on: »
If the debt is '£400', give or take a £ or two, then you've received 2 notices from enforcement agents, the first adding £75 to the penalty and the next a further £235.

So, you need to show us documents which you do have, specifically:

Your OOT submission;
The council's objection which would have been sent to you by post;
TEC's rejection;
The enforcement agent's Notice of Enforcement(adding £75);
Their subsequent notice adding a further £235.

You have 14 days following TEC's rejection in which to submit a N244.

We cannot advise sensibly without facts.

At present the issue is procedural and has nothing to do with the merits of the PCN.

Unless you've changed address since the contravention or your V5C was out of date as at the contravention then each of the above would have been sent to your current address.
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Re: How can I appeal PCN with strong evidence, but no reason for out of time.
« Reply #2 on: »
I remembered, so I received pcn at 03.2023, but I changed address at 12.2022 but never updated with dvla until I realised after not receiving V5C for new car which was roughly 06.2023, so all letters went to old address, the first time I was made aware is when enforcement agency called me during holiday at 08.2023, feeling pressured I quickly submitted TE7 and TE9 while still in holiday without sufficient time to gather supporting evidence, thus rejected. After rejection I got devastated and I thought I cant do anything anymore especially when at the time I had no evidence I was not the driver, now after realizing its completely different car I have good reason to pay money for N244
« Last Edit: July 02, 2024, 06:22:17 pm by deropke »
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Re: How can I appeal PCN with strong evidence, but no reason for out of time.
« Reply #3 on: »
I have good reason to pay money for N244

Why?

The merits of the contravention and your conviction that it was a different vehicle are not the issue as regards the OfR. You did not keep your V5C details current, neither did you put in place mail forwarding when you moved. As you received a PCN, this limits the matter to a parking contravention. In which case the sequence of notices is:

PCN
NTO
Charge Certificate
Order for Recovery
Notice of Enforcement.

IMO, you would be wasting your money with an N244, we need to look at your evidence. The council has to act fairly, but as you received the PCN did you challenge, if so with what evidence and why did the council reject?

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Re: How can I appeal PCN with strong evidence, but no reason for out of time.
« Reply #4 on: »
I never had ability to appeal directly to council, because I only found out about this PCN was 5 months later when it was already passed to enforcement agency, I called council and they told me its out of their hands now, you need to contact TEC. Which I did and I filled TE7 & TE9 saying "I never received PCN, I was not the driver and I want to appeal" but it was rejected, there was no reason given but its probably because I did not provide any evidence like wrong address after this I had 14 days for N244 but how it costed money and it sounded like even If I filled it it would be rejected again, I never did
« Last Edit: July 02, 2024, 07:25:22 pm by deropke »
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Re: How can I appeal PCN with strong evidence, but no reason for out of time.
« Reply #5 on: »
I remembered, so I received pcn at 03.2023,

I received PCN over 1 year ago,

OP, I cannot follow this.

The contravention involved a parking or moving traffic contravention?

The PCN was dated ****(not when you received it, but its date of service/issue)?

But of greater importance is the date of TEC's rejection.
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Re: How can I appeal PCN with strong evidence, but no reason for out of time.
« Reply #6 on: »
Sorry PCN was issued on 03.2023, it was driving in bus lane, I never received it. TEC rejection was long time ago now, I appealed 09/2023 so it must be in 2023 I dont have the letter anymore


Here are Key Events:


12/2023 Off hold no compensate
09/2023 Off hold no compensate
09/2023 On hold : STATUTORY DECLARATION RECEIVED
09/2023 On hold: CORRESPONDENCE RECEIVED
09/2023 Off hold compensate
09/2023 On hold: STAT DEC DUE FROM TEC (25/10/2023)
09/2023 Off hold no compensate
08/2023 On hold: CORRESPONDENCE RECEIVED
08/2023 Off hold compensate
08/2023 On hold: CORRESPONDENCE RECEIVED
07/2023 Exported to Enforcement Agent
07/2023 Warrant request accepted
06/2023 Warrant requested
05/2023 Order for Recovery Generated
05/2023 Debt registration accepted
05/2023 Off hold no compensate
05/2023 On hold: PRE DEBT LETTER (17/05/2023)
04/2023 Charge certificate Generated
03/2023 PCN printed

Im not sure if it matter but their current warrant expired and it must be for old address anyways, they threatened me tommorow 6am they will come to my house and remove goods, but TEC said their warrant expired. Is it even legal to send removal of goods within 24 hours when they don't have warrant ?
« Last Edit: July 02, 2024, 08:10:17 pm by deropke »
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Re: How can I appeal PCN with strong evidence, but no reason for out of time.
« Reply #7 on: »
There's a "READ THIS FIRST -" sticky post at the top of the forum. Please read it and follow the instructions

At the moment we don't even know which Council is the Enforcement Authority?

And why have you partially redacted all of the dates in the case progression history?

If the warrant was sealed in July 2023 then it may still be live, albeit the address may be wrong. If the bailiffs know your current address then it won't be long before the warrant is re-issued. And if your car is parked on a public street or car park then don't be surprised if you find it clamped.
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Re: How can I appeal PCN with strong evidence, but no reason for out of time.
« Reply #8 on: »
The timeline here is very odd.

TEC decision is 2023 therefore you are out of time to submit a N244 without it appears any extenuating reasons for late application. So IMO this route is closed to you.

You contacted the agents in 2023 and yet they have still not seized your goods.

IMO, your focus must be to:
Avoid further escalation of agents' fees;
Post evidence regarding mistaken identity of the cars;
Contact the authority for discretionary cancellation because the ultimate objective is that fairness should prevail.
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